600 replies to this topic

[Black Sunder]

The main assumption here in this thread is that the match will last 20 minutes no matter what and thats just not true.

[Omigir]

GaussDragon, on 11 January 2012 - 05:34 PM, said:

[...] All of us have to start at some point. Some people start with more skill than others, but none of us are innate pros. [...] Newbie player drops into wave-style match. He's just been dropped into the middle of a game surrounded by people who are likely to be somewhat to significantly better than he is. Newbie gets torn to ribbons in a minute. He now gets to spend the next 9 minutes reflecting over how little he stood a chance. Next wave starts, and whammo, newbie gets cut down again. Newbie is starting to resent the fact that he's being punished so badly for being new to the game. He has spent 2 minutes getting his *** handed to him, and 18 minutes reflecting upon how he got his *** handed to him. [...]

This will happen anyway, reguardless if its wave based or not. If he gets infinent respawns and he is just out classed and keeps dying, it would be the same frustration after dying 30 times in a row becuase the players in his match are better equiped and already know the game and its machanics.

The fix for this? Put players into brakets. XP lvl as well as LP lvl will help filter out brand new players from the higher level competitors. A natrualy skilled player can earn levels and move up into hiegher brackets. Only way to solve that problem, pit newbie vs newbie

[Ravn]

I don't want to be hardline, but I'm just not going to have fun playing with respawn. I even consider the first 20 minutes looking for the other team a little exciting when it does happen. I am one of the happy few who loves seek and destroy (no respawn) on Call of Duty and spends 90% of his online time playing it. I really didn't start getting good at that game until I was getting capped in the first 30 seconds and spent the next 5 minutes watching an artist who paints the other team dead in observer mode. There is a niche of folks who will not be satisfied without respawn, and there is a niche of us out there who won't stand for it. I'm going to guess that it's a 30% nospawn/ 40% respawn/ 30% no care split. Catering to all of us will bring in the most money.

Anyone care to throw up a poll?

Edit: I did.

http://mwomercs.com/...2-respawn-poll/

Edited by Ravn, 11 January 2012 - 07:58 PM.

[Ravn]

Just cause I'm curious of how we are split.

Edited by Ravn, 11 January 2012 - 07:29 PM.

[Verminaard]

No spawns imo, not what its about, when you die find a new battle and fix your mech.

[Omigir]

There are some other options out there, such as limited number or respons (IE, i have three mechs on the dropship and i only have those mechs available to me for respawn.)

I guess hybrid could also fill in a the 'other' option really o__O

Edited by Omigir, 11 January 2012 - 07:23 PM.

[Lord Banshee]

I say NO to respawn. This shouldn't be a revamp of Unreal Tournament.

World of Tanks offers the Death-Cam, where even though you got popped, you can still watch the battle from any other friendly vehicle, even your destroyed one.
This has much entertainment/lesson value:
1) You can still cheer your allies, and taunt your foes
2) You can watch how the God-Like player goes about their work and maybe learn from them.
3) N00bz are often quite entertaining
4) You can still help your team by being the eyes-in-the-back-of-your-teammate's-head.
5) You can help your team notice stuff on the minimap if they are distracted/tunnel-visioned on one foe.
6) Even though you may be KO'ed you can still have a great hand in your team's victory. I offer this anecdote: http://forum.worldof...ost__p__1295466
Sometimes imparting a little knowledge that a teammate may not know at a critical time can make all the difference.

Edited by Lord Banshee, 11 January 2012 - 07:26 PM.

[Ravn]

I agree. I know it would be more profitable to cater to those that want to respawn, but this choice is about what makes me happy. i want to know when I put someone down, they are staying down. Or that when I'm rocking a scout mech, that I'm making an impact on the match.

[Ravn]

Omigir, on 11 January 2012 - 07:22 PM, said:

There are some other options out there, such as limited number or respons (IE, i have three mechs on the dropship and i only have those mechs available to me for respawn.)

I guess hybrid could also fill in a the 'other' option really o__O

I added an option just for you!

[Hayden]

I actually REALLY like the hybrid notion. If you die get penalties toward XP, etc. This will encourage players to be tactical without driving away masses of folks when they have to wait for the next match.

[FACEman Peck]

Having a little bit of give to respawns would be a good thing. Having something like the classic 3 lives before permanent death would be nice for the people who don't have crap for luck. I don't know, maybe it's just me...

