12 replies to this topic

[Ken Harkin]

I have been having an absolute ball with this build. For some time I was not a fan of the Thunderbolts but I have had great luck pairing them with a TAG on a JJ equiped medium. The Griffin with it's ECM really shines here as I am able to jump, lock, launch, and get back to cover before most can get a shot off. If facing AMS I group fire them while if you have a mech running unprotected you chain fire for a constant shelling effect which freaks many of them out. The LPL provides excellent additional firepower.

http://grf-2n

[MechWarrior414712]

cool build wow

[Void Angel]

It's the weapon velocity that will really help you out, I think. Looks like a good build - should play similarly to a Vapor Eagle with ATMs.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

The Probe doesn't do much, since its counter ability against enemy ECM is killed off by your own ECM. I'm not a fan of the TAG since it doesn't work too well with the poptart style. Not a fan of the LPL, either. 2 LPPCs offer better ECM-disabling, more range and similar damage, while working well with the poptart playstyle.

Maybe this is a bit better:
GRF-2N

[Ken Harkin]

I have found the TAG gets locks nearly immediately, definitely in a short enough time to poptart. With nodes in target retention you can usually get at least one more volley, possibly two, after dropping back into cover. The BAP definitely comes into play when dealing with harrasing ECM lights coming for you. I may try without it but I find it more valuable than not.

I agree that two LPPCs is better than one LPL, or PPC. If I want the TAG though then I have only one energy hard point so LPL it is. It mixes well with holding the TAG on target while raining missiles on it.

If you want to drop the ECM there are two strong contenders.

The Dervish 8D uses 3ERML and a TAG along with 4TB5s.

The Wolverine Quarantine is a beast here. It has some good armor quirks and can mount two LPPCs with the TAG. It also has cooldown, heat, and velocity perks.
http://wvr-q


Bottom line is any of these have the mobility and capability of getting their own locks while fighting at up to 700m effectively. As a Medium they are rarely the first thing being targetted. Dumping 20 points in 5 point increments every 2.5-3.0 seconds into the torso primarily adds up FAST. 500+ point damage rounds are common with some 750+ ones thrown in. Having energy weapon backups on all of them really helps with the lights and at the end of long matches when trying to clean up the injured.

Void Angel, on 06 January 2026 - 05:02 PM, said:

It's the weapon velocity that will really help you out, I think. Looks like a good build - should play similarly to a Vapor Eagle with ATMs.

Yes but without needing to be sub 270m for optimal damage and with the missiles having a better arc for indirect fire after dropping again. I played the hell out of the ATM poptart Vapor Eagle for some time. I have found I like these more.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

The thing is, BAP does nothing against ECM when you also have an ECM installed. In that case, you have to set your own ECM to counter. The BAP only increases sensor range and target info gathering.

[Ken Harkin]

Aidan Crenshaw, on 07 January 2026 - 10:37 AM, said:

The thing is, BAP does nothing against ECM when you also have an ECM installed. In that case, you have to set your own ECM to counter. The BAP only increases sensor range and target info gathering.

If that is the case I may stop using BAP on ECM mechs. We come back to the classic "PGI descriptions may or may not reflect in game effects" issue.

[Void Angel]

Oh yeah, they're right about that. You get extra sensor range and faster paper doll, but not much else. The range doesn't actually work for some applications, too - check out MechDB's wiki page.

I'd just use an ASP rather than the active probe - sorry, I really just looked at the weapons and evaluated them based on the chassis' capabilities. =]

[ScrapIron Prime]

Aidan Crenshaw, on 07 January 2026 - 07:10 AM, said:

The Probe doesn't do much, since its counter ability against enemy ECM is killed off by your own ECM. I'm not a fan of the TAG since it doesn't work too well with the poptart style. Not a fan of the LPL, either. 2 LPPCs offer better ECM-disabling, more range and similar damage, while working well with the poptart playstyle.

Maybe this is a bit better:
GRF-2N

Yes, I would definitely recommend those twin light PPC's instead of the LPL and TAG. It cancels ECM at range more effectively and does the same damage with the same cooldown.

[Ken Harkin]

I really am against losing the TAG. Dropping Beagle has been fine but TAG is a lifesaver for FAST locks, cutting through ECM, and improved accuracy. Now on the Wolverine Quarantine I run 2LPPC and a TAG but with the Griffin only having 2 energy hard points I really prefer the LPL and TAG.

[Void Angel]

Among other things, TAG enhances missile grouping, effectively increasing damage. It does not, however, improve lock-on times for the firing 'mech. This was changed during the Lock-On Overhaul in 2019. My TAG will effectively increase the lock-on time (and spread) of teammates who do not themselves have line of sight, but that's a function of the system treating any TAG-ed 'mech as being in line of sight for that purpose.

Strongly recommend MechDB's excellent wiki page. Perusing it to refresh my memory pointed out to me - for example - that TAG's 25% spread bonus for the firing 'mech will take effect in real time, making it still useful for poptarting missiles, though it's not at all required.

Edited by Void Angel, 05 February 2026 - 04:51 PM.

[Ken Harkin]

The TAG does though allow one to counter ECM for a lock on if I remember and observe correctly.

Wouldn't it be astonishing if this game always had up to date descriptions of equipment effects actually listed IN GAME...

[Void Angel]

It's not uncommon for games to let players suss out and maintain game mechanics databases - or even to have inaccuracies that aren't corrected. WoW's Shaman description on the official website listed Shamans as a tanking class for years, and their Windfury Weapon tooltip failed to mention that an internal cooldown had been added for... well, I don't think we ever found out how long. Players discovered it in testing when the Burning Crusade changed Enhancement Shamans to faster, dual-wielded weapons.

Now, TAG doesn't technically "counter" ECM. It simply allows a lock through ECM. If you're within the enemy ECM's range, for example, you still get all the negative effects. I know that's probably just a way to say "it allows locks through ECM," but the specific terminology is important.

Edited by Void Angel, 06 February 2026 - 10:20 AM.