40 replies to this topic

[Catamount]

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The problem is that it is worse than WoW. How long it has been in development is irrelevant as far as bugs go

I'm not sure I'd agree with this statement. Having played WoW for five years, I admit that I haven't touched it since shortly before Cataclysm's launch, but unless Blizzard suddenly got their act together overnight after five years, then WoW is still much less balanced than TOR, which has already achieved better class balance and versatility than WoW did from launch all the way to late WOTLK (and probably up through now).

Hunters with dual ******** wraths (who could nearly tank instances! I DID tank instances once or twice!), Warlocks with infinite CC and DPS, Death Knights with... Death Knights , Mages... honestly I don't have to say anything more than mages, they've been 10 kinds of broken over the time I've played (and then nerfed so badly that they then become unplayable until the next overpower patch for them), seriously, there have been so many balance problems in WoW it's hard to even remember a significant fraction of them, and when WoW realized something was overpowered, they'd overreact so much that they'd nerf the class into unplayability.

On the technical side, WoW has been just as big of a disaster. Remember how they added dynamics shadows in WOTLK? The coding was so bad, that turning them on made the game run slower on my 4870 than Crysis on high settings! Sholazar Basin frequently got down to 20fps on that GPU, in a game that launched being able to play on high on Geforce 6000 and Radeon X800 series cards!

WoW is a terribly unpolished game... but it had enough really great things going for it that we were usually willing to look past some of those flaws

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you want 35 droids dead in this-or-that location

Xhaleon, quests do not consist of killing 35 droids in TOR. In fact, while I have a myriad of things I could complain about with the game, that's one of the few things I will say in its favor. The game does not assign you to WoW style "collect 10 pig anuses for my pig **** stew" type quests, ever. The only time you're ever asked to complete objectives like that are as side bonus objects to quests, which you can finish the quests without completing, and which you usually just end up completing over the course of a quest, but you never, ever run out just to kill X mob or collect A amount of Y. The only exception I've encountered in over 20 levels of play was a single space quest to shoot down five fighters.


Again, I'm not saying TOR is a great game; frankly I'm only playing it as a mild distraction. I'm just saying if you're going to criticize it, criticize it for things it's actually guilty of.

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I think the biggest failure of TOR is that it is a multiplayer game that is being forced to abide by singleplayer standards and norms. It just isn't going to work. One might listen to a quest giver telling you their sob story initially, but in time people simply won't care

This could end up becoming a very legitimate criticism. Frankly, I'd like to see this problem kill story theme park MMOs altogether, so that we could get more mass sandbox MMOs that are community-driven off the ground.

Will it become a genuine problem? Well you've played through two KOTOR games for which I could say the same thing (since TOR really is just multiplayer KOTOR, in terms of story and quests), and you still want another, so I don't know...

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Just... I just wanted KOTOR 3, okay? And now it probably will never see the light of day, ever.

Believe it or not, I can understand this. I was a big fan of the KOTOR series, really. I thought they were both really great games, but here's something to consider: did they really leave enough undone to warrant a third title regardless of whether TOR was made?

I mean, the first game was fresh and great, and the second game was... a copy of the first (I know Bioware didn't do it, so maybe they could have freshened it up). I loved the KOTOR games, but don't you think that if it was really profitable to make one, they'd make one anyways? I mean, this is BIOWARE, they don't lack for resources TOR also isn't a substitute if you don't like MMOs, so it would have had a definite niche, just like Mass Effect 3 is going to have a definite niche (probably preceding an ME MMO, which they've already hinted at).


It's just a bit of food for thought.


It's always nice to see series we like continue, but at the same time, there's no need to vent at Bioware for pursuing other titles because they didn't take that time instead to make new games in our old beloved series.

I'd personally love it if they kept making Mass Effect games after 3, but I also realize there's such a thing as beating a dead horse, so I'm kind of glad they won't be.


EDIT: isn't ******** a bit of a funny word to filter?

Edited by Catamount, 07 January 2012 - 01:58 PM.

[Catamount]

Bud Johnson, on 07 January 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

TOR offers nothing new, It is a Korean grind fest clone with glow-sticks and decent voice acting.
It isn't a bad game but it offers the same experience you can get from any free to play mmo.

All in all SWG (pre-nge of course) had much better game play, character customization, crafting, space combat, motivation to interact with other players, etc...
Eve post NGE it is arguably better if you include jump to light speed.

Galaxies pre-NGE is the direction I would have liked TOR to take, because that game was definitely a good sandbox title, or at least it was a game that had the potential to be a good sandbox title. Still, saying post-NGE Galaxies is better than anything, I mean, OUCH, that's harsh!

[Omigir]

Honestly, I would have much rather have seen a ME direction for SWTOR... Rather then falling in line with not just WoW, but every game that came before nad after WoW which rely on me ismply tapping 1-0 in the most efficiant order. There have been great starwars games and KOTOR being the most recent. Maybe after I give it a shot my mind will have changed but I found wow boring due to its basic player machanics and from what im reading, SWTOR is no difrent.

