28 replies to this topic

[Raging Owlbear]

So, I spent 1/2 the game running for caps. My team won because I was able to back-cap their drop point flag. I capped a couple sport all on my own was able to get back to the fight and score a little damage (not a lot, but enough to harass and distract).

We won on points with 3 mechs left. They had 5 or 6 still. I stayed alive.

My rating went down.

So basically, I went for the objectives, was able to harass at range, and kept the other team from winning, and I was penalized for it.

Now I don't care much about what tier I'm in, except that the lower tiers never use coms nor coordinate, so a player is better off racking up points and losing the objective, rather than trying to win.

What TF is the point of conquest if you punish players for trying to win, and why TF hasn't this issue been addressed already in a TEN YEAR OLD GAME? Why are lights still getting screwed and why don't get more bennies for capping which is their job?

[Maddermax]

Playing objectives doesn't get you many points no. But Conquest is still the best game mode in most maps (outside of massive ones, where capping without fighting is a possible win condition). It forces movement, means the fight isn't centred around a single zone, and splits mechs apart, so it's not just two death balls walking into each other. I will choose Conquest nearly every time it comes up, except for a couple of the largest maps.

The fact it doesn't reward you as a capping mech does suck though, and I think that should be addressed a bit. It doesn't have to give you massive rewards, it just has to make it so you're not shooting yourself in the foot because you're the only light on the team.

Edited by Maddermax, 24 June 2022 - 11:33 PM.

[Meep Meep]

I always lose psr when I'm running for caps as the others brawl around theta. I can sometimes salvage it if I can get in some damage but most times I'm too busy back capping. It is what it is I suppose so if it bothers you then don't cap and fight instead. You might lose the match but you should be able to keep or raise your psr.

[Knownswift]

Why are light mechs the only class in the game that have 5 jobs?

Capping isn't anymore a light mechs' job than it is any other class.

Try to pick up a 2 or 3 cap and then move on to combat. Spending the whole game back-capping is usually a detriment to your team, and if you don't believe me count up how many times you can remember winning just on caps.

[LordNothing]

i find conquest is like 80% brawl 20% cap. so long as you have at least 2, you buy enough time for the mechs to duke it out. 3 is a bit better as you can better dictate the cadence of the battle. its better than having to push before your ready because the clock is ticking faster.

Edited by LordNothing, 25 June 2022 - 12:24 PM.

[Gagis]

It takes a metric fuckton of luck to win if there are enemies left trying to prevent you from capping. As long as caps are roughly even-ish, its time to fight.

Conquest is the best mode, since it is most reliable in breaking stalemates and forcing engagements.

[w0qj]

Heard that the proposed MWO Comp 2022 format (August 2022?) might be Conquest Mode

Heard about this on Discord.

[ThreeStooges]

Any one can cap on conquest. This is how it goes in qp:
1. One or two mechs cap the nearest mechwood square. Often you find most don't even when they spawn right next to it.
2. Everyone minus the sole caper lemmings to theta which is normally the dead center of map.
3. Fight over theta.
4. 50/50 chance your team has massive losses on theta.
5. Sole capper is bitched at by every dead spectator for not capping faster/more?
6. Sole capper has 30% chance to win on caps depending on the points gained before step four.
7. Capper gets a mere ZERO xp and ONLY 100cp on a ticker for capping while being a free kill.
8. Capper dies. Gets crap score/rewards. Could have gotten better had they only done 200 dmg and single kill.

[LordNothing]

last conquest i played went something like this.

1. squirrels went kappa and theta (i was one of them, went theta)
2. other mech capped kappa, i found resistance at theta.
3. other mechs on the team proceeded to reverse nascar and avoid the 2 mechs at theta
4. i abandoned theta and rejoined group.
5. team continued to reverse nascar until they found themselves in a hole.
6. i continued to approach gamma, encountered too much resistance and backed off.
7. team continued to hide in hole, demand squirrels cap.
8. i said screw it and tried to back shoot a king crab, but his buddy, that i didnt see, killed me.
9. elsewhere else on the map the other squirrel died trying to cap.
10. team sat in hole until the clock ran out.

[PocketYoda]

For me conquest should be a conquest not a skirmish with five points.. You should be forced to capture and hold three points of the five the entire game.. If you fail both teams get lower cbills, That would split the teams in to three fire groups and need some tactics..


But no all anyone wants is skirmish.. because dps makes cbills.

Edited by Nomad Tech, 26 June 2022 - 05:58 PM.

[Kanil]

Lowering C-Bill payouts to force people to play the game the way you want it to be played will only affect those who play the game to farm C-Bills.

Changing the win conditions to force people to play the game the way you want it to be played will affect everyone.

Or in other words, if you want conquest to end in conquest, enable respawn.

[RickySpanish]

Raging Owlbear, on 24 June 2022 - 10:08 PM, said:

So, I spent 1/2 the game running for caps. My team won because I was able to back-cap their drop point flag. I capped a couple sport all on my own was able to get back to the fight and score a little damage (not a lot, but enough to harass and distract).

