90 replies to this topic

[Siilk]

Voted yes. With that said, I'm in no way want them "RIGHT NOW!", but rather as one of distant goals for MWO to reach for(think 2-3 years after release). I want MWO to eventually end up as a full-fledged BT combined arms sim, much like ARMA is, with all BT assets: mechs, tanks aeros and infantry being playable and useful part of the warfare. MWLL showed us the way, it is possible to make BT combined arms warfare into a fun and balanced sim game, so I really want MWO to follow this example.

[Seabear]

Battle armor will have a place in the univese, but that is not goiung to happen soon. The clans introduced BA much to the surprise and discomfort of those IS warriors on the battlefield. I would rather see them as NPCs rarther than a playable choice, after all this is a Mechwarrior game not a battle armor game. I can only think of one instance where a mechwarrior used battle armor and that a special raid. No jumping into battlearmor in the midst of a battle. Donning said armor was a process that took a great deal of time nad a full crew to accomplish.

[Carl Wrede]

I would love to see Battlearmor, vehicles, Solaris tournaments and all the other good stuff added later as expansions when hopefully the game is such a success that they have time and money to work on expansions.

[Darth JarJar]

Seabear, on 25 March 2012 - 08:00 AM, said:

Donning said armor was a process that took a great deal of time nad a full crew to accomplish.

Lost Destiny
Blood of Kerensky: Volume three
Chapter 41, page 307
"Normally, the chest assembly is already together and just lowered onto the waist. If really pressed and very tired, an Elemental can lay the whole thing on the ground and wriggle down into it."......Tamon Malthus

It is possible to don the armor by oneself, but don't take this to mean that I endorse BA ala MW:LL. If anything, it should be an NPC item once the Clans hit.

Edited by von Bremerhaven, 25 March 2012 - 08:25 AM.

[Gremlich Johns]

You want battlearmors?

check out the ones in this

[Peace Possum]

No! No no no. Go play MWLL if you want to run around in a BA.
Do you realize how much more coding they'll have to do if they have to implement BA players? Do you realize the resource expenditure?
I love Elementals, I really do. I think they're one of the coolest thing about Battletech. and I think they should appear in the game, but only as Clan asset NPCs, either a call-in for Clan commanders if they let us play as the Clanners or more NPCs to go with the NPC attacking clanners if that's the route they take.

[VarietyOfCells]

I voted no, because they are annoying as hell, especially if they all have jump jets. I've been playing MWLL and I hate people who insist on playing as battle armor. You can say "they are so weak you can just stomp on them" but good luck doing that. They can hop around and hide in cracks and annoy the hell out of you. And nothing is worse than getting taken out by a BA. I'm so very glad they won't be in MWO. They annoy me to no end.

[FERAL TIGER]

I do think a form of support vehicles would add to the gameplay (artillery, VTOL, or other things that can slow down a pack of light mechs). But battle armor would be tough to implement at the start of the game, and would do more harm than good.

I feel the main benefit of getting out of mech in games like this is to notice the magnitude of the mechs, otherwise, if you're smallest weapon is 15 tons, you may lose sight of the power present on the battlefield.

[Terick]

I want NPC BA in the future. The clans dont' have nearly as much fear with out them.

I also want tanks, aero and VTOLs in the future.

BATTLETECH is full on warfare. All types of units. Mechwarriors are just one part of it. The clans with their all powerful mechs still needed standard INF, not even Power armored INF to keep the peace.

Are they annoying? They are supposed to be able to take out mechs. I would say they are supposed to be feared. Light mechs can get hurt easily in one or two volleys. Meds are probably best to deal with them. Hvs and salts can take the damage short term... but a point (5 troopers) swarming a heavy or assault can easily kill it if the pilot can't get them off.

Best way to deal with them? Tanks. Think of it as the rock paper scissors of other games. Mechs beat tanks, Power armor Beats Mechs and Tanks beat Power armor.

