76 replies to this topic

[Curccu]

Well maybe average IQ of planet earth got bit higher after those few strikes.

[Darko Nagasawa]

Here's another report from an (ex-)volunteer: https://archive.ph/hegbS (Edit: Another: https://archive.ph/FJ0sV ) Posting =/= endorsement, just posted because this topic was brought up. Interesting read in any case.

Edited by Darko Nagasawa, 16 March 2022 - 10:42 AM.

[LordNothing]

an untested virtue is as good as no virtue at all. i applaud them for putting their money where their mouth is, even though it got them killed.

[Red Komrade]

They don't get it that it is a trap ?
Russia already did that by allowing all the radical islamists go and join ISIS in Syria and then proceed to bomb them because it is obviously better to kill them far away from your country and minimize any chance of your citizens getting killed.
Now it is the same with in Ukraine with a gathering of a bunch of anti Russia extremists who will have the same fate as ISIS by getting bombed and exterminated.

Countries like US and Russia have the capacity to make a huge amount of rockets missiles and bombs and they can keep doing these small scale conflicts for a very long time. Usually there are more bombs/missiles produced compared to the amount of volunteers.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Please. They're making more extremists this way.

You can hate something all you like, but if you have a family and a good job, you're just going to grumble about it loudly. But if your wife gets killed by a bomb or your job site gets destroyed and you are out of work... you take action. Bombing hate only leads to more hate.

[Red Komrade]

Sure the war will continue but going there as a foreign volunteer doesnt help or sound less suicidal.

It is like being against the US invasion of Iraq and then just to show how real you are about it going there to join the Iraqi resistance only to get bombed by the US. You didnt make any kind of difference in the war maybe with your death some media will talk about foreign fighters but thats it.

By all means if you are against the war make some protests against it or help with some money for humanitarian aid for the civilians of these war-torn regions. But going there to get killed because you believed some twitter/reddit propaganda is just stupid.

[Darko Nagasawa]

I wonder what the Russian and Ukrainian MWO player population thinks. If I had to guess, I'd say the Russians are probably torn and the Ukrainians are probably offline.

[DemokratKRD]

Darko Nagasawa, on 17 March 2022 - 01:38 PM, said:

I wonder what the Russian and Ukrainian MWO player population thinks. If I had to guess, I'd say the Russians are probably torn and the Ukrainians are probably offline.

Easy. I myself went to Donetsk (four hours by car from my home in Russia) in 2019 only to find a capital of a 8-year old self-proclaimed republic being shelled with heavy artillery salvos. You know, when you look out of the window of a nine-storey building and see flashes at night, hear small arms fire and explosions etc. Curfews, food and water shortages, crippled infrastructure and people running away from all those war-time fun things - they've had it all for some time.

Everything about war is ugly. That was the first time I witnessed one myself from a distance. Nothing good in there for all sides.

The only difference between then and now is that three years ago foreign media had plenty of other conflicts to talk about. Nowadays it's different. But the whole thing was pretty much expected in one or another form for any able-minded witness of 2004 developments in Kiyv. Pretty dirty business, like any politics at any time, if you ask me.

[Cameron Highlander]

If you're looking for "on the ground" reporting, here is one: https://www.youtube....x6jMN5ZYgbqe2_w

I'd like other sources, if you have them. Do you own research, think for yourselves, don't be one of the sheeple.

[Darko Nagasawa]

I can share a couple of Telegram channels with you, if you want. But you'll do a lot of copying of video and photo descriptions into DeepL or Google Translate unless you can speak Russian. Still worth it if you are interested in frontline footage.

Both understandingwar.org and southfront.org have daily frontline reports mostly in text form. The former is pro-American (i.e. fiercely anti-Russian), the latter pro-Russian. I feel the former's tactical assessment is more accurate.

Edited by Darko Nagasawa, 24 April 2022 - 01:55 AM.

[Meep Meep]

I thought I had gotten used to all the propaganda and gaslighting due to these last few years of covid and other idiocy but the coverage of this war has gone so far off the hook its gotten to the point I don't know who or what to believe even from sources I have come to trust. All I know is that the narrative coming out isn't matching with what I am seeing from verified on the ground reports.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Well here's something believable... The Black Sea fleet is now down one flagship. The missile cruiser Moskva is confirmed sunk by Russia's state news agency.

https://www.cnn.com/...k-ml/index.html

Gotta watch those mysterious "totally wasn't a missile" fires breaking out on your ships, I guess.

Seriously though, prayers for the families of the crew.

Edit: and as an ominous aside, here’s part of her entry from hazegray.org. Not a good sign when foreign militaries note your lack of damage control capabilities 20 years before your demise… due to lack of damage control capability.

Concept/Program: A smaller contemporary to the Kirov class design; it has been speculated that this class was intended as a smaller, cheaper back-up to the larger ships. These are primarily surface strike ships but are well equipped for AAW and have some ASW capability. Generally thought to be deficient in damage control, but are fitted with very luxurious officers' accommodations.

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 14 April 2022 - 08:51 PM.

[Darko Nagasawa]

Russian/Soviet-era ships seem to be notorious for fire hazards. It doesn't need to be wartime, even during refit this has already happened. But in this case I also lean towards Ukrainian missiles due to several indications such as the Ukrainian side having claimed responsibility so quickly after the explosion. What's interesting to watch is whether the Russians will manage to capture the city of Nikolaev and Moskva's sister ship Ukraina moored there with it. 2022 satellite photos suggest it's still there.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Would there be any value in capturing it? Ukraina is still an unfinished hull, isn’t it?

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 17 April 2022 - 12:10 PM.

[Meep Meep]

With the range and lethalness of modern missiles there is going to be less value in shallow water navies because they won't be able to defend themselves from the types of missiles that can be launched from an inland land base which tend to be far more effective than the ship or air launched versions. Even modern US navy ships lack the missile defense to survive what can be tossed at them from land based missiles and why navy doctrine vs china is to stay as far away from their mainland as possible.

Now go figure that most russian ships even the most modern have far inferior ciw defenses and typically skimped on survivability for offensive punch. I'm actually surprised this didn't happen sooner.

[Darko Nagasawa]

ScrapIron Prime, on 17 April 2022 - 12:09 PM, said:

Would there be any value in capturing it? Ukraina is still an unfinished hull, isn’t it?

I also just have the figure of ~95% completion floating around the internet. Not sure if it would be worth it economically to refit such an old ship to modern standards seeing as Russia is currently building plenty of modern frigates. But the propaganda value is undeniable.

[Meep Meep]

Darko Nagasawa, on 17 April 2022 - 03:08 PM, said:

I also just have the figure of ~95% completion floating around the internet. Not sure if it would be worth it economically to refit such an old ship to modern standards seeing as Russia is currently building plenty of modern frigates. But the propaganda value is undeniable.

If it can launch long range missiles then it will have a place in the fleet. Even the US navy is holding onto older hulls simply for the extra throw weight they add in and have even refitted many hulls to hold even more missiles making them not much more survivable than this russian ship since the additional space used isn't as well protected.