Emersive story or not, its still a grinder with almost no skill. click on enemy, tap 1-4 untill its dead. rins repeat. i guess i enjoy aiming a little to much T__T

[Mason Grimm]

For some reason this topic actually caused me to dream about WoW last night! I have NEVER touched that game although some friends and the wife did.

I blame all of you!

[Yeach]

I am playing SWTOR.

From a generalize viewpoint you could say SWTOR plays like WOW but on specific areas it can play a little less like wow.
Crafting is all done by your companions freeing you to from spending time on just crafting.
Companions like KOTOR and ME can be individually equipped.
Gathering skills can provide "shortcuts" when used on some flashpoints (multi-player missions)

I think SWTOR plays more like KOTOR than WOW. (except for no spacebar to pause)

[xlrate]

SW:TOR is an awesome game, but I am biased since I worked on it.

[a rabid chihuahua]

It's a fun game .I tried WoW didn't get into it,wasn't bad ,but not my thing. I enjoy TOR and like what it is .They still have time to add stuff later also.

[William White]

I am playing SWTOR currently and am enjoying it. I was also a big fan of KOTOR and KOTOR 2 the visual look is similar but I agree it does play a bit like WOW. I believe that it will last mainly as while it is buggy sometimes it has actually only been out for about 3 weeks and I believe to compare it to WOW which has been put for years is not entirely fair. Admittedly I might have been lucky that I have not encoutered the major issues which have been reported.

In answer to people who say it is a grind fest. Any online game can become a grind fest it is the RP you put into it and how serious you take the quests. I like the multiplayer quests and even though it can be pain to get people I have not had to wait more than 5 mins to get a team together. Also I have enjoyed the ds/ls choices the only thing I found a bit annoying as most of the time you have to be either all good or all bad to really benefit from the alignments. Amittedly initially there is little or no effect but it can make a difference with implants etc later.

[TRK]

KOTOR 3 didnt happen becuase of players, they dont want that, they want WoW. Money talks. MMO is the way to make money. I never player WoW and still wont, even of free. Why? I dont want the frontal lobotomy that is required to play such crap. Going to be pretty much the same thing with TOR, waste of time and money. Go play some TT instead.

[Tannhauser Gate]

Im a D&D player from way back and our group was so good, creative, and fun for years that it jaded me to any video game trying to be a medieval fantasy adventure. They simply cannot hold a candle to a real rpg. Wow is no exception. I might be able to enjoy the social aspect of it playing with good friends but in the end, your playing Blizzard's weak story, in a crappy looking game with the same old mission grind and dry dialogue. Plus, playing a low tech medieval fantasy game on a computer (relatively high tech) is a complete fail to me. I guess Im a snob. So be it.

On the other hand, I played SWGalaxies off and on for several years and had a blast. It was a beautiful game that should have lasted for 5 more years or more but Sony knows how to betray their audience and fail to listen to feedback. I wont be playing any of their games again. Many people I know worked hard for months to build up skills, build guilds of friends, create lots of player based story lines and intrigue (huge community) all to be utterly uprooted and thrown out when Sony tried to make SWG more like wow. People left that game in droves.

Anyway, imo, wow is for people who like "casual" challenge levels and have relatively noob standards for art, story, and combat which is why its so popular - it appeals to the mass of people who dont have the high expectations that experienced gamers have

This is why MWO will never dethrone wow. BT is a challenging esoteric universe. It will never have the appeal of a cliche, easily digested, flacidly generic medieval fantasy game.

[Phelan Kerensky]

Alright everyone,
I did used to play WoW a while back and stopped a bit after lich king with some breaks in between that and I am also a very active player on Star Wars TOR. I must admit, some of the gameplay feels like WoW but it is much more advanced than a WoW style game and is not as repetitive. Also, being an rpg based game, the most important thing is the story line. As I got nearer to ending my time with WoW, one of the things that kept downgrading was the story and flavor to WoW. I don't worry about that with TOR, considering it just came out and the story revolves around your character very well even past the current max level 50. Not to mention that the story is diff. based on gender and which advanced class you pick for each one. Take all that into account and the game has more than 16 full stories for you to go through. This already counts a lot of play time that is not repetitive. Not to mention the group activities, like heroics and flashpoints. I will heed you all to also keep in mind that the game offers all this and it just came out... I personally love it and do not see myself getting tired of it or leaving it anytime soon. I def. recommend this game. Just thought I'd give my opinion on it.

[dh crow]

WoW isn't generic. It has pandas.

(You can't polish a piece of poo, but you can roll it in glitter.)

Edited by dh crow, 09 January 2012 - 02:24 PM.

