40 replies to this topic

[Kynesis]

I'm really tired of games utterly dominated by sniping and laser vom. It's not interesting, it's not engaging, it bypasses most of the game's features - halving mechs & TTK's measured in "LOLs" and "SIT DOWN!".
I can't count the number of times that I've seen lower tier players casually and thoughtlessly sliced and diced by people with meta builds, shooting from unassailable positions far beyond most weapon ranges, not to mention organised teams snowballing wins by effortlessly picking off a few low tier players, thanks to the magic of soup queue.

There's nothing I can do about the elites incandescent contempt for everyone else. Go ahead and dogpile me with "git gud", it only further illustrates the point.

I'm taking the time to write this post (and suffer the inevitable indignities that will be heaped upon me) in the vain hope that PGI attempt some consideration to just how one-sided and shallow the game has become.

Top tier players aren't the only people who play this game, even if they are the loudest voices.

[JediPanther]

Maybe if they quit nerfing all the other weapons we could use more than who has highest laser alpha online warrior.

[martian]

Kynesis, on 07 October 2023 - 04:50 PM, said:

I'm really tired of games utterly dominated by sniping and laser vom. It's not interesting, it's not engaging, it bypasses most of the game's features - halving mechs & TTK's measured in "LOLs" and "SIT DOWN!".
I can't count the number of times that I've seen lower tier players casually and thoughtlessly sliced and diced by people with meta builds, shooting from unassailable positions far beyond most weapon ranges, not to mention organised teams snowballing wins by effortlessly picking off a few low tier players, thanks to the magic of soup queue.

There's nothing I can do about the elites incandescent contempt for everyone else. Go ahead and dogpile me with "git gud", it only further illustrates the point.

I'm taking the time to write this post (and suffer the inevitable indignities that will be heaped upon me) in the vain hope that PGI attempt some consideration to just how one-sided and shallow the game has become.

Top tier players aren't the only people who play this game, even if they are the loudest voices.

Do not be surprised if you get some of these following replies:

1) "Git Gud!"

2) "Sniping is not a problem!"

3) "Sniping does not exist in the game or is extremely rare!" (Every time you see him in the game, he is in Assault sniper 'Mech parked near the edge of the map and sniping.)

3) "Sniping should be supported because it requires a very high skill!!" (It requires taking his 100-ton ECM Assault on the nearest hill, parking it there for the rest of the game and clicking on barely visible black blobs a few hundred metres away)

4) "Take your brawling 'Mech and get close to that sniper!" (It would mean not contributing to your team's effort for about five minutes, while that enemy sniper dishes out damage every ten seconds. And when you finally get there, you will be facing a fresh assault 'Mech that has a pair of Gauss Rifles that hit almost as hard as a pair of AC-20s - not counting lasers and ER PPCs, of course).

5) "You are T5, 4 or 3. Learn to play! Learn to snipe! If you are not having fun in this meta, it is your problem!" (Tiers 5, 4 and 3 are actually the largest part of the player base. If somebody should feel happy, it is these guys.)

6) "Create your own premade."

7) "We give PGI the relevant feedback!"

Edited by martian, 08 October 2023 - 12:01 AM.

[Samziel]

I do think long range weapons are annoying and too good (below the top 5% at least). There is gonna be a cDHS nerf next patch later this year which does help a little. But positioning yourself or moving accordingly to snipers is important to learn regardless of them being OP or not. I don't like getting shot from 1k away but I rarely have issues on playing against them.

Midrange I dont think laservomit is too powerful. They're already quite hot so if you push them they have issues. But it is very effective playstyle and thats why its very popular. And it (clan vomit) also gets nerfed with the cDHS. Important counterplay is torso twisting. Way often I see someone just staring at the enemy taking all the damage to single component.

With this I don't mean git gud. These are simple things that help and dont require you to be top tier to learn.

martian, on 07 October 2023 - 11:59 PM, said:

5) "You are T5, 4 or 3. Learn to play! Learn to snipe! If you are not having fun in this meta, it is your problem!" (Tiers 5, 4 and 3 are actually the largest part of the player base. If somebody should feel happy, it is these guys.)

While I don't advocate for the game to be balanced around lower tiers I think it needs to be taken into account sometimes. We are gonna get HAG buffs next patch which might not be terrible at high tiers but I do fear the playerbase might take a hit if low tiers become unfun to play. Hopefully not but I feel like big portion of the playerbase is already fed up with HAGs.

Edited by Samziel, 09 October 2023 - 04:07 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

martian, on 07 October 2023 - 11:59 PM, said:

Do not be surprised if you get some of these following replies:

Welcome to MWO.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 08 October 2023 - 02:59 AM.

