29 replies to this topic

[M1ndph4s3r]

Hi everyone, I need to vent my anger today because what's been going on since the 8vs8 is really not good anymore. If PGI is going to open up matchmaking so that tier 1-3 players have to fight against tier 4-5 pilots, then please close the damage cap that low tier pilots have. I fought my way up to tier 3 by the 8vs8... but since the 8vs8 I've been losing nothing but because I have to fight against tier 1-3 pilots and my mech builds do little to no damage to them... They, in turn, do so much damage to my mechs that I'm usually on a crit torso after one hit and am therefore of little to no help to my team. But that's not even the worst part...it seems like the new mechs and loot bag event have lied to a lot of old and new players...I mean, OK, it livens up the game, but the matchmaking itself is more broken than ever...either you get top players on your team and then chase after damage, or you're unlucky and get a bad team and don't do any damage because after 3 minutes you're alone surrounded by 5 enemy mechs...so my request to PGI is to fix the matchmaking system and this damage cap between the tiers...that's it for me for now...I just deleted MWO from my hard drive...with that in mind, have a great rest of the week everyone!

[epikt]

There would be thing to say about how weird tier 3 can be to some players doing ok in low tier lobbies do learning the hard truth when they finally meet good enough opponents. Or about the experiments and monitoring with the matchmaking that are currently underway.

But those points would be moot until we explain something apparently confusing you: What exactly do you mean by "the damage cap that low tier pilots have" ?

The only reason better players are dealing higher damage than you is because they are better: better positioning, better aim, better builds, etc.
New players and those unable to perform well are kinda protected from them thanks to the tier system, but if you go up in tiers you'll eventually face them.

[martian]

R3pl1c4nt, on 20 August 2025 - 01:36 PM, said:

please close the damage cap that low tier pilots have. I fought my way up to tier 3 by the 8vs8... but since the 8vs8 I've been losing nothing but because I have to fight against tier 1-3 pilots and my mech builds do little to no damage to them... They, in turn, do so much damage to my mechs that I'm usually on a crit torso after one hit and am therefore of little to no help to my team. But that's not even the worst part... this damage cap between the tiers...

There is literally no damage cap between the Tiers.

All weapons do exactly the same amount of damage per shot, no matter if used by a Tier 1 player or a Tier 5 player. If I fire Gauss rifle, it does 15 points of damage, just as if a freshly registered Tier 5 player would fired it.

[M1ndph4s3r]

I'm referring to the "unofficial" damage bonus-penalty that exists. Weapons do slightly more damage per tier level than at tier 5. I once tested this with a friend. I was tier 5 at the time, and he was tier 1. We both used the exact same 'Mech with the same weapons and skill tree. He did about 10-15% more damage to my 'Mech with the ERLarge lasers, while I did almost 18% less damage with my weapons of the same type...we both targeted the torso, and the armor was the same. So there must be either a penalty to weapon damage or a bonus to armor at tier levels.

[epikt]

R3pl1c4nt, on 21 August 2025 - 11:01 AM, said:

I'm referring to the "unofficial" damage bonus-penalty that exists. Weapons do slightly more damage per tier level than at tier 5. I once tested this with a friend. I was tier 5 at the time, and he was tier 1. We both used the exact same 'Mech with the same weapons and skill tree. He did about 10-15% more damage to my 'Mech with the ERLarge lasers, while I did almost 18% less damage with my weapons of the same type...we both targeted the torso, and the armor was the same. So there must be either a penalty to weapon damage or a bonus to armor at tier levels.

Sorry, but I'll need to see footage before I believe that.

[Tiy0s]

The matchmaker will prioritize matching you with players in your tier. However, in times of lower population/longer search times, tier gates may start to gradually open. It won't immediately open with the flood gates of tier 1s coming into matches with tier 5s, the search times have to get pretty dire for the matchmaker to reach that contingency. Another note is that it will still attempt to accurately balance players on each side. If it does put tier 1s and 4s in the same match, it won't put all the tier 1 players on one side and all the tier 4 players on the other side. The game will attempt to equally distribute players by tier in an attempt to ensure the match has a fair outcome, regardless of the skill disparity between top and bottom player in the lobby.

There is no mechanic that changes the amount of damage your mechs do or health they have based on your skill level. All players have the same mechs, weapons, and equipment at their disposal. Where higher tier players may end up having an advantage is more optimally built mechs or skill trees. But that is a disparity driven by player choice, not some secret stat that reads your tier to decide how effective you are.

