734 replies to this topic

[xMarshallx]

Meneiupptus, on 16 April 2012 - 05:14 AM, said:

Waiting is all we are doing, how long will you all wait? Until your House' enemys are working togethor and attacking you? Until the Beta starts and no one knows each other... or cares to. Who cares about how the game is played... This Chain of Communication is to bring us all togethor so we can talk and coordinate if that is what you all want. The Chain of Command is not a slave collar to be worn by those who serve.. its a tool for social interaction.

I intend to use it. I intend to speak to anyone and everyone who wants to and I encourage anyone who are Guild/Unit/Lance leaders to contact me. Don't know when Pappy's next meeting is but when it is lets talk.

Thank you, Meneiupptus. It's great to see someone who actually appreciates CoC in a game where that mentality is all but required. I look forward to seeing a true warrior from the House Davion on the battlefield.

[Jack Gallows]

The Sniper, on 10 May 2012 - 05:37 PM, said:

Thank you, Meneiupptus. It's great to see someone who actually appreciates CoC in a game where that mentality is all but required. I look forward to seeing a true warrior from the House Davion on the battlefield.

The current outcome though is that there won't be anything for the CoC to do in game now, Faction players don't get to pick where they drop and can't have leadership positions. In essence, any idea of a real CoC is pretty much dead.

[Radagast]

There will be no CoC for House Davion........maybe for some, just like there wil be no 1FSAC.......in someones dream. We will be here whether our name can be used or not!

Radagast

[Meneiupptus]

Hmmm. the houses have been effectively cut out of the game? That seems like a good way to commit fanicide.

Edited by Meneiupptus, 25 May 2012 - 03:31 PM.

[Jack Gallows]

Meneiupptus, on 25 May 2012 - 03:30 PM, said:

Hmmm. the houses have been effectively cut out of the game? That seems like a good way to commit fanicide.

Copied from Brian

Quote

Alright... long overdue, much distraction in between.

Players will NOT be able to claim canon units as their own. When it comes to Mercenary Units/Corps/Companies, these names will not be available during MC creation. Trying to circumvent the naming system will result in the Merc Corp being renamed/denied.

Faction units are being handled slightly different. When a player aligns themselves with one of the major factions, say House Kurita, they will have the opportunity to join famous house units as the rank up by earning loyalty points. Some house units will require additional feats of excellence and challenges to achieve before membership is granted. Since these units are not run by the players, and we can reserve/restrict access to very active/famous units for sake of preserving the BattleTech timeline.

Our general stance on player run merc units is simple - create your own legacy! It's very unfair for players to stake ownership over a canon unit, and creates a host of politic and pr issues. So we're avoiding the complexities and edge cases associate with players assuming the role of these units by encouraging you to forge your own destiny.

This is our launch POV. As always, we listen to your feedback and ways to improve the system.

So, can't control units nor where you're going to drop, but you can still group with friends. They said they'd like to later be able to have people create fan controlled units in Factions, kind of like how the merc units are going to be at launch, but no idea when/if it'll actually happen.

[Supremacist]

Meneiupptus, on 04 April 2012 - 03:53 PM, said:

BTW there was some confusion about the word Goon I used in my earlier post: Goonsquad is a unit in Eve Online. at their heyday they.......... Expect them and be prepared to fight them.

This is the second time we've been mentioned and I want to clear some things up, as of right now, we dont have a desire to simply come in and run amok or simply cause misery. Although Azantia is really trying my patience.

Eve was a unique situation and large parts of the community pissed us off.

Right now we just want to play the game as we are fans, we havent even decided if we will join one house permanently or move around like a true merc unit. But a lot of us will surely be joining House Davion, and since AFFS has no game backed CoC I dont see a problem with letting these MPBT3025 guys get a shot at leading, afterall, we can always tell them off if we dont like it, or leave if it simply isnt working out.

Edited by Supremacist, 28 May 2012 - 03:33 PM.

[Supremacist]

Jack Gallows, on 27 May 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:

So, can't control units nor where you're going to drop, but you can still group with friends. They said they'd like to later be able to have people create fan controlled units in Factions, kind of like how the merc units are going to be at launch, but no idea when/if it'll actually happen.

That actually is not clear, and even if it were, it could change, and you can still group with fellow players, and if you had allied units, I'd much rather have a player from an allied unit be our 12th guy, rather than a pubbie/loner be our 12th.

So the usefullness of the CoC is clear, there simply isnt a downside other than you will not be a part of it. Which I guess is a downside for you personally, oh well.

Edited by Supremacist, 28 May 2012 - 03:37 PM.

[Jack Gallows]

Supremacist, on 28 May 2012 - 03:36 PM, said:

That actually is not clear, and even if it were, it could change, and you can still group with fellow players, and if you had allied units, I'd much rather have a player from an allied unit be our 12th guy, rather than a pubbie/loner be our 12th.

