205 replies to this topic

[Nik Van Rhijn]

Highlander Burial has achieved legendary status - it is needed to show the Clans, when they appear, just what they are up against

Edited by Nik Van Rhijn, 11 December 2011 - 12:04 PM.

[Mchawkeye]

I was looking at my X52 HOTAS setup earlier and it made me think. can't we just toggle between melee actions and shooting? press a keyboard button or what ever, and instead of weapon groups, your fire buttons/setup changes to...I don't know...left punch right punch, kick left or right. obviously, if your mech has a weapon/axe or what ever, it would use that to greater effect than just punching. Maybe speed has an effect on the power of the punch to (take a run up and wallop! ex mech).

Though I don't know. I really want to see close combat, but i don;t want it to be too staid and boring.

[Fez Findie]

Dragorath, on 11 December 2011 - 07:45 AM, said:

I fully agree. Charge would be good for noobs which are crashing into an Atlas *muhahhaa* But it would be also nice for everyone. If your arms are gone, your weapons are destroyed, no back up and you can't flee... I don't want to be the playball than.

Yeah, at least SOMETHING on melee! Been lackin' for too long (well, for never XD ) and this post above pretty much encapsulates it. You know, what point is there to still be around in the battlefield if you're pretty much stumped?

Of course, a player in such position would not live for long anyways, but still.

[Torment2]

Melee is good and you see it in nearly every tabletop game. I liked it so much at one point I made a 100T mech much like the Berserker with triple strength myomers on it...nothing quite like shearing a mech in half with one shot.

The thing is with melee at least in tabletop, you couldn't use the weapons in that arm if you used it. How would you propose that be implemented? Kicking is fine, if you missed, you had a chance to fall. The question really lies with punching/melee weapons. I suppose you could have a CD timer for meleeing or somesuch.

[Fez Findie]

I'm also disappointed that this was yet to be shown on this thread.

Guess what my reaction was when this popped in on the instructions.

[TheMagicMan]

It makes sense for the TT game but seems like it would be difficult to implement/very awkward to control and use in a real time computer game. I just don't know how you could make it look convincing (graphically and choreographically). To me it seems like more trouble than it's worth (from a production point of view). Not that it wouldn't be cool though.

[Pht]

You know, I see not a few people posting artwork from the lore - the guys that maintain the lore have said that the art is mostly for "cool factor" and less for being a really good representation of the lore.

Using weapons on a punching arm - Um, the arm holds the weapons port - so you trigger the weapon as it comes around and is pointed at the target 'mech... or really at any time the weapon port is pointed at the target.

...

I could see melee working as a mode switch - when you get that close, tap the appropriate key to switch the arms from "weapons tracking" mode to melee mode (punching is different than tracking with weapons), and than your primary trigger is for "punch" towards what the reticule is targeting (or the nearest thing it can physically reach) - secondary trigger for kick, which wouldn't be very targetable but would have a decent chance of smashing your target down low.

[Fiachdubh]

Melee weapons of the hatchetman and axeman, ramming, stomping on small objects like people and DFA.
Anything else would be too difficult to implement and don't really make sense. All that shoulder rolling, jumping jack, martial art mech nonsense should never have been allowed slip into the novels. It would be impossible with the control systems used and the design of the mechs themslves. Many of them do not even have arms and they are not exactly nimble machines!

[Pht]

Fiachdubh, on 13 December 2011 - 05:10 PM, said:

All that shoulder rolling, jumping jack, martial art mech nonsense should never have been allowed slip into the novels.

Pardon? ... Where in the novels are 'mech pilots shoulder rolling, doing jumping jacks, and martial arts in their 'mechs?!?!?????

Besides which, 'mech physical attacks aren't "nimble" by any means.

They're brute attacks that do damage by bending the armor plates of opposing mechs such that the super-hard armor on those plates shatters like tempered glass...

[Xhaleon]

Pht, on 13 December 2011 - 06:43 PM, said:

...

If you've hung around the forums, just a few novels here and there. No jumping jacks, just stretching and the first ever mech calisthenics parade. A Victor has made a dodge roll or two.

They're good enough for that because neurohelmets.

I tried kicking my home punching bag a few days ago. For some reason, my pants were halfway down at the time. I am still feeling the effects of missing a kick and failing the subsequent roll. Ow.

Only going to be as clumsy as the pilot is...

[VYCanis]

How can anyone not want to be able do this in game.

[Azreall]

A great poll!

Have to say the idea of an axe hitting the opposition never gets old!