[MitchellTyner]

Virgil Caine, on 11 January 2012 - 04:51 PM, said:

Everyone here has been looking at the Respawn vs no Respawn thing from the point of view of the person who has died. Look at it from the point of view of the other people on his team. 00:00 Game Start! 00:58 Team 1 Uberleethax has destroyed Team 2 BillyBoBob with Gauss Rifle. (Because he knows people run to that place EVERY match, and he gets a freebie every match... 01:03 Team 1 Geronimo has destroyed Team 2 Lilkidwhosucks with LRM 20. (Because his target was a little kid who sucks) 01:15 Team 1 Uberleethax has destroyed Team 2 Deeznuts6969 with Gauss Rifle. (Because Deeznuts tried to flank him from the obvious direction he gets flanked from every time on this map) 01:37 Team 2 Selfishbastard says. Great, I drew derp team this match... 01:38 Team 2 Selfishbastard leaves map. 01:55 Team 2 Onlycompetentplayer has Destroyed Team 1 Randomnewbie with Large Pulse Laser (Because he was pressing the objective and got a nice shot off) 02:05 Team 1 Geronimo has Destroyed Team 2 Onlycompetent player, with LRM 20 (Saw where his ally went down and ran there immediately) 02:20 Team 2 Outnumbered says. "Well, this match is pretty much over... it's 11-7 with 8 minutes on your defense timer... 02:23 Team 2 Outnumbered destroys Team 1 Randomlightmech with Death from Above. 02:25 Team 1 Geronimo destroys Team 2 Outnumbered with LRM 20 02:30 Team 1 Uberleethax says "Noobz!" 02:45 Team 1 Geronimo says "Meh" Yeah, there's some hyperbole in this, but i've seen it happen time and time again. Suppose you're the cautious guy on your team, and a quarter of your team gets taken out in the first two minutes with no answering kills on your side. Now everyone on your team feels outnumbered... they play it cautious 'even more'... get corraled... get gradually chewed down by superior numbers... outcome of the match is inevitable... Now imagine half the matches you go into are like this. Frustration out the wazoo. Respawn systems are there so matches are somewhat competetive until the end, not forgone conclusions after the first exchange of fire. We should make our respawn systems BETTER. You can make them cost resources, or make them part of an objective to capture, or something like that. But to remove them entirely basically feeds the above model. Make the respawns Wave-Respawns with larger cooldowns between. Or make them part of the battlegrid... Something other than "You blew up, game over"

Well like I said, MW3 and BF3 could always use some more players! Mech's don't "respawn" , yes it sucks to be on a team when you get raped for a lack of a better word... but guess what. That's what is going to happen no matter if the people "respawn" or if they are just dead. If you are going against a team that is that good it doesn't matter. If your whole team gets wiped out in a couple minutes you don't have to wait that long till the next match then do you?

Fox

[Omigir]

Your the man Ravn, thx for adding the other options <3

[Ravn]

I guess I was wrong about my estimation. It seems to be heading for a landslide for no spawn.

[Ravn]

No problem. Everyone deserves to have a voice. After the discussion that went on and on and on in the "Early Death in a 20 min match" thread, I expected more peeps to vote for respawn.

Edited by Ravn, 11 January 2012 - 08:04 PM.

[Mason Grimm]

Merging with the other thread.

[Alekto Serenis]

Sneaky mod i was just hitting post on the other thread

I personally would love a server system, both one hosted by some company and homeowned (finally a reason to dust of the remains of my old system^^)

I have a deep disgust at matchmaking as most times all that p2p crap ruins any skill by being the most laggy **** imaginable, this ruins space marine mp everyday again and i love the game enough to come back each evening

This would also allow for "unranked" games, games where people can "customize/admin" the enviroment to their liking and hope that enough others enjoy it that way as well to come and play

Oh and most importantly i hate to wait to respawn, unless i was owned by someone with enough skills and not with a cheap **** load

[Mason Grimm]

Alekto Serenis, on 11 January 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:

Sneaky mod i was just hitting post on the other thread

I am like the wind

[Ravn]

Ha, that was actually a trap Captain Alucard. You are the one who is too emo! j/k

Edited by Ravn, 11 January 2012 - 09:18 PM.

[Omigir]

Well.. Ravn, considering the comunity, I have a feeling that this time tommarow there will be hundreds who throw in.. but I would go ahead and offer up that there is a good 80% of the forum that lurk. and really there is like 16 of us who chew each other's heads off in every forum topic because we really all secretly love each other but cant bring ourself to say it.