[Gods Eye]

I thought I wanted them until I played MWLL, they are obnoxious as hell. However, I think it could work if they were subject to periphery damage. For example, when a ppc or gauss shell explodes a few inches away and they take no damage it becomes frustrating very quickly.

Edited by Gods Eye, 25 March 2012 - 09:15 PM.

[Siilk]

Gods Eye, on 25 March 2012 - 09:14 PM, said:

I thought I wanted them until I played MWLL, they are obnoxious as hell. However, I think it could work if they were subject to periphery damage. For example, when a ppc or gauss shell explodes a few inches away and they take no damage it becomes frustrating very quickly.

<OT>
MWLL BAs are subject to(increased) splash damage for any weapon with such: PPCs, missiles, large-bore ACs etc. Low-cal ACs and Gauss are strictly AP weapons, so they have no splash damage.
</OT>

[Kael Tropheus]

They are supposed to be annoying as hell and cause pyshological effects more than real effects. In the fluff the IS paniced so bad about them they developed a whole series of mechs specifically to counter them only to find out by the time these new anti-BA mechs hit the field, pilots had learned through experience how to deal with them.

Tanks get torn apart by mechs. A mech can use its arms to wipe elementals off or aid a fellow mech do the same. A tank is SOL if an elemental gets on it unless a nearby tank or mech can help. What is the crew going to do, open the hatch to shoot with a sidearm a infantry unit desinged to take anti-tank weaponry?

We would not see them at the start anyway, they didnt appear until the clans showed up. Coding wise, by then we will already have melee attacks in theory, so all they have to do is code a mech with a very short vantage point, good manueverability, and a small melee weapon. Pilots who drive BA can never drive mechs for obvious reasons. Blam done, there is BA.

[LordDeathStrike]

Paul Inouye, on 24 March 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

* sadface *

I'm going to leave this one open... it seems that no matter how many times these threads get locked and we state that you will not be getting out of your 'Mechs, the topic keeps popping up. That being said, all future topics on battle armor will be merged into this. Then one day, we will make this thread explode.

well just because that mediocre mod mwll has you in battle armor if you leave your mech, doesnt actually mean it fits in a mechs cockpit, because it doesnt.

a fully battle armored clan elemental warrior, is 10 feet high, 6 feet wide, and weighs about 2 tons. mech cockpits are cramped if you are over 6 foot high, or 3 foot wide, or over 200 pounds. this is canon lore, suck it nerds, suck it dry.

[LordDeathStrike]

Terick, on 25 March 2012 - 06:30 PM, said:

I want NPC BA in the future. The clans dont' have nearly as much fear with out them.

I also want tanks, aero and VTOLs in the future.

BATTLETECH is full on warfare. All types of units. Mechwarriors are just one part of it. The clans with their all powerful mechs still needed standard INF, not even Power armored INF to keep the peace.

Are they annoying? They are supposed to be able to take out mechs. I would say they are supposed to be feared. Light mechs can get hurt easily in one or two volleys. Meds are probably best to deal with them. Hvs and salts can take the damage short term... but a point (5 troopers) swarming a heavy or assault can easily kill it if the pilot can't get them off.

Best way to deal with them? Tanks. Think of it as the rock paper scissors of other games. Mechs beat tanks, Power armor Beats Mechs and Tanks beat Power armor.

point of 5 bas on my atlas back? easy, trust fall! splat. cause aint no one gonna catch a falling atlas, and its gonna squishem when it hits the dirt.

ps this is why TT has rear fireing lasers and mguns, to kill ba's.

[Kael Tropheus]

Wait, MWLL has you in battle armor if you get out of your mech? Really? WOW

Yeah, BA is something you train exclusively in, not just wear around. You start the battle in Battle armor and end it in battle armor. Next battle if you survive, you start in battle armor and end it in battle armor. There is no cross training to drive a mech. An elemental will not fit in a mech cockpit.

Now I am understanding the negativity against BA on here. Thats laughable, glad I never played MWLL.