We won on points with 3 mechs left. They had 5 or 6 still. I stayed alive.

My rating went down.

So basically, I went for the objectives, was able to harass at range, and kept the other team from winning, and I was penalized for it.

Now I don't care much about what tier I'm in, except that the lower tiers never use coms nor coordinate, so a player is better off racking up points and losing the objective, rather than trying to win.

What TF is the point of conquest if you punish players for trying to win, and why TF hasn't this issue been addressed already in a TEN YEAR OLD GAME? Why are lights still getting screwed and why don't get more bennies for capping which is their job?

I am not sure communication changes much based on tier, it's pretty random and mostly mute. I think playing objective should award better. I don't know by how much, but the mechanism should be improved for certain. I would not say conquest is bad because of it though, since as you demonstrated, it's more or less the only game mode where playing the objective is feasible.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Knownswift, on 25 June 2022 - 12:03 PM, said:

Capping isn't anymore a light mechs' job than it is any other class.

It is mostly a light mech's job. The main bodies' job is effectively to deny caps to the enemy team by finding a spot to project firepower against all approaches to them (against pushes) and caps. Maybe having a medium split off to support lights at times. While the lights are pulling dual duty of scouting/capping, squeezing in either harassment or advantaged light fights. It does make lights a little more chaotic than normal because keeping up on caps adds some urgency to their movements more than if it were a fight like skirmish.

It pubs though honestly it should just come down to kills, most of the time because you dont really need to pressure engagements. You just need something to prevent a 30 minute match chasing down some light or fast medium that wants to waste everyone's time to kill 6 remaining mechs.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 26 June 2022 - 07:29 PM.

[LordNothing]

im just happy when people dont play like gandhi.

[C E Dwyer]

Conquest has never been popular, because it takes the ability to, quote Paul Charlton.

'Think and breath at the same time'

I remember when people said assault was a terrible mode.
because lights could cap out the match for a win.

They never said, because we were stupid and did nothing about it.

You can blame what passes for unicum players in this game, for being more interested in leader boards and personal scores, than bigger rewards for playing the objective, and winning in a team game.

Edited by C E Dwyer, 27 June 2022 - 01:48 AM.

[crazytimes]

The salty threads about dropping PSR make the ocassional cap loss worth it.

[Kanil]

C E Dwyer, on 27 June 2022 - 01:47 AM, said:

You can blame what passes for unicum players in this game, for being more interested in leader boards and personal scores, than bigger rewards for playing the objective, and winning in a team game.

I would suggest that standing in a square not being the most engaging gameplay probably plays a role in what modes people like, and how they play them.

If you make playing the objective fun and the best way to win, then people will definitely stand in the square, but that hasn't been done here yet.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Have to agree with the OP on this one. Capping in any game mode should provide more xp/cbills/match score. Sometimes you only win a match because a light capped the whole time. It is the win condition so winning by capping is a legitimate way to win the match.

[LordNothing]

Kanil, on 27 June 2022 - 10:39 AM, said:

I would suggest that standing in a square not being the most engaging gameplay probably plays a role in what modes people like, and how they play them.

If you make playing the objective fun and the best way to win, then people will definitely stand in the square, but that hasn't been done here yet.

the fun is not in standing in the squares, but duking it out for access to the squares. an uncontested square is quite a boring place to hang out. if you spend too much time standing in squares, then maybe you need to go join the heavier mechs in battle. a dead enemy cannot cap.

[JC Daxion]

Raging Owlbear, on 24 June 2022 - 10:08 PM, said:

So, I spent 1/2 the game running for caps. My team won because I was able to back-cap their drop point flag. I capped a couple sport all on my own was able to get back to the fight and score a little damage (not a lot, but enough to harass and distract).

We won on points with 3 mechs left. They had 5 or 6 still. I stayed alive.

My rating went down.

So basically, I went for the objectives, was able to harass at range, and kept the other team from winning, and I was penalized for it.

Now I don't care much about what tier I'm in, except that the lower tiers never use coms nor coordinate, so a player is better off racking up points and losing the objective, rather than trying to win.

What TF is the point of conquest if you punish players for trying to win, and why TF hasn't this issue been addressed already in a TEN YEAR OLD GAME? Why are lights still getting screwed and why don't get more bennies for capping which is their job?

Well your playing the mode wrong.. The team needs 3 caps to win, and protecting a cap is far more effective than running to the other side of the map to flip one. All that time you spend flipping it is time it's spent running for the other person.

Try protecting your cap from enemy lights, verse running around like an idiot doing nothing but capping. The best way to win conquest is to take down that enemy capper that comes to flip your cap, that so often the team just abandons and lets them take it. Try killing that guy, you saved your cap, and took down the other teams effective cap flipper, so you just went ahead on numbers, and you maintained the cap lead.


You may think what your doing is playing the objective of flipping caps, It's not. It's to let the team know where folks are so they can protect their caps they already have, and help kill the fast guys that are charging to flip your typical first cap.

Edited by JC Daxion, 27 June 2022 - 02:50 PM.