[Trogusaur]

Honestly I was a bit bummed KOTOR didn't transfer game files into the 2nd one, I worked so hard to get my Revan to the vaunted level 20, only to find out it was all for naught. Seriously, the main character didn't even have a voice actor, why would he just " vanish" to fight the "real sith"? Maybe there were too many plotholes to deal with between good and evil endings to make a second game based off the first pixelated hero we know and love, but what really got me was that after more than five years of waiting for KOTOR 3 Bioware annonces an MMO, you know, the gametype that prevents any individual awesomeness becuse there's always some psycgo guild that plays 24/7. It's totally fine with games like wow or the up and coming MWO, only because their respective universes allow for that. KOTOR was all about you kicking butt, not being a toady in a struggle for power much bigger than just your character.

Too bad, I was just hoping for another great game

Edited by Lord Trogus, 09 January 2012 - 02:53 PM.

[Omigir]

Mason Grimm, on 08 January 2012 - 07:49 AM, said:

For some reason this topic actually caused me to dream about WoW last night! I have NEVER touched that game although some friends and the wife did. I blame all of you!

Im in your dreams.. covered in honey...

[Adridos]

dh crow, on 09 January 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

WoW isn't generic. It has pandas.

(You can't polish a piece of poo, but you can roll it in glitter.)

It is really funy that as a Warcraft player, I hate the things WoW done to our lore, but Mists of Kung Fu Panda is the most canon of them all, trust me.

[Thorn Hallis]

TOR is the first game since LOTRO that really can be called an MMORPG. Very well done, Bioware.

And there is no need to invent the wheel a second time, so ofc the game takes some references from other games.

[LordRush]

Been playing since day 2 of the release. Im an old 6 year WoW vet and I am still searching for that "I really really like this game" feeling.
I'm not saying that it isnt a cool game but there are aspects that just dont sit right with me.
Graphically, I have seen alot of replies saying they think the graphics are better than WoW...personally, I dont see it. Its appealing to look at but nothing great!
Gameplay sits almost just like wow did.
At the moment, there are is no end game. I know this will happen but when you have levelled your toon to 50...atm, thats it!
I also am not that fond of the UI, hopefully soon there will be mods and ad ons allowed.
The environment seems to be a repetative occurance. Nothing really to me stands out. Architecture seems redundant .
There is a lack of AI that WoW had. At least if you speak to a guard he will have a map of vendors,trainers,etc. on TOR, there is alot of wasted space and alot of dummy npc's floating around that have absolutley no interactive purpose.
Also, it sucks that character transfers are not yet implemented. Kinda makes grouping friends and guild mates a little hard when the organization falls short

All in all, I am having fun but to me...it's no WoW

Edited by LordRush, 12 January 2012 - 11:16 AM.

[Harrow]

SWTOR spanks WoW in every category. And keep in mind it just launched. After another year of massive exodus from WoW will the game even be relevant any more?

[Tadakuma]

Omigir, on 06 January 2012 - 11:47 PM, said:

Yeah, I said it. Or asked it...
My girlfreind wants me to play it.. but I never liked wow. I did no tlike the basic game machanics.

So i looked up some game play footage of SWTOR and instead of feeling like it was more like KOTOR which i loved on xbox, i think 'OMG its wow again'. So really, is SWTOR just a new wow that wow players who are now fed up with azuroth can go play the same game but feel like its new?

DX< im so angry!

Like you I never really got into WOW and yes I do agree the base mechanics are pretty similar to WOW, the difference is that it's a little more story driven. This is making the difference to me.

I don't think it's going to be a long term thing, but I'm certainly going to play for a couple of months and then revisit it a couple of times a year.

If it wasn't for MWO and the Secret World coming out later this year I could see myself sinking some serious time into SW:TOR, but as it is those two IPs are ones I've been waiting for.

[Tadakuma]

Lord Trogus, on 09 January 2012 - 02:45 PM, said:

Honestly I was a bit bummed KOTOR didn't transfer game files into the 2nd one, I worked so hard to get my Revan to the vaunted level 20, only to find out it was all for naught. Seriously, the main character didn't even have a voice actor, why would he just &quot; vanish&quot; to fight the &quot;real sith&quot;? Maybe there were too many plotholes to deal with between good and evil endings to make a second game based off the first pixelated hero we know and love, but what really got me was that after more than five years of waiting for KOTOR 3 Bioware annonces an MMO, you know, the gametype that prevents any individual awesomeness becuse there's always some psycgo guild that plays 24/7. It's totally fine with games like wow or the up and coming MWO, only because their respective universes allow for that. KOTOR was all about you kicking butt, not being a toady in a struggle for power much bigger than just your character.

Too bad, I was just hoping for another great game

It's a bit more complex then that. George Lucas wants to keep KOTOR in house so Bioware isn't allowed to make a KOTOR. It stems from the fact that Bioware contracted out the the second game to Obsidian who came up with a really interesting take on the Jedi, With dichotomy.

George Lucas really, really hated the concept, to the point were he slashed the development time and budget in half (this why KOTOR 2 seems so unfinished, because it literally is only half the story) and the events of the game are officially considered non-canon by Lucas Arts.

So yeah KOTOR 3 isn't an option for Bioware, hence SW:TOR which is kind of KOTOR 3