76 replies to this topic

[phalanx]

You knew it was coming.

So we will have a Mech Lab. Here is what we know thus far:

Quote

Bryan: Absolutely! Like previous MechWarrior titles, the MechWarrior Online economy revolves around managing one or more giant mechanized robots, called BattleMechs. Each `Mech has a role on the battlefield and is fully customizable by the player using an intuitive menu system called MechLab. Customizations include weapons, armor, along with other accessories, and modules. Players earn an in-game currency, called C-Bills which is used to buy new `Mechs, equipment, ammo, and perform repairs. The MWO economy rewards players by excelling at their chosen role on the battlefield. Each match played ends with a summary screen outlining their contract earnings, and bonuses in C-Bills. We expect and encourage players to maximizing match earnings by focusing on a role suitable to their play style.

What I am thinking of is if a Mech already exists that fits a player's playstyle, but they cannot get it for whatever reason(went broke paying for repairs), how will the Devs balance the Mech Lab so that players cannot simply create a near-clone of the Mech they want with the Mech they own?

Is this not really that much of an issue?

[TheRulesLawyer]

They've also mentioned engine size as an option to change and that the weapons are hardpoint based.

[SI The Joker]

Based on what I heard in that video, there will be variants which can then be customized using hardpoints.

If I've understood it all correctly, not all variants had the same amounts of hardpoints (or locations of) or were capable of using the same equipment. Some had JJs available, some did not. The whole point of variants would be to utilize an Atlas mech in numerous ways allowing for many different play styles but at the same time almost eliminating the possibility of an "uber mech" or a mech that "has it all".

That was my view on it.

EDIT: You can check out all the different variants of mechs on Sarna too... you'll get an idea of what I mean.

Edited by SI The Joker, 09 March 2012 - 03:37 PM.

[Ragotag]

I think there is a more important concern depending on the hardpoint system mentioned elsewhere... would the MechLab allow for the creation of pure PPC, Large Laser, and/or LRM boats? I hope they don't. It's one thing to say, downgrade a medium laser to a small laser so that you can add more armor or heat sinks, but (IMO) a bad thing to allow the exchange of a Catapult's LRM's for say PPC's. If the hardpoint system at least means that only weapons of a similar class can be configured on a given hardpoint, then it should work out pretty well.

Edited by Ragotag, 09 March 2012 - 03:46 PM.

[Orzorn]

In the video, hardpoints were mentioned. So we're going to have cross between mechwarrior 2/3 mechlab and mechwarrior 4 mechlab. Hardpoints, in my opinion, are a good thing. They more closely resemble the canon for non-omni mechs, and they limit your capabilities to the chassis variant. They also have criticals, so we still get critical hits and everything like that as well, which is great.

[Dumat]

All I have to say is that I hope we have some degree of control over Mech loadouts. The hardpoint idea seems pretty cool, but I guess we're just gonna have to trust the devs on this one.

[Leetskeet]

Ragotag, on 09 March 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

I think there is a more important concern depending on the hardpoint system mentioned elsewhere... would the MechLab allow for the creation of pure PPC, Large Laser, and/or LRM boats? I hope they don't. It's one thing to say, downgrade a medium laser to a small laser so that you can add more armor or heat sinks, but (IMO) a bad thing to allow the exchange of a Catapult's LRM's for say PPC's. If the hardpoint system at least means that only weapons of a similar class can be configured on a given hardpoint, then it should work out pretty well.

There's a Catapult variant with PPC's already.

[Ragotag]

Leetskeet, on 09 March 2012 - 03:52 PM, said:

There's a Catapult variant with PPC's already.

Okay, perhaps not the best example, but you get my point regardless.

[TheRulesLawyer]

I think the big question on hardpoints is "Are hardpoints typed? Can you remove a LRM and put an energy weapon in its place?" That's give a much larger clue on flexibility. You might end up having to buy the variant with the right type of hardpoint.

[Brakkyn]

I don't mind customization--I'm concerned with the amount of it.

I also draw a line between a canon boat and a player-made boat. The former is preferred to the latter.

My thinking is, you might be able to remove a weapon system, but instead of attaching another weapon system, you have to substitute the granted weight for armor, speed, or something else. If you slow your 'Mech down, you add armor or weapons. Remove armor, add speed or weapons.

Or perhaps each variant has different types of hardpoints. A stock Hunchback might have one particular layout for weapons, but the Swayback might have a completely different hardpoint layout.

Or maybe "customizing your loadout" means you buy a base Catapult, then in the MechLab decide which variant to pilot in the upcoming drop, so you always own the base 'Mech, but not a specific variant.

I don't know. We'll know later this month.

Edited by Brakkyn, 10 March 2012 - 07:07 PM.

[Sprouticus]

Im totally fine with a hardpoint/crit based syste, (assuming you have limits on weaopn type).

So you have critical slots Someone suggested in another thread that you could make non weapon items take critical slots (ECM, CASe, etc) and allow them to be placed in any critical slot,

I have two concerns.

1) What is to stop someone in say an atlas from stripping ALL the armor from one arm, removing the medium laser, and jacking up the speed and heatsinks. Removing the weapon is one thing. Turning the arm into a shell is another. This happened all the time in MW4, and while I did it as much as the next guys, it always bugged me.


2) The one aspect of modification that really bugs me is changing the engine. Im guessing the modificaiton in the mechlab will cost a LOT of C-Bills (far less for omnimechs when they come around). But even with that it was suppposed to be almost impossible to change the engine in a mech. I suppose if you made engine costs crazy expensive I would not mind too much, but no being able to change them at all would be better.