We do not buff/nerf players based on skill ratings. Players earn their tier by their gameplay.

[KursedVixen]

R3pl1c4nt, on 21 August 2025 - 11:01 AM, said:

I'm referring to the "unofficial" damage bonus-penalty that exists. Weapons do slightly more damage per tier level than at tier 5. I once tested this with a friend. I was tier 5 at the time, and he was tier 1. We both used the exact same 'Mech with the same weapons and skill tree. He did about 10-15% more damage to my 'Mech with the ERLarge lasers, while I did almost 18% less damage with my weapons of the same type...we both targeted the torso, and the armor was the same. So there must be either a penalty to weapon damage or a bonus to armor at tier levels.

are you sure you both used the same skill tree nodes? the same exact weapons? the exact same mechs?

Edited by KursedVixen, 21 August 2025 - 08:49 PM.

[M1ndph4s3r]

KursedVixen, on 21 August 2025 - 08:47 PM, said:

are you sure you both used the same skill tree nodes? the same exact weapons? the exact same mechs?

YES! We sent each other the skill tree and the mech config as code and used it.

[epikt]

R3pl1c4nt, on 22 August 2025 - 09:47 AM, said:

YES! We sent each other the skill tree and the mech config as code and used it.

I still wonder how you made your little experiment.
I also wonder why you persist in your conspiracies even after Tiyos' post.
Until I know more about your protocol, see the footage and data, the safe assumption will be that you conducted it wrongly and/or were not able to correctly interpret the results.

[martian]

R3pl1c4nt, on 21 August 2025 - 11:01 AM, said:

He did about 10-15% more damage to my 'Mech ... I did almost 18% less damage with my weapons of the same type...

How did you arrive to those exact numbers?

[M1ndph4s3r]

Tiy0s, on 21 August 2025 - 01:38 PM, said:

The matchmaker will prioritize matching you with players in your tier. However, in times of lower population/longer search times, tier gates may start to gradually open. It won't immediately open with the flood gates of tier 1s coming into matches with tier 5s, the search times have to get pretty dire for the matchmaker to reach that contingency. Another note is that it will still attempt to accurately balance players on each side. If it does put tier 1s and 4s in the same match, it won't put all the tier 1 players on one side and all the tier 4 players on the other side. The game will attempt to equally distribute players by tier in an attempt to ensure the match has a fair outcome, regardless of the skill disparity between top and bottom player in the lobby.

There is no mechanic that changes the amount of damage your mechs do or health they have based on your skill level. All players have the same mechs, weapons, and equipment at their disposal. Where higher tier players may end up having an advantage is more optimally built mechs or skill trees. But that is a disparity driven by player choice, not some secret stat that reads your tier to decide how effective you are.

We do not buff/nerf players based on skill ratings. Players earn their tier by their gameplay.

If the matchmaker really worked the way you say...then I wonder how games like yesterday on Solaris could happen. My team had two Assault Mechs, but the enemy had four. And the first Assault on my team was disconnected...I don't need to mention how the battle turned out...

[M1ndph4s3r]

martian, on 22 August 2025 - 09:55 PM, said:

How did you arrive to those exact numbers?

We formed a group and entered a game together. Then we shot at different parts of each other's mechs (friendly fire) and then, based on the percentage numbers, saw how much more or less damage I did to the mech.

[epikt]

R3pl1c4nt, on 26 August 2025 - 02:54 AM, said:

If the matchmaker really worked the way you say...then I wonder how games like yesterday on Solaris could happen. My team had two Assault Mechs, but the enemy had four. And the first Assault on my team was disconnected...I don't need to mention how the battle turned out...

Hum... nowhere in Tiyos' post there is mention of balancing mech classes...
His post was about balancing players' tiers.

R3pl1c4nt, on 26 August 2025 - 02:57 AM, said:

We formed a group and entered a game together. Then we shot at different parts of each other's mechs (friendly fire) and then, based on the percentage numbers, saw how much more or less damage I did to the mech.

Dos not sound very scientific...

[Tesunie]

R3pl1c4nt, on 26 August 2025 - 02:57 AM, said:

We formed a group and entered a game together. Then we shot at different parts of each other's mechs (friendly fire) and then, based on the percentage numbers, saw how much more or less damage I did to the mech.

