277 replies to this topic

[Dragonlord]

This is not about MWO, but computer games in general.

I am an avid gamer, and I buy allot of games in the course of a year.
However over the last several years and the last years specifically I have noticed a decline in the quality of games.

A game I pre-ordered, Legends of Pegasus (4x Space RTS), was released 3 days ago, when the game was released in was riddled with bugs, I'm talking gamebreaking bugs, such as the game crashing randomly, players unable to save/load games, and unable to move ships ingame.
These are just a few examples, and the game feels more like an early beta than a release ready product.

It was the same with Might & Magic Heroes VI (in the Heroes of might & magic), the game was riddled with bugs, many of them gamebreaking and the game felt like an early beta as well.

Then there is Diablo 3 which had allot of hype, but turned out to me a major disappointment.
I know some people swear its a greats game, but I dont agree and it seems many others dont either.
It feels more like a hack'n slash game that are relying on the success of its predecessors, just like many other games seems to do today.

It seems that all games today are just meant to be another money grab for whatever publisher decides to release it, with no regard for repeatability, fun or even quality
Some games even feels like just a copy of another game, as if the developers have no imagination at all.

I still remember back in the days when I bought a game it was actually working as intended, and the gameplay was fun and entertaining.
So what happened to that quality and quality control?
Where are the games that you can install and know they are working as they should and which can hold your attention for hours and days, sometimes even weeks?

These are things that genuinely puzzles me, and I'm hoping someone here can actually provide some useful answers.

Edited by Dragonlord, 13 August 2012 - 06:50 AM.

[Riin Suul]

I absolutely agree with you that gamebreaking bugs are unacceptable in a completed product, and that a lot of game companies could stand to do more testing and optimizing before they release their games these days.

btw: I was thinking of getting legends of pegasus, does this mean that I should wait for a while (or avoid it altogether?)

[Aullido]

The internet made easy to release patches, quality insurance took a lesser priority.

[Woska]

The modern game is much more about the graphics and whatever "innovative" feature the developer has come up with.

Back in the day when graphics were heavily restricted by available technology, the game had to be fun to play. But now you have people that will literally look at the box and say "wow, look at those graphics, I'm going to buy this game" without ever actually knowing what it's about.

Also, the marketing guys have taken on much more power in the process. They set the delivery schedule based on when they think it's the best time to hit the market. So they don't wait for the game to be finished, since they can just patch it later.

[CCC Dober]

OP: The game development simply got more complicated ever since we made the first steps with 3d accelerated graphics. A lot of time went into the engine instead of content and quality control as a result. But even so, brilliant series such as Fallout or Baldur's Gate weren't exactly bug-free either, quite the opposite. Gotta agree though that they were a lot less shallow than pretty much everything afterwards, like the Diablo series. Not that Diablo was bad, but it was hack and slay and something that reminded me of Golden Axe with better graphics.

[Dragonlord]

Riin Suul, on 13 August 2012 - 06:52 AM, said:

I absolutely agree with you that gamebreaking bugs are unacceptable in a completed product, and that a lot of game companies could stand to do more testing and optimizing before they release their games these days.

btw: I was thinking of getting legends of pegasus, does this mean that I should wait for a while (or avoid it altogether?)

Its a good game, so I say wait for a bit until they fixed the bugs.
Been trying to play it quite a but myself, but the game keeps crashing all the time so it gets tiresome in the long run.

[Rixx]

What happened is no simple question, it's a combination of issues.

1. Graphics. Graphics are now the answer to every problem. Bigger, prettier, sharper, more color, more explosions, more details! Course that kills your budget for every other element of the game such as quality control, writing, etc. Chris Hartman's recent statements point to this. They've given up doing anything creative because they believe graphics are the hurdle to creativity. Once the graphics are good enough, the games will just improve on their own! Make the game pretty and no one will notice the glitches.

2. $$$. QC costs money, a lot of money. On top of that, it takes time, lots of time. That's time you are not making money. Ship it out as fast as possible, get some income going and fix anything that turns up. Internet makes that easy enough to do, but it's still bad form. It's better to spend that money and time developing sharper, crisper graphics!

3. Rushed production. Big companies push products out early and half finished to meet arbitrary deadlines so they have numbers to show at board meetings and to hopefully push stock prices higher. Suits that are higher up, and have no idea what it takes to make a game, are the ones making these kind of descisions.

