53 replies to this topic

[caravann]

They thought I was going to shoot back but battlemaster don't give the quack about it
and instead let me introduce to the ballad of death.

Where I shield with the arms while you spin around and the team shoot in the rear.

[martian]

1453 R, on 18 September 2022 - 08:10 AM, said:

Proposal: play the Vapor Eagle like a god damn Vapor Eagle instead of a trundling assault bloatboat with an engine dropping it below 50kph movement speed.
...

As long as a half of the player's Match Score is based on the damage dished out, people will probably prioritize firepower over speed. I guess that this could be one of the reasons why fast light or medium 'Mechs with lots of speed and limited firepower are relatively rare in MWO.

[Curccu]

martian, on 24 September 2022 - 01:40 AM, said:

As long as a half of the player's Match Score is based on the damage dished out, people will probably prioritize firepower over speed. I guess that this could be one of the reasons why fast light or medium 'Mechs with lots of speed and limited firepower are relatively rare in MWO.

That kind of lights need a lot of skill to stay in combat whole match without dying... while doing that pew pew most of the game.

[martian]

Curccu, on 24 September 2022 - 03:35 AM, said:

That kind of lights need a lot of skill to stay in combat whole match without dying... while doing that pew pew most of the game.

Exactly.

[1453 R]

And yet in the current Therma Event Queue game, where people are playing Conquest? Every first-wave drop is dominated by light and medium 'Mechs that spread out and play an intense game of cap trading. It's tremendously more fun than "Moron's Bumrush to Theta and see if anybody cares about the other points", and proves that when covering ground and taking objectives matters, the mobility of lighter platforms becomes much more essential.

[martian]

1453 R, on 24 September 2022 - 09:36 AM, said:

And yet in the current Therma Event Queue game, where people are playing Conquest? Every first-wave drop is dominated by light and medium 'Mechs that spread out and play an intense game of cap trading. It's tremendously more fun than "Moron's Bumrush to Theta and see if anybody cares about the other points", and proves that when covering ground and taking objectives matters, the mobility of lighter platforms becomes much more essential.

I believe that the Quick Play queue is still the primary MWO venue.

[1453 R]

martian, on 24 September 2022 - 10:06 AM, said:

I believe that the Quick Play queue is still the primary MWO venue.

Yes. My point is that any game mode not named "Conquest" should be done away with, because the whole "nothing but damage matters so pilot the biggest, dumbest, meme-est assault gunbag bloatboat you can" bit is a stranglehold on this game. Want to see "fast light and medium 'Mechs with lots of speed and limited firepower"? Get rid of dumba@# game modes where nothing but blowing up the enemy matters.

Comp's eliminated everything but Conquest for multiple years running now, and comp games tend to heavily feature high-mobility units to contest capture points. Yes, comp teams also have gunbags, but those gunbags are treated as what they are - unmatched firepower, overmatched literally everything else. For every Annihilator you see up there, you also get at least one Commando, Flea, or Black Lanner. Hell, the Black Lanner is well known as one of the most dangerous fast attack/pursuit units in the game simply because it has light 'Mech speed mated to enough armor to actually engage a target and withstand some counterfire.

Hell, I played comp last year (if as one of the "let's have fun and earn a fat prize package!" teams rather than a serious entrant) and did so almost exclusively in a dagger-fighter Black Lanner. My speed and ability to bully anything much smaller than a Timber Wolf in close-quarters combat meant that not only could I secure cap points, I could contest/defend them. I could not only take a cap point, I could force someone else off of one, and my team won pretty comfortably against any other "let's have fun and score prizes!" team we came up against due to heavy cap advantage.

Tactics change dramatically when you know that overgunned, under-engined stompy gunbags will not do the trick. An increase in fast units, as well as an emphasis on engaging on multiple points of the map, would both do more than any amount of weapon nerfs ever could to quell the whole 'snipers are bulls@#$!!" thing.

[martian]

1453 R, on 24 September 2022 - 11:10 AM, said:

Yes. My point is that any game mode not named "Conquest" should be done away with, because the whole "nothing but damage matters so pilot the biggest, dumbest, meme-est assault gunbag bloatboat you can" bit is a stranglehold on this game. Want to see "fast light and medium 'Mechs with lots of speed and limited firepower"? Get rid of dumba@# game modes where nothing but blowing up the enemy matters.

Conquest has never been as popular as Skirmish or Assault. From what I have seen, people vote against Conquest when choosing the game mode.

PGI can not afford to piss off the majority of MWO player base and force them into playing a game mode that they do not like, even though you would prefer to see it that way.