Like a few others I would love to the see the option of a shoulder charge....of course if this were introduced I would be of the opinion of making it a high risk/damage delivering attack. For example if you land the attack and if the weight classes are reasonable (example heavy Vs heavy) then the opposition mech should be floored with significant damage (and obviously some damage for yourself). And in the event of you missing your charge there should be some drawbacks like perhaps a significant overheating or difficulty turning around to face the enemy again.

Not sure if jump jetting and landing on your target is considered a melee attack but it's definitely a winner!!! (if you can pull it off......)

[Valdor Constantine]

it would bring the game to life much more to have melee elements such as axes,hatchets and clubbing with limbs as for controlling it, it would be a combination of moving the torso and and jerking the joystick forward and backward as if you were well clubbing or axing something. for simulation sake i would want to make it ridiculously hard to melee.... not just by pushing a button

and the same for charging and ramming depending on your mechs design is its head stationed in the center of the torso or does it sit on top...if its in the center torso you wouldn't want to ram someone head on in fear of crushing the cockpit instead you would dip your torso down and slam into them with your left or right arms.....just somethings that i think would add to the melee experience

Edited by Valdor Constantine, 15 December 2011 - 10:36 PM.

[Valdor Constantine]

VYCanis, on 14 December 2011 - 12:07 PM, said:

How can anyone not want to be able do this in game.

this is WIN

[Dredger]

The only time I'd be using melee attacks would be if I rounded a corner to find an enemy charging up an alpha strike at point blank range. Quick punch to the torso to knock off his aim and then sprint for distance.

[Red Beard]

I would have to say that the only melee attacks that might "feel" feasible to me would be charging into your opponent mech to knock them over or at least knock them out of their aiming. Otherwise, STUPID!!

[pcunite]

Personally ... this isn't Street Fighter or Mortal Combat ... if it was I would not be interested. Why go to the trouble of building a 30 foot structure to then only kick with it?

The notion of Melee therefore is really about defining what an act of desperation is. What would make a person become so desperate as to destroy their very expensive mech that way ...

Death ... if you really fear dying, if what you do in a mech really matters, if you really want to come home again ... then sure ... crash into another mech and maybe live to see another day ... that is the only place I can see this sort of outrages behavior making any sense.

[Phades]

pcunite, on 16 December 2011 - 06:10 PM, said:

Personally ... this isn't Street Fighter or Mortal Combat ... if it was I would not be interested. Why go to the trouble of building a 30 foot structure to then only kick with it?

The notion of Melee therefore is really about defining what an act of desperation is. What would make a person become so desperate as to destroy their very expensive mech that way ...

Death ... if you really fear dying, if what you do in a mech really matters, if you really want to come home again ... then sure ... crash into another mech and maybe live to see another day ... that is the only place I can see this sort of outrages behavior making any sense.

Er what? Not ever map setup is an entirely open killing field with unlimited firing arcs. Not every mech is setup to snipe from between 12-22 hexes either. There are close range mechs that live in the 0-3 range optimally. Actually going nose to nose with those machines against an opponent, you get the bonus of melee attacks in addition to your weapons with the side benefit of no heat generation. It is also the entire point of having hand actuators at all within the game, or to take it a step further, why they even bothered to implement rules for ripping trees out of the ground, picking up blown off limbs, or steel girders out of buildings to use as a club. This also ignores entirely mechs that come stock with swords and hatchets.

"Desperate acts" were DFA and charging. Tactical maneuvers and strikes involved punches, clubs, and kicks.

[Xhaleon]

Phades, on 16 December 2011 - 09:06 PM, said:

Er what?

It's just the people who were introduced through the video game, and were duped into a false view of what BT is like. Kinda sad that some people actually want to have less control over their machine, realistic explanations or no.

Which there are no such realistic explanations against kicking, by the way. You walk on your feet all the time, and they take the stress of supporting your weight just fine. Kicking someone is like walking on his face, only sideways. And then you may literally walk on their face once his hand-less mech has its arse firmly planted on the ground, due to his Clanner idea that kicking is for desperate barbarians.

Edited by Xhaleon, 16 December 2011 - 09:39 PM.

[Phades]

Xhaleon, on 16 December 2011 - 09:34 PM, said:

It's just the people who were introduced through the video game, and were duped into a false view of what BT is like. Kinda sad that some people actually want to have less control over their machine, realistic explanations or no.

Which there are no such realistic explanations against kicking, by the way. You walk on your feet all the time. Kicking someone is like walking on their face, only sideways. And then literally walking on their face once their hand-less Clanner mech is on its arse.

Even within the video game indoctrinations, just looking at the weapon values you would be able to tell that design A is going to operate at 0-500 meters while design B is going to operate between 800-1,200 meters.

Perhaps I assume too much when I guess that would be "common sense".