[Dr Killinger]

I'm sorry, but in MWLL when there are BA on the other team, they irritate the hell out of me while I try to shoot them, but their laggy jittery movements make it nigh impossible. When half my team rolls in Battle Armour, we lose, because 5 mechs will always be better than 5 BA. I will do anything to ensure they never make it into MWO.

[Kael Tropheus]

Now I understand the frustration with them, if they are properly implemented I fail to see the problem. Having one point of elementals per binary would be fine. They are a major part of the clan invasion and not having them would be a hollow clan as they are part of the three big advantages the clans have over the IS(BA, Omnitech, better overall gear and pilots).

That said, a Battle armor character needs to be just that. A clan elemental created at character creation. No mech piloting skills or switching around. Weapon varieties would be machine guns or small lasers and 2 SR Missiles. Upgrades could be as simple as allowing the laser to be ER or Pulse and missiles to be Streak or Inferno rounds.

They are absolutely supposed to aggravate mech pilots, thats what they do. One elemental against even a light mech would be a hard fight for the elemental. In a complete point they would be very dangerous to it. Against a large mech they would be more of a nuisance but hardly lethal to an assault mech with nearby teammates. This would actually encourage real team function as a Point of elementals go out and stalk lone wolves and recon mechs or jump in at an opportune moment in a bigger fight to help take down a bigger mech.

In no way shape or form though should any normal mech pilot be allowed to pilot BA or vice versa. A mech pilot that gets out of their mech is wearing a cooling vest and shorts or a bikini bottom, not battle armor and is hardly suitable for continuing the fight on foot. Clan and Comstar would be wearing those high tech flight suits. Same boat though as all they have in their cockpits usually are a side arm and survival knife.

[Trevnor]

Kael Tropheus, on 26 March 2012 - 03:12 AM, said:

Yeah, BA is something you train exclusively in, not just wear around. You start the battle in Battle armor and end it in battle armor. Next battle if you survive, you start in battle armor and end it in battle armor. There is no cross training to drive a mech. An elemental will not fit in a mech cockpit.

I'm just going to point something out there. That is not always the case, there are a few exceptions, such as the DEST commandos from the Draconis Combine. They were cross-trained for Battle Armour, 'mechs, and aerospace fighters, as well as experts in hand-to-hand combat, and Close Quarters Combat. Also, another exception to that statement would be The Bounty Hunter. He primarily piloted Battle Armour, but could easily pilot 'mechs as well. But overall, you are correct, most mechwarriors are just mechwarriors, etc.

I myself would like to see them implemented, at a later date. Especially as part of the Clan invasions. Those Elementals were all a part of the shock value, and helped to push the invasion in as far as it did. Sure, they are annoying, but that' is there whole point. One point of five should be able to take down a 'mech, and when they are or if they are implemented in game, it just means you'd have to be a bit more careful, stay close to your lance mates, and be quick to move fast if Elementals suddenly spring up beside you.

Edited by Lt Trevnor, 26 March 2012 - 04:50 AM.

[Kenyon Burguess]

i voted for, but as NPC's only.

[LackofCertainty]

To everyone in this thread that keeps saying "Battlefield does infantry + vehicles," I just want to say this. I don't want to play battlefield. If I wanted to play battlefield, I would play battlefield. Combined forces are a neat idea, but in the end it's about the mechs for me. I don't want to pilot a jet. There's tons of games where I can pilot jets. I don't want to be infantry, there's tons of games where I can be infantry. I want to pilot a mech. Hell, if you want combined forces so badly then go play the Living Legends mod.

In an ideal world where the devs pooped gold ingots and therefor had the funding to do anything and everything, sure. Have them hire a whole second team to work on vehicle/infantry/elemental balance while they focus on Mechs. While they're at it, have them hire another team to build out a mmo-style world to set it all in, complete with RP servers for the nuts who want to live out their life as a clanner in real time.

In the real world, just focus on the mechs and leave it at that.