1453 R, on 24 September 2022 - 11:10 AM, said:

Comp's eliminated everything but Conquest for multiple years running now, and comp games tend to heavily feature high-mobility units to contest capture points. Yes, comp teams also have gunbags, but those gunbags are treated as what they are - unmatched firepower, overmatched literally everything else. For every Annihilator you see up there, you also get at least one Commando, Flea, or Black Lanner. Hell, the Black Lanner is well known as one of the most dangerous fast attack/pursuit units in the game simply because it has light 'Mech speed mated to enough armor to actually engage a target and withstand some counterfire.

Hell, I played comp last year (if as one of the "let's have fun and earn a fat prize package!" teams rather than a serious entrant) and did so almost exclusively in a dagger-fighter Black Lanner. My speed and ability to bully anything much smaller than a Timber Wolf in close-quarters combat meant that not only could I secure cap points, I could contest/defend them. I could not only take a cap point, I could force someone else off of one, and my team won pretty comfortably against any other "let's have fun and score prizes!" team we came up against due to heavy cap advantage.

In my opinion the groups are a minority part of the MWO player base and the competetive groups are the minority in this minority.

1453 R, on 24 September 2022 - 11:10 AM, said:

Tactics change dramatically when you know that overgunned, under-engined stompy gunbags will not do the trick. An increase in fast units, as well as an emphasis on engaging on multiple points of the map, would both do more than any amount of weapon nerfs ever could to quell the whole 'snipers are bulls@#$!!" thing.

From what I have seen in MWO, many players actually prefer piloting powerful 'Mechs with a lot of weapons before piloting fast lights and mediums.

[Brizna]

People like Skirmish and Domination, because most people come to MWO in the evening to vent steam off and relax, a session of nascaring around, preferably with friends, with your brain just half turned on is perfect for that.

On the other hand, coordinating drops, giving orders, reacting to the enemy's moves, it's a great experience if you are in the mood but honestly much of the time we are not.

What is clear is that if you really want a tactical environment the best game mode we have in MWO is CONQUEST. It forces you to spread your forces, to control fire lines, it allows you to send faster units to turn the tide and every time you do so you are putting your assets at risk while the clock is ticking, because the {LT-MOB-25} is always ticking in someone's favour.

[Meep Meep]

I hate conquest because in quick play it always devolves into a brawl somewhere and if I go to do the objectives and cap I'm not dealing damage or assists. So if I play the objectives I typically lose psr and even lose the match because the enemy team concentrated forces and wiped out my team as I and others run around capping when I might have made a difference in the brawl. Sure sometimes you win on last man standing caps but thats rare and typically only when there are a few slow mechs left on the other side. The only two modes I like at this point are skirmish and assault as it allows for something other than ring around the rosy domination fights.

[martian]

Meep Meep, on 26 September 2022 - 01:50 PM, said:

I hate conquest because in quick play it always devolves into a brawl somewhere and if I go to do the objectives and cap I'm not dealing damage or assists. So if I play the objectives I typically lose psr and even lose the match because the enemy team concentrated forces and wiped out my team as I and others run around capping when I might have made a difference in the brawl. Sure sometimes you win on last man standing caps but thats rare and typically only when there are a few slow mechs left on the other side. The only two modes I like at this point are skirmish and assault as it allows for something other than ring around the rosy domination fights.

I hate to say it, but it seems that you have chosen the wrong tactics.

The enemy team, on the other hand, chose the correct tactics which can be attested by the fact that they won the game.

[Meep Meep]

martian, on 26 September 2022 - 08:42 PM, said:

I hate to say it, but it seems that you have chosen the wrong tactics.

The enemy team, on the other hand, chose the correct tactics which can be attested by the fact that they won the game.

Which is why after getting one cap point up I go and start reaming out rear ct. Plenty of time to cap after you wipe the other team. I was simply pointing out that if you play the objectives more often than not you will lose psr and the match and that I hate the mode because some players never rejoin the fight and play musical caps.

[Curccu]

Meep Meep, on 26 September 2022 - 11:05 PM, said:

Which is why after getting one cap point up I go and start reaming out rear ct. Plenty of time to cap after you wipe the other team. I was simply pointing out that if you play the objectives more often than not you will lose psr and the match and that I hate the mode because some players never rejoin the fight and play musical caps.

Usually it is best tactic to slay the enemy and then cap, even if you lose you get some matchscore & CB

[martian]

Meep Meep, on 26 September 2022 - 11:05 PM, said:

Which is why after getting one cap point up I go and start reaming out rear ct. Plenty of time to cap after you wipe the other team. I was simply pointing out that if you play the objectives more often than not you will lose psr and the match and that I hate the mode because some players never rejoin the fight and play musical caps.

Curccu, on 26 September 2022 - 11:50 PM, said:

Usually it is best tactic to slay the enemy and then cap, even if you lose you get some matchscore & CB

Running around alone or in pairs is often the worst tactics. Such players then meet some enemy group of four or five 'Mechs and they are quickly killed off. The enemy team gains the numerical advantage and quickly recaps the lost base(s).