So the usefullness of the CoC is clear, there simply isnt a downside other than you will not be a part of it. Which I guess is a downside for you personally, oh well.

You assume quite a bit. I've maintained all along that a CoC could be a good thing, but I've simply been calling foul on the idea that those with previous "experience" are automatic shoe in's since they aren't the only ones with experience....they just know more people from older games. If I'm not part of some CoC, I could care less especially if it's populated by individuals like yourself or the many on here that can't see the need for equality and not grandfathering members from previous communities in. (It may be a moot point anyway, as my unit might just be a merc unit.)

Also, having a CoC really doesn't do a single thing for making sure that 12th member isn't a pugger, that's just good unit relation/making friends. A CoC isn't needed for such, even if you could use it for it.

From Bryan:

Quote

Correct, but faction players have not choice over which planets are being fought over.

Can't control Faction units, and can't pick which planets are being fought over. They even said you don't get an option of where you drop, you que up with friends/etc then it puts you in a match against others. This means a CoC is pretty much just a chat group.

[Supremacist]

Jack Gallows, on 29 May 2012 - 05:28 AM, said:

Can't control Faction units, and can't pick which planets are being fought over. They even said you don't get an option of where you drop, you que up with friends/etc then it puts you in a match against others. This means a CoC is pretty much just a chat group.

Lol. How did you get the idea that I can't choose who I drop with from the quote?

if NOTHING else, the CoC would enable us to have a constant pool of skilled players we can drop with, if your current unit is unable to field at least three lances.

Also along these lines, it would enable the CoC to put together an Elite Triple Lance, drawing on players from all member units in case we get to a point where battles are a must win for example in cases of House vs House battles of Pride.

The quote also does not say that is how it always will be, nor is there any reason to suspect you cant either immediately or soon after launch, choose who you fight against, for example unit A from house X vs unit B from house Y combat if both sides want the fight, as it is easily implemented.

So as it stands now, the least youll get from a CoC is a ready made reserve force that wont allow your undermanned unit of 8 players plus 4 pubbies, drop against a fully manned triple lance of players from the same unit.

We need not mention the sharing of intelligence, ideas, tips, tricks, strategies and tactics.

It seems I'm just finding ways that this could be useful, and you just keep saying no to every idea, and not even propose your own. Sure is Republican in here. = )

And like you said Jack, if this is all it can be, then whats the problem?
As it stand now, one of these guys will hold the keys to the teamspeak server and thatll be it.
You dont even need to be in the teamspeak server, just go there when you need to get a couple of skilled guys to drop with your unit.

I've rarely come across such a reaction to such an old idea:

"Guys, lets create this non-binding, no-in game authority system where all units help each other, share information, play and fight together and pretty much just do whats best for the house?"

"OMGZ, YOURE NOT THE BOSS OF ME"

[Meneiupptus]

The whole debate devolved into a "This person wants to control me." issue quickly on. I have tried many times to keep it on track but some people cannot grasp the concept of completely voluntary. Who knows... I will try Beta and test this game and even send in some feedback and suggestions. I have played Battletech since it wa snothing more than a pamphlet and I can state for the record... fanicide is what it is looking like to me.

I am sure many will play it just to pew pew. I however am a Battletech player and the Houses is what Battletech is about. Mercenaries assist they don't run things.. who pays them if the Houses don't do anything? Water under the bridge and LOTRO'd as it were.

The COC is nothing more than a communications system. Mercenaries since they have to defend worlds that can be taken will have them and use them. Any guild on a Comms server will have it and use it, any Guild with an internal Chain of Command alread has it regardless of how much they decry it. Do we have 1 at the top organizing the Houses? No, and that is why it is not Battletech.

This is a new game using the old name... it really has nothing else to do with the game other than corresponding storyline.

[Talon Thorn]

Supremacist, on 29 May 2012 - 11:01 AM, said:

Lol. How did you get the idea that I can't choose who I drop with from the quote?

He didn't get that idea, read the post a bit more carefully, he said "They even said you don't get an option of where you drop, you que up with friends/etc then it puts you in a match against others." Which to anyone who actually reads the thread carefully (or not particularly so, really) indicates that he has "the idea" that one CAN indeed choose with whom he drops.

[Apex Prime]

Man... good to see old old faces....

~S~

HHoD JudgeDread

[Skekz]

Talk about a House divided.

It sounds to me that this game will be a lot like World of Tanks clan wars. The Merc Corps will be like a clan in WoT. Merc Corps pick a planet/territory to control and battle it out with an already controlling Corps. It's just whether that planet/territory is in which House's territory in the IS.

For those of us who are House Davion players and want to fight for the AFFS, then we will need to join the same Merc Corps as one giant Corps, or as I suspect we will want to do is make many AFFS Merc Corps. If we want to see our House go to the top then several things must happen.