Have you ever heard of private lobbies? Could have done this testing without hindering a live match...

Could have also taken each build into the testing ground for much the same effect... Nice stationary targets to hit there, and they wont move or complain.

[KursedVixen]

Tesunie, on 26 August 2025 - 09:53 AM, said:

Have you ever heard of private lobbies? Could have done this testing without hindering a live match...

Could have also taken each build into the testing ground for much the same effect... Nice stationary targets to hit there, and they wont move or complain.

Don't quote me on this but i think Private lobbies require premium time...

[epikt]

KursedVixen, on 27 August 2025 - 04:51 AM, said:

Don't quote me on this but i think Private lobbies require premium time...

There was a time where some lobby functionalities required premium time, but not anymore.

[T Hawk]

Tiy0s, on 21 August 2025 - 01:38 PM, said:

The matchmaker will prioritize matching you with players in your tier. However, in times of lower population/longer search times, tier gates may start to gradually open. It won't immediately open with the flood gates of tier 1s coming into matches with tier 5s, the search times have to get pretty dire for the matchmaker to reach that contingency. Another note is that it will still attempt to accurately balance players on each side. If it does put tier 1s and 4s in the same match, it won't put all the tier 1 players on one side and all the tier 4 players on the other side. The game will attempt to equally distribute players by tier in an attempt to ensure the match has a fair outcome, regardless of the skill disparity between top and bottom player in the lobby.

There is no mechanic that changes the amount of damage your mechs do or health they have based on your skill level. All players have the same mechs, weapons, and equipment at their disposal. Where higher tier players may end up having an advantage is more optimally built mechs or skill trees. But that is a disparity driven by player choice, not some secret stat that reads your tier to decide how effective you are.

We do not buff/nerf players based on skill ratings. Players earn their tier by their gameplay.

So because of the accurate balacing we have games that end 1-12 in the hundreds every day? Makes sense. What you describe might be the intended function, however it surely doesn't work like that at all, lol.

[OdLaW187]

Match making is broken and I don't know if I can continue supporting this game, I spent 45 minutes streaming with a friend and only got into 3 matches... We split up, count down drop and get in a match in about 2 seconds... This has become such an issue and PGI seems to think the solution is 8v8... How about reworking your match making system? Either way if you go with a 8v8 eventually, then you might as well just pull the plug on this game, and same goes with leaving the match making parameters as is, you are killing this game with stupidity, or maybe just a lack of caring about it anymore. But you should stop selling premium mechs if you are not going to properly address the issue and continue your ridiculous way of doing things here. Don't charge money for game play that you can barely get into now a days!!!

Edited by OdLaW187, 12 September 2025 - 08:29 PM.

[simon1812]

"they in turn do so much damage" right, dude it is either aim bot, more than one player is shooting at you (if they do it right you dont see them until it is too late), and most seasoned players can concentrate fire pretty well, specially if they have then burst dmg loadouts.

pretty incredible If you (and only you) discovered that higher tier means dealing more damage...in a game that has been around for 10 years...

PS

just one question worth answering Mr. R3pl1c4nt: for how long have you been playing MWO?

Edited by simon1812, 15 September 2025 - 09:04 PM.

[simon1812]

Tiy0s, on 21 August 2025 - 01:38 PM, said:

The matchmaker will prioritize matching you with players in your tier. However, in times of lower population/longer search times, tier gates may start to gradually open. It won't immediately open with the flood gates of tier 1s coming into matches with tier 5s, the search times have to get pretty dire for the matchmaker to reach that contingency. Another note is that it will still attempt to accurately balance players on each side. If it does put tier 1s and 4s in the same match, it won't put all the tier 1 players on one side and all the tier 4 players on the other side. The game will attempt to equally distribute players by tier in an attempt to ensure the match has a fair outcome, regardless of the skill disparity between top and bottom player in the lobby.

There is no mechanic that changes the amount of damage your mechs do or health they have based on your skill level. All players have the same mechs, weapons, and equipment at their disposal. Where higher tier players may end up having an advantage is more optimally built mechs or skill trees. But that is a disparity driven by player choice, not some secret stat that reads your tier to decide how effective you are.

We do not buff/nerf players based on skill ratings. Players earn their tier by their gameplay.

you are much too kind Tiy0s for coming here to explain stuff

Edited by simon1812, 13 September 2025 - 09:26 AM.