[CFC Conky]

@OP,

MWO can be extremely frustrating at times. I will often get into a losing streak where every game is a sniper-filled stomp which leaves me swearing at my monitor. Other times I will have a good run and have a lot of fun. Also, I'm also more effective in certain mechs and the quality of my games suffers when I take something else out for a spin. Skilling up new mechs can be frustrating as well.

At some point you have to decide whether or not the juice is worth the squeeze. It is for me, despite the cycles of frustration that occur.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

Edited by CFC Conky, 08 October 2023 - 07:48 AM.

[Vamboozle]

I have to agree - the ERLL, ERPPC, Gauss sniping spam is starting to get a bit tedious.

Yes it’s occasionally fun when you can get in amongst them is an HMG armed light or an SRM brawler but it is getting tiresome spending match after match being shot at from the other side of map.

[Novakaine]

As long as the Blue Flashlight Gang has control this will be the state of the game.
Personal get a Creal or a Scaleshot and go hunt them down I say.
Time to make them an endangered species.

Edited by Novakaine, 08 October 2023 - 08:35 AM.

[Duke Falcon]

martian, on 07 October 2023 - 11:59 PM, said:

Do not be surprised if you get some of these following replies:

1) "Git Gud!"

2) "Sniping is not a problem!"

3) "Sniping does not exist in the game or is extremely rare!" (Every time you see him in the game, he is in Assault sniper 'Mech parked near the edge of the map and sniping.)

3) "Sniping should be supported because it requires a very high skill!!" (It requires taking his 100-ton ECM Assault on the nearest hill, parking it there for the rest of the game and clicking on barely visible black blobs a few hundred metres away)

4) "Take your brawling 'Mech and get close to that sniper!" (It would mean not contributing to your team's effort for about five minutes, while that enemy sniper dishes out damage every ten seconds. And when you finally get there, you will be facing a fresh assault 'Mech that has a pair of Gauss Rifles that hit almost as hard as a pair of AC-20s - not counting lasers and ER PPCs, of course).

5) "You are T5, 4 or 3. Learn to play! Learn to snipe! If you are not having fun in this meta, it is your problem!" (Tiers 5, 4 and 3 are actually the largest part of the player base. If somebody should feel happy, it is these guys.)

6) "Create your own premade."

7) "We give PGI the relevant feedback!"

Answers should be these at any given time and by any means (learn by heart, would help your inner zen a lot):
1: Ur mother said eeeexactly that, bro!

2: Not if that sniper rifle is in MY HANDS!!!

3: Just like Firemoths and spheroid omnimechs! Just wanna know UR dealer's number 'cause ye use sum serious drugz, right?

4: Let me introduce you the ARROW IV!!! CHEERZ, f@**0tz!

5: You cry over the forums about lights and LRMs, bro! You need to learn a lot not us! Oh, and yer kind call'd me cheater 'cause I faceb@shed ye'll?!? Tee-he-he!

6: I would. But I know where you lives! Let's see how brave ye may personally...

7: Relevant feedback iz mah evah growin' ***! But if U like U may kiss it!

8: Waaaaiiit, there were no point 8, right?

And every sane person knows: This game should not have anything else but LRMs and ER-PPCs! Everything else is non-meta, low-tier, un-git gud and skill-deprived stuffs! Oh, and Lights are OP of course...


...



MWO in a nutshell..?

Edited by Duke Falcon, 08 October 2023 - 10:19 AM.

[Tarl Cabot]

Wait.. gripping about being sniped out while 90% of the players zombie into the middle of the map instead of being prepared to move to said sniper target, especially if said sniper/long range platform has no backup?

As for the Soup queue, it is either a feast or famine, depending on the group you end up with. Even mediocre players can put the hurt on someone if there are 3-4 of them FOCUSING on one mech, and not turn and run away when the paint gets scratched. That is the real difference between playing loosely like a unit vs playing like someone who plays like they are the only PC and everyone else is a NPC.

And Sniping/long range/overwatch has its uses too. It will either force the other team to move away/seek cover instead of returning fire, either at the sniper or that sniper's team.

As for the Soup queue, imho, most groups do not try every hard, they are here for the same reason as all of us, to blow up mechs but in a PVP environment. Yes, they can do that with MW5, but ithat s really boring. MW5 has its place, and there are a ton of aspects of it that I wished was in MWO but for myself, MW5 is not able to replace MWO.

And even before the Soup queue merge, games still had people who would ACTUALLY work together in the Solo queue, and there would still be wipes, snowballing was real back as it is today. MWO didnt get in-game Voip until early 2015, a few months after CW/FP finally went live in Dec 2014.