1. We must organize our Merc Corps under one unified authority to direct the many different Corps in an organized manner and prevent in-house fighting. If we cannot do it with in game tools provided then we must do it on our own outside the game. This must be done to be effective.

2. Merc Corps Commanders must be willing to be flexible and to work with the other House Corps Commanders and the over seeing authority.

3. Communication!!!!! We must have effective lines of communication for all members. That means plans both strategic and tactical must be able to flow from top to bottom, bottom to top, and side to side (from Corps to Corps). This also means the over authority must have clear strategic goals and communicate these effectively to the Corps Commanders so that everyone is on the same page for the direction House Davion and the AFFS is going.

If this is not achieved then we will be individual Merc Corps fighting even each other under the banner of House Davion.

[Mustang]

Here comes Da Judge

[Azantia]

Wow talk about stirring up old issues, especially given up to date information.

Got a good laugh out of Supremacist linking my profile like it lends weight to the fact that I am "really trying his patience"

You got me Quakin in my profile now...guess I had better run and hide with my tail tucked between my legs, or better yet beg for forgiveness for having the crazy idea that in the "originally proposed" chain of command a fair approach should have been taken with regard to the entire community, not just those of us who were vocal about it.

Likewise, I guess I should ask for forgiveness for expressing my opinion and views on several different topics including leadership and what makes a successful team/gaming community.

You know what, I have a better idea.

Since there are pretty strict rules around here I will keep it clean and say : You Supremacist are a hypocrite, and are worse then the individuals I have pointed out prior. (we can talk about why if you would like) How dare people have an opinion, express that opinion and stick to that opinion because they believe in it. How dare I dont see your point of view, I should prostrate myself before you begging for forgiveness. At least I can have respect for Rush and Qin because they were willing to stick to a point of view, articulate themselves based on how they feel and bring up NEW arguments.
You have contributed NOTHING that has not be said or discussed before. These things were being discussed MONTHS ago at that, and have been DEAD for at least a MONTH. You want to come in here after all is settled to kick up the dust and point a finger in my direction with a vague, non-articulated statement about how im testing your patience.

Go back and re-read the entire thread because you are still missing our original statement. I dont know if you are just a puppet for Rush and Qin or if you are really this dense on your own, either way, until you bring something new to the table (you havent) to be discussed, may I suggest you let old arguments (that you were not a part of in any way shape or form) die.

Edited by Azantia, 03 June 2012 - 07:37 PM.

[L zard]

WOW!



(flamewar imminent!)

[Eagle vFv]

Azantia, why don't you give it a rest? People are entitled to their opinions and there are clearly people that disagree with you on the matter. Just because you can flame doesn't mean you auto-win the debate. We understand you have issues with people having large reputations, it is what it is and that's just how people mechanics works. You can be civil about it instead of just coming off as a hot-head. People would like to see their community have structure and that is all that was being proposed, so really dude cool down.

[Codius Dakanius]

Were starting to sound like a bunch of Marik Politicians.

First off, save all your heated words over wounded egos for the Private Message function.

Secondly, if we cannot have a organized and structured method of fighting in the game as a House then it is what it is. We CAN from units based on our houses canon units and still play for the Prestige of House Davion and the First Prince.

SO if we are done giving the Capellan Confederation players something to laugh at we can continue to see where the opportunities can go. and i agree with Skekz idea. it is practical and can hold us over till the DEVS decide they may humor the diea to allow cannon units in a conquest mode.

[Meneiupptus]

To reiterate the point of this thread...

This is a discussion on whether to implement a voluntary House Davion Chain of Communication. It has been expressed that a round robin council of Unit leaders get togethor to form some coherency and uniformity. This is a good idea in my opinion and I and my 3 friends will form a Lance to join this. We will not however be asking for leadership of this council in any way... because really been there done that and I got the t shirt. How do you feel on this and why? Please refrain from flaming as... seriously in this thread just about every flame has been stated.

We will call our unit The 1st Arizonans AFFS... because we're all in Arizona We will not however be running a House Unit because it is worthless to do we will be Mercs and standing for House Davion in contracts because some people really just have to stand up and say "You Developers are wrong." Bring the Houses back and maybe just maybe you will have made Battletech and not a cheap imitation.

And for the record you can make a game.... with in game chains of command and not have to use the Storyline. In a game of War we want to war... not twiddle our thumbs while you try to follow a storyline.

Edited by Meneiupptus, 12 June 2012 - 06:20 AM.

[Dhimmi]

while cooperation is always a good thing implementing C.O.Cs ahead of the game release on a grand scale is most likely to fail. as we dont know how this game will play out. And I'm sure some form of coordination will arise after a while. so why not let things run it course instead of getting excited in a wrong way on this topic?