30 replies to this topic

[pesco]

Garth Erlam, on 30 March 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

Hahaha, I'm not saying don't come up with ideas, I'm just pointing out where there are physical limitations - heavy particle effects are a massive draw on modern cards. So perhaps we can think of a similar idea, with that limitation in mind?

Hm, just a thought... actually while in the fog, rendering could be faster, because you need not render geometry past the visible range. :D
Then again, it still has to look good from the outside and I have no idea what I'm talking about. ^^

[VeiledMalice]

pesco, on 30 March 2012 - 12:21 PM, said:

Hm, just a thought... actually while in the fog, rendering could be faster, because you need not render geometry past the visible range.
Then again, it still has to look good from the outside and I have no idea what I'm talking about. ^^

It's not the same thing. The engine still renders the environment, even when you're not seeing it due to particle effects. What you're talking about is reduced draw distance, a purpose-built fog to cut down on things the engine needs to render to help out on low-end systems, like Skyrim on the 360.

[pesco]

VeiledMalice, on 30 March 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

What you're talking about is reduced draw distance, a purpose-built fog to cut down on things the engine needs to render to help out on low-end systems [...].

Exactly.

[Tannhauser Gate]

Graphics cards being what they are, you cant have too much haze, dust, and smoke effects because those push the limits of people's hardware and create issues with fairness and balance.

As much as I want to see realistic dense fog, smoke, dust, ash etc.. You cant impose graphic-intense conditions when x percent of players will suffer with poor playability even if they have pretty good hardware (but not the best). Also, you cant make it an option because then everyone will have to turn it off just to compete with few elitist system minmaxers who turn off anything they can that affects their frames per second.

So, to be fair but also fun, the effects are enjoyable but abbreviated such as what we saw in the trailers.

[FinnMcKool]

I have dust allergy's , maple pollen also so dont be too realistic or Ill be having a hard time playing in those environments.

[SinAKill]

LakeDaemon, on 30 March 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

So, to be fair but also fun, the effects are enjoyable but abbreviated such as what we saw in the trailers.

Garth Erlam, on 30 March 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

Hahaha, I'm not saying don't come up with ideas, I'm just pointing out where there are physical limitations - heavy particle effects are a massive draw on modern cards. So perhaps we can think of a similar idea, with that limitation in mind?

No I understand I would find a less extensive graphical effect absolutely ok, but maybe couple it with a cockpit warning, flashing red light or something, that would relay "radar is down" scenarios. I'm all for adding some extra little bells and whistles like that to add to the hectic nature of combat.

[FERAL TIGER]

Naughtyboy, on 30 March 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

I voted for Hardcore...after all we want realism and be able to use our mods aka sensors to track and target enemies..

just watch that old mechwarrior movie intro when the Warhammer steps up to THE Atlas and scream 'my god' kinda says it all.

The intro movie is exactly how I hope it's done in MWO, thought the dust had enough of an impact, but didn't hinder gameplay for long. If you're locked on to a target I could see it being a valuable way to aim while enduring dust, but lighter mechs would be able to tuck around a corner and your sensors would still encourage you to fire at a certain location. Could add strategy options to small mechs in close urban combat.

fatcat01, on 30 March 2012 - 11:21 AM, said:

But how long do you want to wait for that dust cloud to dissipate? Dust can take quite a while to settle in real life.

The amount of dust should be relative to the size/type of building that is destroyed, skyscrapers would send enough dust to blanket a few blocks, while some buildings wouldn't amount to much.

[HeIIequin]

LakeDaemon, on 30 March 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

As much as I want to see realistic dense fog, smoke, dust, ash etc.. You cant impose graphic-intense conditions when x percent of players will suffer with poor playability even if they have pretty good hardware (but not the best). Also, you cant make it an option because then everyone will have to turn it off just to compete with few elitist system minmaxers who turn off anything they can that affects their frames per second.

I agree. I'd assume any fog/dust feature would be impossible to turn off completely to avoid a situation like some games, where turning off a feature like grass can actually let you see people hiding in said grass (talk about broken), where leaving grass on is actually HURTING you, even if it looks great.

Thus, fog would have to retain the same visible reduction and disorientation on every settings level to maintain balance. The only thing the graphics slider would do would be to make it look nicer. Be nice if the games engine could support that kind of thing properly.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

One way to avoid really stressing out the hardware of players but still keeping the smoke screen would be to go back to basics. Have the smoke be layers of semi-transparent sprites. Yeah it may not look as amazing as full 3D dust particles, but it would looks just as good at range, while not even being close to as taxing to the hardware.


How long are we talking here? The dust lingering that is. 15, 30 seconds? Sprites may be fine for such a short period of time.

Edited by mwhighlander, 30 March 2012 - 03:45 PM.

[The Cheese]

I vote Hardcore, but by that, I mean "Video Game Hardcore". It needs to last long enough so that it can be used to tactical effect, but not so long that it destroys the match for people without the tech to see through it.

I'm thinking it should last a minute, two tops. I also think that the visibility should vary. Not every dust cloud limits your sight to 2 meters.

[GrimJim]

Garth Erlam, on 30 March 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

Hahaha, I'm not saying don't come up with ideas, I'm just pointing out where there are physical limitations - heavy particle effects are a massive draw on modern cards. So perhaps we can think of a similar idea, with that limitation in mind?

Smoke.

It makes the Flamer a great multipurpose weapon. Part heat inducer, part obscurement. Make it so oily thick when objects are set on fire it could be rendered (visually) as a solid mass. No "Wrath of the Titans" stuff here.