As for meta, players do not need to have a meta loadup, but they also cannot ignore those loadouts either while staying away from stock load ups, especially IS. As part of a group which has synergy while boating a purely LRM loadout can work well, but dropping as a pug without backup weapons is madness while expecting to drop with a workable team. Most games are won/lost in the mechlab, followed how the team that you drop with works together, or not.

[Dr Wubs]

Novakaine, on 08 October 2023 - 08:34 AM, said:

As long as the Blue Flashlight Gang has control this will be the state of the game.
Personal get a Creal or a Scaleshot and go hunt them down I say.
Time to make them an endangered species.

You know what was really good for that? The Viper-F. A loyalty mech.

Then guess what happened to it?

Lots of sobbing by the sniper camping set, and then it got nerfed into mediocrity.

Watch Data's regular videos about how any light that disturbs his sniping (with 3 back armor no less) is cancer.

[Mechropanzer]

Dr Wubs, on 08 October 2023 - 02:12 PM, said:

You know what was really good for that? The Viper-F. A loyalty mech.

Then guess what happened to it?

Lots of sobbing by the sniper camping set, and then it got nerfed into mediocrity.

Watch Data's regular videos about how any light that disturbs his sniping (with 3 back armor no less) is cancer.

I have to agree with everything you just said. Very spot on.

[Ihlrath]

Dr Wubs, on 08 October 2023 - 02:12 PM, said:

You know what was really good for that? The Viper-F. A loyalty mech.

Then guess what happened to it?

Lots of sobbing by the sniper camping set, and then it got nerfed into mediocrity.

Watch Data's regular videos about how any light that disturbs his sniping (with 3 back armor no less) is cancer.

Cheers to you sir. This is the most accurate post I've read all day.

Also to the OP.... sorry man some of us have been fed up with the ERLL, ERPPC, and Gauss BS for about a year and a half and you know what they did? The buffed ERLL, ERPPC, and Gauss about a half dozen times in that time frame. They did give us a good mech for hunting snipers, but it costs you real money which some people don't have/can't spend.... and the absolute crying and foot kicking fits we've seen about the Scaleshot on the forums by those same snipers that love ruining your day has been nothing less than satisfying.... though they did get a bit of a nerf out of it.

[kalashnikity]

You just have to accept the situation you get dropped into, and work with it.

In real life, wars/fights are not fair.

There will never be a "fair" game, and rarely will both sides be balanced with players of equal skill or mech builds, or tonnage.

Adapt and overcome, or die.

That is part of what makes this game fun.

If you want to make a difference, well, it's a team game, communicate more. That doesn't always work, often times literally nobody will communicate, or maybe only one or two, but sometimes that makes all the difference.

[The6thMessenger]

JediPanther, on 07 October 2023 - 09:59 PM, said:

Maybe if they quit nerfing all the other weapons we could use more than who has highest laser alpha online warrior.

More like, they should reign in the outgoing damage. The survivability quirks are getting ridiculous to compensate.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Gauss/laser vomit was only fun when it was pretty much just me doing it most games.


Now literally every whale i see has 2 hags and a metric buttload of lasers slapped on it.

[PurplePuke]

OP, is there a long list of combat games where you can stand out in the open, instead of in cover, and not expect to get shot at by the enemy? By snipers?

I can't think of any, and I don't want MWO to become one.

[Widowmaker1981]

Playing from cover is a result of indestructible terrain combined with fixed health pools that don't regenerate and no re-spawns. It doesn't matter what stats you give to what weapons, as long as there is invincible scenery, people will use it to do damage without receiving any in return.

You can alter the balance between weapon types, but you wont change that basic fact without changing one of the variables (a future game engine with realistically destructible scenery would be amazing)

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Widowmaker1981, on 09 October 2023 - 12:44 PM, said:

You can alter the balance between weapon types, but you wont change that basic fact without changing one of the variables (a future game engine with realistically destructible scenery would be amazing)

Learning from CS, destructible environment only helps so far, utility however to either weaken/force opponents out of strong positions or utility to allow approaches against stronger positions go far. For example smokes/molotovs are often used to either wall off approaches or to deny/blind areas while flashes allow for safer approaches while grenades allow you to punish those sitting in strong positions.

That's the part of Mechwarrior that has been missing, utility. Missiles aren't good for that because they require spotters. Strikes are better but because they are limited and are also a c-bill tax it's a bit rough (also arty spam is obnoxious when its 12v12 compared to 5v5 like CS).

Wallbangs or penetration of part of the environment would probably help as well and be much less computationally expensive.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 09 October 2023 - 12:51 PM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 October 2023 - 12:50 PM, said:

Learning from CS, destructible environment only helps so far,

I think it would probably make more difference in a mech game due to the much larger health pools involved?