36 replies to this topic

[John Clavell]

So let me talk through some of the changes since the last update. As you can see we've add hair. The hair has been a serious challenge to do in illustrator alone. I've reviewed many other illustrators techniques for hair, and the biggest problem is, considering the limitations of vectors is it looks very hard. I've tried to make it seem a lot softer by building up feathered layers of colour then by adding depth and detail with bundles of strands. I feel I've done ok at getting that softer look, but ultimately it still does not look how I'd like. I'll have to touch it up in Photoshop.

We've also added the dog tags, flecking of the metal on the tag using an alpha mask, looks ok overall. Needs more shadowing /finishing around the neck.

I've also worked more depth and shadow into the lower part of the vest and around the bust to give better feeling of her wearing this tight top. However, I still need to add more shadowing here. Most of the shadows here are internal, based on light getting through the fabric. I need to work on the external shadows. Still a good deal of things to get sorted but certainly getting closer now to finishing up stage on Stacy. Then.. onto the Battlemechs!

Edited by John Clavell, 09 January 2012 - 12:48 AM.

[Threat Doc]

This work is coming along amazingly well. If I might suggest, the hair on the right-hand side of HER head could use some of the feathering touches you did with the curls on the left, perhaps just some loose strands, nothing too big. And, would there be any way to soften the edge of the shadows you did near her right armpit and along her arms, so there's a more natural transition?

You've probably already thought of these things, and I'm not expert, so I'll just tell you she's very well done. Thank you for sharing your continuing work with us.

[John Clavell]

Kay Wolf, on 09 January 2012 - 09:09 AM, said:

This work is coming along amazingly well. If I might suggest, the hair on the right-hand side of HER head could use some of the feathering touches you did with the curls on the left, perhaps just some loose strands, nothing too big. And, would there be any way to soften the edge of the shadows you did near her right armpit and along her arms, so there's a more natural transition?

You've probably already thought of these things, and I'm not expert, so I'll just tell you she's very well done. Thank you for sharing your continuing work with us.

Hey Kay Wolf, thanks for your kind words and comments. Yes, I still have a good deal of work to do on the hair. There is one major issue which needs to be fixed, that seems to be a problem with an out of gamut colour when converted to RGB. The bulk of the hair on her right is flowing behind her back, but I wanted some to catch on her shoulder. I might rework how the hair hangs there slightly.

I'll see if I can refine the blending on the arms some more. I set out with this image to certainly raise the bar on skin blending in Illustrator without using a gradient mesh. I feel I've been pretty successful. There will however be some 'hardness' to get definition, it's a balancing act between definition and a nice soft blend. I'll continue to refine and work on the technique I've been using to build up soft blends. Thanks for your feedback man, always appreciated!

[Threat Doc]

You might think about working solely in RGB for the hair. It will certainly take a lot longer to do, but I think you'll get the effect you're looking for much more. As for the skin shading, have you thought of localizing the borders between shades and trying to apply a Gaussian Blur? There are also Smudge Tools, but you have to be enormously careful with those, and they take a good deal of time to do the work in.

Edited by Kay Wolf, 09 January 2012 - 10:47 AM.

[John Clavell]

Kay Wolf, on 09 January 2012 - 10:46 AM, said:

You might think about working solely in RGB for the hair. It will certainly take a lot longer to do, but I think you'll get the effect you're looking for much more. As for the skin shading, have you thought of localizing the borders between shades and trying to apply a Gaussian Blur? There are also Smudge Tools, but you have to be enormously careful with those, and they take a good deal of time to do the work in.

Smudge is a pixel based tool, so is not available in Illustrator per-say. There is a series of Photoshop effects (which actually are available in InDesign too), one is a smudge tool 'effect', I have no idea how that will work, I don't tend to use any of them, as again, they are pixel based. I don't mind combining in some raster effects, but mostly then your losing the versatility of vectors. My work flow tends to be based around setting my main elements in vector, then working in Photoshop touching up and texturing at the end. Having the vector work separate obviously giving me the big advantage of blowing it up and down with no loss in quality.

I'm not tried using a gaussian blur, I'll have to play with that. The shading is built up using gradients and blend modes. I've attempted to work on the areas you identified however, and things are looking indeed better. Thanks for you feedback, and helping to improve this piece of work. I think that arms are looking better for it.