4. Status quo. Gamers, in general, are so fanatic about their hobby that they never demand better. Heck, Blizzard could put together a trailer for Diablo 4 tomorrow, release a stick figure based character creation screen the next day, threaten always on requirements, threaten a monthly fee (for a basically single player game) and promise that if you buy now they'll eventually get a game put together sometime before 2020 and they'd probably sell 2 million copies in the first 48 hours. As long as we keep throwing money at them for half baked manure, they'll keep shoveling it to us.

[Whamm]

I dont think graphics have anything to do with most of the bugs that occur in newly released games. Its mostly Rushed production. The quicker they get the game out the faster they can make money.

[Serpentine]

Pretty much every video game company has "modernized" into this^

Graphics? Does that mean... MORE MONEY?

Espically at the 1:50 mark, games have really degraded in quality.

Edited by Serpentine, 13 August 2012 - 07:39 AM.

[Dragonlord]

It truly saddens me to see that the gaming industry has taken such a nosedive.
The games promise many hours of fun and lots of replayability, yet many games that are released today I can complete in a few hours and never play again because the are boring.
I see games that are promised to have background story and rich storylines, yet they barely the background and storylines are so shallow and lacking that you barely notice it at all.

Truly wish that at least one developer and one publisher would actually be willing to take a risk just once, and try to create a game that dont just focus on great graphics, but have a compelling storyline and good entertaining gameplay.

Edited by Dragonlord, 13 August 2012 - 07:40 AM.

[Triggerhippy]

Completely agree, do you remember original Doom coming out? with the first episode as a free demo ( a whole episode free! Not just a level or two) incedentally that free demo episode of original doom was far more atmospheric and gripping than the recent DeusEx attempt - again the original Deux Ex was epic, since then they have just cashed in on the name. I could go on like this all day, it's as if after the mid/late 90's games have gradually sacrificed originallity and creativity for graphics and effects (not to mention the odd cameo voice performance by an actor from some sci-fi show or other) that always adds to the sales figures.

[Algorhythmic]

Rixx, on 13 August 2012 - 07:23 AM, said:

What happened is no simple question, it's a combination of issues.

1. Graphics. Graphics are now the answer to every problem. Bigger, prettier, sharper, more color, more explosions, more details! Course that kills your budget for every other element of the game such as quality control, writing, etc. Chris Hartman's recent statements point to this. They've given up doing anything creative because they believe graphics are the hurdle to creativity. Once the graphics are good enough, the games will just improve on their own! Make the game pretty and no one will notice the glitches.

2. $$$. QC costs money, a lot of money. On top of that, it takes time, lots of time. That's time you are not making money. Ship it out as fast as possible, get some income going and fix anything that turns up. Internet makes that easy enough to do, but it's still bad form. It's better to spend that money and time developing sharper, crisper graphics!

3. Rushed production. Big companies push products out early and half finished to meet arbitrary deadlines so they have numbers to show at board meetings and to hopefully push stock prices higher. Suits that are higher up, and have no idea what it takes to make a game, are the ones making these kind of descisions.

4. Status quo. Gamers, in general, are so fanatic about their hobby that they never demand better. Heck, Blizzard could put together a trailer for Diablo 4 tomorrow, release a stick figure based character creation screen the next day, threaten always on requirements, threaten a monthly fee (for a basically single player game) and promise that if you buy now they'll eventually get a game put together sometime before 2020 and they'd probably sell 2 million copies in the first 48 hours. As long as we keep throwing money at them for half baked manure, they'll keep shoveling it to us.

1. Never preorder.
2. Always watch a Let's play on youtube of the game before you get it. Search 'Let's play ___________'

Edited by IlIlI, 13 August 2012 - 07:42 AM.

[DeathAxle]

Not only quality but where has the innovation gone?

Where are the next magic carpet, populous, black and white, theme hospital, dungeon keeper, evil genius etc etc etc coming from?

It seems that all we are getting is a constant respawn of FPS shooters, that years sports games and Japanese cutesy kiddie games.

[Xantha]

Simple answer:

They have been dumbed down to the masses, just like the movie industry.

Glad to see kickstarter pop up as it has allowed the indy developer with more creative ideas a chance to publish their games but the mainstream publishers only want Call of Duty 37, Halo 48, Madden 137 and the supposedly tried and true formulas. Regardless of the quality of each revision. What's more sad is how much they make off a game like madden with a few tweaks each season.

[Mister Blastman]

Woska, on 13 August 2012 - 07:13 AM, said:

Back in the day when graphics were heavily restricted by available technology, the game had to be fun to play. But now you have people that will literally look at the box and say "wow, look at those graphics, I'm going to buy this game" without ever actually knowing what it's about.

