213 replies to this topic

[KlLLFACE]

Bollards. I like the Bushwacker. And I really don't understand some of the stuff they say they've forgotten when they've got stuff that's so close it's BS and how many intelligent people to work on it?

[Thundrawolf]

I would like to see the vulture mech or the mad cat in....

[El Loco]

It's way off topic, but there's a huge difference between being able to produce something and understanding the fundamentals behind the technology produced. For example: Our ancestors started to use fire before they knew how to make it. We knew about ballistic curves before we understood newtonian mechanics (which include the underlying principles). Plus, BT was created before we entered the age of the internet, when most data still were analog, not digital as in our days. Analog data are by far easier to destroy than digitally stored knowledge. From a modern point of view the loss of knowledge during the succession wars, as described in the lore, is too much. But, the repercussions on new developments are reasonable.

[ScreamingSkull]

Zervziel, on 28 February 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

Wow, according to this thread there are only about 4-5 IS assault mechs in this time period because everyone keeps hitting the same dang ones. Why not go for something new? I'd like to see a Nightstar or a Pillager over the Awesome. Yes, it's a good mech, but I want some variety

You answered your own question. Nightstar and Pillager don't exist in 3049. It's highly unlikely they will be available at launch so they aren't worth discussing.

What could be discussed is how soon mechs from different eras will be implemented? I doubt that players will want to wait until 2021 to get a Pillager.

[KlLLFACE]

But really would they not have enough smart guys to simply look at it until they figured it out? Or use what they did know as a basis and work from there?

Edited by KlLLFACE, 29 February 2012 - 02:18 AM.

[El Loco]

I'd say... no. Sometimes it's a royal pain in the arse to figure out what your lab mates are doing, and you have them available all the time to explain their research to you. Some papers you have to read several times, not because you're stupid, but because they're poorly written or push the boundaries decades into the future. Sure, an engineer will be able to read a circuit diagram, but if what is shown there doesn't make any sense to you... you won't be able to build the design (or improve/develope it further). And if you had an understanding of what is going on in the blueprint, but you don't have the technology to build the components at your disposal, you simply can't build the weapon/'Mech/jumpship. Again, I totally agree on that the extent to which knowledge was lost is rather unlikely from a modern point of view, but the way standstill in scientific progress is depicted in the BT universe is accurate.

[Masterrix]

I'm hoping for:


Light:

• Wolfhound

Medium

• Phoenix Hawk

Heavy

• Warhammer

Assault

• Kodiak

[Tizzer]

@Masterrix We can't have the Kodiak (I'm pretty sure it's clan)
Personally Both the wolfhound and Warhammer are favourites of mine and really hope to see them , Assualtwise it's gonna be the awesome that or marauder (which I'd personally prefer) Mediumwise I don't have a clue, but there's my 2 C-bills (saving the rest for the warhammer XD )

[KlLLFACE]

Perhaps a certain amount, but not the amount they try and say, a lot of it could easily be redeveloped with 50 years or so of reasearch from where they supposedly where. But then again, it is fiction.

[El Loco]

I'd strongly disagree... It's only from our point of view that knowledge is near indestructable. And it rediscovering knowledge is hard. When the library of Alexandria burned down in 48BC we lost a lot of the ancient Greek and Egyptian advancement (e.g. knowledge on eye and brain surgery). We started to rediscover this knowledge 1500 years later when Da Vinci conducted his anatomical studies in secrecy. Fundamental research, once lost, can be lost forever, because it usually is associated with a great mind of a time... just think about Quantum Mechanics, which is based on Einstein's work from the early 20th century.

What I'm trying to stress is that it can easily take you centuries to rediscover knowledge, the more so if scientists are unwilling or unable to communicate with one another.

BTT: The Marodeur weighs in at 75t, therefore it isn't an assault 'Mech, but sure is one of the fan favourites. As long as we don't hear any news on the Unseen-Reseen-issue I wouldn't consider the Marodeur likely to be part of the initial 12, though.

[KlLLFACE]

But dude if there's a eg: laser cannon sitting there how exactly could they not look at it piece by piece and deduce how it functions? I doubt they are that stupid man(Don't get me wrong man I've known some people that couldn't refold a piece of paper let alone do something that complex, but not everyone is that stupid.). If they understand things similar that have got similar theories and fundamentals how exactly is it a huge jump? Past a certain extent yeah that is plausible, but there's some really basic stuff in Battle Tech they try and say they simply forgot. I really think they exaggerated it a bit man. More than was plausible

Edited by KlLLFACE, 29 February 2012 - 07:43 AM.

[El Loco]

I agree... from our perspective, some aspects are clearly overexaggerated. But I don't mind... maybe it's a different perspective I have on things, as I'm usually dealing with ages in the range from 65 to 251 million years (and what was lost over these intervalls is just mind blowing)

[Karyudo ds]

KlLLFACE, on 29 February 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

Bollards. I like the Bushwacker. And I really don't understand some of the stuff they say they've forgotten when they've got stuff that's so close it's BS and how many intelligent people to work on it?