I don't know if your an Illustrator user yourself? But if so, I'd certainly enjoy to hear some further explanations on the techniques your describing, as I'm always eager to learn more about working with vectors in Adobe Illustrator.

[John Clavell]

[John Clavell]

[Threat Doc]

Everything is pixel-based when working on a computer, my friend. The big deal is getting the absolutely correct RGB mix for each and every single pixel on there. So, programs such as Illustrator work in groups of pixels, hundreds of square pixels worth at a time, but it's all pixels nonetheless, and will be until someone designs a monitor that no longer works on thousands and thousands of tiny squares that each hold their own color designation. You can work in hues, shadows, and RGB all day long, and it's all still pixels.

Now, that being said, your transitions between former color patches, the dog tags, and the hair over her right shoulder, are perfect... nicely done, senor.

[Mason Grimm]

You have ruined Stacey Church for me!!!! If you make the hair a little more red that is my wife looking back at me (shudders). All my fantasies are now wrecked!!!!

Amazing job man!!! Loving the step by step!

Edited by Mason Grimm, 10 January 2012 - 09:25 AM.

[John Clavell]

Kay Wolf, on 10 January 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

Everything is pixel-based when working on a computer, my friend. The big deal is getting the absolutely correct RGB mix for each and every single pixel on there. So, programs such as Illustrator work in groups of pixels, hundreds of square pixels worth at a time, but it's all pixels nonetheless, and will be until someone designs a monitor that no longer works on thousands and thousands of tiny squares that each hold their own color designation. You can work in hues, shadows, and RGB all day long, and it's all still pixels.

Now, that being said, your transitions between former color patches, the dog tags, and the hair over her right shoulder, are perfect... nicely done, senor.

Thanks for your insight and support.

[Ra-ul]

Hair has a nice overall look, except some long hair tips making it look like badly cut (hope you know what I mean). I also think that there should be at least some curling happening on the left side as well, as the hair seems to be loose and not tied back. I admire your patience approaching this with Illustrator and curves, I´d personally prefer a thousand times to paint it in Photoshop

[John Clavell]

GraySho, on 11 January 2012 - 08:59 AM, said:

Hair has a nice overall look, except some long hair tips making it look like badly cut (hope you know what I mean). I also think that there should be at least some curling happening on the left side as well, as the hair seems to be loose and not tied back. I admire your patience approaching this with Illustrator and curves, I´d personally prefer a thousand times to paint it in Photoshop

The hair was where I was really struggling, and wanting to load up Photoshop. The ends are the big problem. I can't find a way to make strands blend and the ends naturally. It looks ok in the thick of the hair, but shows up at the ends, and gives it that 'badly cut' look like you say. Maybe I can work out how to solve it in the future. A quick touch up in Photoshop would fix it, but that's cheating

Edited by John Clavell, 11 January 2012 - 10:00 AM.

[Ra-ul]

John Clavell, on 11 January 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

A quick touch up in Photoshop would fix it, but that's cheating

I once thought like you, as a "purist", and considered even level adjustment cheating . Like old school photographers might have seen digital photography and photoshop cheating, it was just another way to achieve effects digitally instead in the darkroom. Once I changed that attitude and accepted that those are just tools to get to the final result, l saved myself a lot of time and headache, thus enjoying it a lot more. In the end your poster will just a matrix of colored pixels, if it is a harmonic and enjoyable composition nobody will ask you how every pixel came to it´s place

[Mykaelous Wolf]

Awesome, makes me want to get off my *** and draw something. Well maybee when I get back from the beach I'll start in on a signature banner.

[Threat Doc]

So, John, is she finished, or were you still going to put in the background? She's delicious, but... wasn't there more you wanted to do, originally?

[John Clavell]

I finished her, but yeah I never finished the rest, apologies for that. It was not coming out how I wanted and I just kinda left it. I have a plan though to maybe improve on my human renderings in Illustrator, I might to Natasha Kerensky and Jamie Wolf. As for Battlemechs, I need to go and practice, I am not very good at doing Battlemechs I have to admit.

[BigJim]

Oh, so nice!

Looking over that progression is impressive as hell, my (lack of) skills with Illustrator are like a kid smearing poster-paint on his face in comparison..

Totally understand your point on keeping things in vectors though; Personally I've only ever used Illu to "block-out" icons & early designs - I used it regularly to design unit-banners on TT minis, print off, stretch the paper & then freehand paint over but seeing this work just makes me utterly envious of your ability to create an entire work in vector... Wow.