I've encountered plenty of these "graphics whores" on here complaining about how MWOL looks. You can't please them and I'd prefer if the game industry just ignore them altogether and pretend they don't exist. They serve no purpose other than to degrade gaming and provide no benefit to improving actual gameplay mechanics (what really matters).

[Hidran]

While that is true, there are still games today that work perfectly. Like starcraft II for example. Bugs were a once in a lifetime thing with that game. And it did not disappoint in the least. Edit: and I think this is almost strictly a console problem. Even with recent Japanese games, they have opted for pretty graphics, not-so-pretty gameplay. Thats why the new Xenoblade chronicles was successful. They had minimum graphics with maximum gameplay.

Edited by Hidran, 15 August 2012 - 01:01 PM.

[Dragonlord]

Triggerhippy, on 13 August 2012 - 07:37 AM, said:

Completely agree, do you remember original Doom coming out? with the first episode as a free demo ( a whole episode free! Not just a level or two) incedentally that free demo episode of original doom was far more atmospheric and gripping than the recent DeusEx attempt - again the original Deux Ex was epic, since then they have just cashed in on the name. I could go on like this all day, it's as if after the mid/late 90's games have gradually sacrificed originallity and creativity for graphics and effects (not to mention the odd cameo voice performance by an actor from some sci-fi show or other) that always adds to the sales figures.

Oh I remember those games with Fondness.
I actually have both Doom 1 and 2, and I still remember just how incredibly fun the original was back in those days.

Speaking of Deus Ex, I agree the Original one was the best one, but did you ever play Deus ex Invisible war?
The last one was in my opinion actually a step up from that one.

DeathAxle, on 13 August 2012 - 07:44 AM, said:

Not only quality but where has the innovation gone?

Where are the next magic carpet, populous, black and white, theme hospital, dungeon keeper, evil genius etc etc etc coming from?

It seems that all we are getting is a constant respawn of FPS shooters, that years sports games and Japanese cutesy kiddie games.

Dont get me started on those FPS games.

I bought BF3 thinking it might be good, it was good enough for me to play it 3 times.
Then I got me Medal OF Honor and Modern Warfare 5, ony to find out that they were almost identical copies of BF3.

Some of my all time favorite games.

Spear Of Destiny (Wolfenstein)
Doom (The original)
Baldurs Gate
Master Of Orion

These are games I still play sometimes because they are entertaining to play.

[JFlash49]

Since 2004 which some regarded as the year of the PC, with great games even to date, it seems as though that "year of the PC" was a sign of the beginning fall of the PC but don't get me wrong PC will live on for as long as games are about though these new games are losing quality. What makes a game fun is substance...many games lack it now a days. Its all about who can make a bullet look more real than why is there a bullet firing in the first place...its safe to say, the "new" generation of so called gamers, producers, designers, etc. aren't about complex and original stories back in the 90's you would simply say " another doom clone, another GTA clone" because it was true.

They are sponging off other persons ideas and not improving it. it needs to stop and they need to actually work on the games and not the graphics. I know some persons might disagree that graphics are important too, yes it is, but when the game is all about graphics its not gonna be good, if guys back in the 70's 80's, could have fun with basic geometric symbols on a screen it goes to show you games arent always about graphics. Lastly, i think its because most of the veteran game creators are dying out, they knew what games were meant to be like.
(feel free to correct me if im wrong)

[Dragonlord]

Mister Blastman, on 13 August 2012 - 07:50 AM, said:

I've encountered plenty of these "graphics whores" on here complaining about how MWOL looks. You can't please them and I'd prefer if the game industry just ignore them altogether and pretend they don't exist. They serve no purpose other than to degrade gaming and provide no benefit to improving actual gameplay mechanics (what really matters).

I do agree with you, though good graphics are important too.
But there has to be a balance between graphics and gameplay.

Hidran, on 13 August 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

while that is true, there are still games today that work perfectly. Like starcraft II for example. bugs were a once in a lifetime thing with that game. And it did not disappoint in the least.

You are right of course, there are games that come out practically bug free.
The games I mentioned in my OP are what I consider worst case.

And as some said, its just as much about innovation as quality.

[Ekpu]

I am a fan of Indie Games.

There are some cool ideas and games out there. Only to name two:

Did you try torchlight (diablo clone). Torchlight 2 with multiplayer feature coming soon.
Or frozen synapse? Cool idea. Maybe not for every one and i have to say i didn't play it really long.

But even if you don't like the game in the end you did spend not much money.