Just a thought but the Bushy was designed based off of Vulture parts specifically if I remember...seeing as that mech isn't around it would make little sense to have a mech based off it, even if we could build it. Oddly enough the Battletech cartoon intentionally ignored that fact. PGI can I suppose do whatever they want far as timeline goes but I suspect it wont be around for awhile, but being popular, that it will show up eventually.

Personally I find all these post 3050 speculations sort of funny. I thought the point of starting pre-invasion was partly so that the Inner Sphere could get the classic mechs it had in that era...not so much the Bushy and Uziels that were popular in MW4 (a game which occurred a decade or so later)

KlLLFACE, on 29 February 2012 - 07:18 AM, said:

But dude if there's a eg: laser cannon sitting there how exactly could they not look at it piece by piece and deduce how it functions?

Good luck trying to figure out how to make working laser cannons when I just broke all of yours. The Succession Wars weren't about just "forgetting" weapons advancements but having them and the factories that make them explode into billions of pieces. Granted, I agree it was always ridiculous that there weren't enough factories to keep things going. Of course that part of Battletech was written awhile ago before this whole internet thing took off as is evident by some of it's design decisions you'd never get away with today.

[karish]

Thundrawolf, on 29 February 2012 - 12:49 AM, said:

I would like to see the vulture mech or the mad cat in....

Please read the chat topic CLAN mechs dont exist yet. YOU do not khow about them in the time line

[Stovebolt]

Light: Firestarter
Med: Trebuchet
Hvy: Warhammer, just cause we saw it in the trailer..I really like Riflemen too.
***: Cyclops and Awesome, because it has it right there in the title.

[KlLLFACE]

Yeah I know the factories going kablammo would set them back a bit, but if they've still got a working version of what that factory produced sitting there they'd not need more than what? 50 years probably to get a working prototype operational, there is a thing called reverse engineering mate, And how BS populated are the houses? That's a lot of smart people dude. And if they are in conflict with other houses that's a lot of incentive to work on that sort of stuff. a certain amount of setback sure it's plausible, I simply think they try and use it as a excuse for too many things.

And Warhammer? You know that was copied from Macross(Robotech)? Battletech was successfully sued about that (Originally a destroid), the rifleman (can't remember what it was called, another type of destroid possibly)and the one that was a copy of the VF-21. Maybe even 1 or 2 others.

Edited by KlLLFACE, 29 February 2012 - 07:07 PM.

[Muscrat]

Are Uziels not with the timeline? Haven't seen anything about that medium mech...

[Jack Gallows]

Muscrat, on 29 February 2012 - 07:47 PM, said:

Are Uziels not with the timeline? Haven't seen anything about that medium mech...

No, they don't hit the street till after 3064, or there abouts.

[FinnMcKool]

KlLLFACE, on 29 February 2012 - 02:14 AM, said:

But really would they not have enough smart guys to simply look at it until they figured it out? Or use what they did know as a basis and work from there?

I for get who it was but there was a guy who reinvented cement ,yes it was a lost technology , the truth is we are just today making it slightly better than the Romans did,

and to that effect I understand that the original idea of battle tech storie/ universe was taken from the history of the rise and fall of the Roman Empire,

[Cifu]

Tuhalu, on 27 February 2012 - 05:39 PM, said:

...
So:
Light = Commando, Spider, Jenner.
Medium = Centurion, Hunchback, Trebuchet.
Heavy = Dragon, Catapult, Orion.
Assault = Awesome, Stalker, Atlas.

When i started to read the topic, i was build up something similar toughs, as you do. But with different lookups.

Light mechs:

Commando, Jenner, Urbanmech

You can point out easly why. The Urbi has a great fanbase, and actually fit very well on list. It's a light Mech, but the if you think over the roles, you can spot the three row:

Commando -> Scout / Attack / (Command)
Jenner -> Scout
Urbanmech -> Defense

Medium mechs:

Centurion, Hunchback, Assassin

It's a hard call. The Blackjack is my first favorite, the Hatchetman is my second (yea, i know: without melee fight, it's a bad call), but then thinking about it, and find the scout role need something, so i choose the Assassin instead.

Assassin -> Scout
Centurion -> Attack / Command
Hunchback -> Defense / (Command)

Heavy Mechs

Dragon, Catapult, Orion

The Orion fit very well in the list, and in the Heavy lineup, the scouts are forbidden call. All three mech are capable the Attack / Defense / Command role, some are better in this, some are better in that, but no clear call for the roles, but if needed, my personal viewpoint:

Dragon -> Attack
Catapult -> Defense
Orion -> Command




Assault Mechs

Awesome, Zeus, Atlas

The Awesome is out of the question, it's "needed" in the line, and actually have a great fanbase too. The only question is the Zeus or the Stalker, for some reason, i put the Zeus to the list too, because it's faster than the Atlas or the Awesome, so it's have some rights edge in the role warefare.

Awesome -> Attack / Defense
Zeus -> Attack / (Defense)
Atlas -> Attack / Defense / Command

Edited by Cifu, 29 February 2012 - 10:49 PM.