Summary:

• Let people change their mech in the mechlab (before entering the queue to drop).
  
• Charge an arm and a leg to mod mechs. Dont make it something you do every drop, more like something ou do once a week or two.
  
• Dont allow engine changes, or if you do, make it CRAZY expensive
  
• use a hardpoint/crit system, with weapon hardpoints being limited by type and non weapon systems able to be placed anywhere
  
• finally ammo should have to be in the same or ajacent mech areas, no putting ammo in the leg for an arm weapon.

[Thomas Hogarth]

Sprouticus, on 09 March 2012 - 04:31 PM, said:

Im totally fine with a hardpoint/crit based syste, (assuming you have limits on weaopn type).

So you have critical slots Someone suggested in another thread that you could make non weapon items take critical slots (ECM, CASe, etc) and allow them to be placed in any critical slot,

I have two concerns.

1) What is to stop someone in say an atlas from stripping ALL the armor from one arm, removing the medium laser, and jacking up the speed and heatsinks. Removing the weapon is one thing. Turning the arm into a shell is another. This happened all the time in MW4, and while I did it as much as the next guys, it always bugged me.


2) The one aspect of modification that really bugs me is changing the engine. Im guessing the modificaiton in the mechlab will cost a LOT of C-Bills (far less for omnimechs when they come around). But even with that it was suppposed to be almost impossible to change the engine in a mech. I suppose if you made engine costs crazy expensive I would not mind too much, but no being able to change them at all would be better.


Summary:

• Let people change their mech in the mechlab (before entering the queue to drop).
  
• Charge an arm and a leg to mod mechs. Dont make it something you do every drop, more like something ou do once a week or two.
  
• Dont allow engine changes, or if you do, make it CRAZY expensive
  
• use a hardpoint/crit system, with weapon hardpoints being limited by type and non weapon systems able to be placed anywhere
  
• finally ammo should have to be in the same or ajacent mech areas, no putting ammo in the leg for an arm weapon.

Well, if they do go the big customization route, an easy nerf to stripping armor would be to make the ruined location transmit damage as it does on TT. So, destroyed arm? Damage goes to side torso. Destroyed side torso? Damage goes to CT. You get the idea.

For my money, I hope that the 'hardpoint customization' is limited to packages. Example: Replace PPC with LL+heatsinks. Replace AC with PPC. Replace LRM rack with SRM racks. Replace LRM rack with armor. So on, so forth. And make them expensive as hell.

[Ragotag]

TheRulesLawyer, on 09 March 2012 - 04:01 PM, said:

I think the big question on hardpoints is "Are hardpoints typed? Can you remove a LRM and put an energy weapon in its place?" That's give a much larger clue on flexibility. You might end up having to buy the variant with the right type of hardpoint.

I don't see a problem with this kind of MechLab system. It would at least ensure that weapon loadouts would fit with the appropriate variant. As long as hardpoints are typed (energy, ballistic, missile), it really can't be abused.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Phalanx, on 09 March 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

You knew it was coming.

So we will have a Mech Lab. Here is what we know thus far:


What I am thinking of is if a Mech already exists that fits a player's playstyle, but they cannot get it for whatever reason(went broke paying for repairs), how will the Devs balance the Mech Lab so that players cannot simply create a near-clone of the Mech they want with the Mech they own?

Is this not really that much of an issue?

Seems like buying the chassis and all the weapons would cost about the same as buying the mech, right? Now if you want to clone a Panther say, then sure you might get away with another mech carrying a Large Laser, but then all you have is a poor man's Panther. Which sounds like no big deal to me....

[NikkoKilla]

The devs so far have stressed balancing the f2p aspect of the entire game, mech lab included. Why should a player who has the desire not be able to have 2 or even 5 of the same mech in their purvue? Guess im mising the OPs point, but i dont forsee any problems with the current predicted setup.

Knowing more about what hardpoint customization will allow i think is required to continue speculating.

Edited by WhenKatzComes, 09 March 2012 - 07:49 PM.

[Dlardrageth]

The question posed in the thread title answers itself for me. "The Great Mech Lab" sounds so unbelievably cheesy that it disqualifies itself. At least "Mech Variant" sounds somewhat normal, and would thus get my vote.

[NikkoKilla]

Dlardrageth, on 09 March 2012 - 07:53 PM, said:

The question posed in the thread title answers itself for me. "The Great Mech Lab" sounds so unbelievably cheesy that it disqualifies itself. At least "Mech Variant" sounds somewhat normal, and would thus get my vote.

Come on tho, mech labs are so central to every battletech experience. Variants just circumvent the 'but that loadout isnt canon!!' Issue =P

[Dlardrageth]

WhenKatzComes, on 09 March 2012 - 07:56 PM, said:

Come on tho, mech labs are so central to every battletech experience. Variants just circumvent the 'but that loadout isnt canon!!' Issue =P

I bet thousands of BT TT players who played (at least initially) with stock Mechs and canon variants would beg to differ. Thus not likely "every BattleTech experience"...

Edited by Dlardrageth, 09 March 2012 - 08:01 PM.

[NikkoKilla]

I spose if u keep it on a board game how bout every electronic experience?

[Dlardrageth]

WhenKatzComes, on 09 March 2012 - 08:04 PM, said:

I spose if u keep it on a board game how bout every electronic experience?

Ever played the very first in the series, MechWarrior1? And its awesome MechLab... oh... wait...