138 replies to this topic

[DeformedSlowest]

GrizzlyViking, on 05 April 2012 - 06:58 PM, said:

Some are purists and others are not. I expect that there will be an element of new, younger players that would like to play with different options and that might include no heat play. From a marketing standpoint, a no heat option might be a good idea that would attract players that don't like learning all the details and younger players that may not be mature enough to learn them yet. I wouldn't want to discourage people from playing over alack of options. Keeping in mind that most of the people on these forums are old timers like me that have played either the board game or the online versions and there will necessarily be a need to attract new players I say put in all the options you think will help the game to prosper. It is good for everyone!

Thank the gods that another person sees my point. It's about the options.

Lets compare this topic to deciding options on cars for example. When designing a sports car, the purist say not to include power steering and A/C because many previous successful classic sports cars did not have them or needed them. However people like me like options and I would like to have power steering and A/C because it makes the ride more comfortable. Having power steering and A/C does break away from the original design of the classical sports car and it does decrease your overall horsepower since those two items leak a lot of power away from your engine.

Going with what I was trying to say as well, which GrizzlyViking also caught on to, it'll open up the game to the casual gamer and the non-initated players to the BattleTech/MechWarrior Universe. I'd rather have a large community which would in turn encourage further development and support of the game rather than an extremely closed, small, elitest community where development and support may not be as forth coming.

[Tannhauser Gate]

DeformedSlowest, on 05 April 2012 - 07:13 PM, said:

Someone that actually understood my point. As he stated, the option to turn off heat is an OPTION. Because many people want heat management to be an issue, it doesn't mean that you have to take off the OPTION because they "break game play." As LackofCertainty pointed it, the previous MechWarrior games weren't adherent to the original table top game's rules regarding heat manangement.

Having the option wouldn't bug me. Would I join those games? Most definitely not especially if the consequences are the same.

Still No. If it's an option then some people will use it as another way to reduce the game to as close to a flat featureless fps as they can. I dont want those people to invade MWO and whine about why they have to actually fight in adverse conditions with realistic limitations.

Edited by LakeDaemon, 05 April 2012 - 07:27 PM.

[Ironhawk]

Simply put: No Heat No Galaxy! 'Nuff said. *moves on to somewhere else in the forums...*

[VPrime]

Heat is so important! It is important for the energy based mechs to have a downside for not having to deal with ammo constraints, and its important for the ballistic mechs to have some upsides to having to make their shots count. I doubt I would play the game if heat was an option and not a fact. The only people that are going to want it is kids (or those who play like kids) who just want to run around shooting randomly. That's what COD is for, and also why I stopped playing COD

[DeformedSlowest]

LakeDaemon, on 05 April 2012 - 07:27 PM, said:

Still No. If it's an option then some people will use it as another way to reduce the game to as close to a flat featureless fps as they can. I dont want those people to invade MWO and whine about why they have to actually fight in adverse conditions with realistic limitations.

You have the option to not partake in those matches. Aren't you taking an elitest mentality regarding who can participate in playing the game. Aren't you barring those people from the option of playing MWO?

Ironhawk, on 05 April 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

Simply put: No Heat No Galaxy! 'Nuff said. *moves on to somewhere else in the forums...*

You took the option to move "on to somewhere else int he forums...."


It's all about options. Lack of options and strictly following the wishes of hardcore fans can and will turn away possible new fans of the series because of the communities inflexibility. Lack of a diverse community will lead to a game that only caters to the few with all others not having their say because the elitest make the biggest noise to get their way. A lack of a diverse community will stagnate the game as a whole as new ideas that would make a good game better that may have game from those less die hard fans have been shunned away from the lack of flexibility.

[DeformedSlowest]

VPrime, on 05 April 2012 - 07:38 PM, said:

Heat is so important! It is important for the energy based mechs to have a downside for not having to deal with ammo constraints, and its important for the ballistic mechs to have some upsides to having to make their shots count. I doubt I would play the game if heat was an option and not a fact. The only people that are going to want it is kids (or those who play like kids) who just want to run around shooting randomly. That's what COD is for, and also why I stopped playing COD

Heat is an important fact of the game. Having the option to turn off heat does not negate others from playing matches that do have heat turned on. Having the option to turn off the heat does not ruin the whole game as a whole as you have the option to not play those matches.

[DeformedSlowest]

How about we modify the question a little. What if the question reads as followed:

"Would you like the option to turn of heat for the matches and still play the match if it were not official and you would not suffer the same consequences as if heat were still enabled?"

I would say yes because you have nothing to gain or lose, well maybe some pride. However if the question was re-written as:

"Would you like the option to turn of heat for the matches and still play the match if it were not official and you would still suffer the same consequences as if heat were still enabled?"

My answer would be now be no because it's pointless. You have nothing to gain but all to lose.

[Damocles]

Voted No.

And not because I am elitist but because it is part of this game and should always be. You want to play with your ball in the corner? Pick a different ball.

[Murphy Skjebnesvanger]

This poll needs a 3rd option, like, "Hell F*cking no! What, you can't handle a little heat and ammo management? Go play Call of Poodie or Modern Waa-fare and leave me alone..."

Now that I have that out of my system, it's not really that hard to manage either of heat or ammo. Having to manage them keeps people from spamming the heavier weapons all the time. This game isn't supposed to be about twitch-mega-fast kills, its about planning your moves a little bit in advance. I wouldn't mind if there was an option for matches that could turn them off, as long as I don't have to take part in them. If they make that an option, really don't want to hear someone get butt-hurt about how "they only got beaten because they had to manage heat and/or ammo, and that they would really show people what they're made of if they fought them on a no heat/ammo server." You know this would happen, more often than anyone should have to tolerate. If you can't take the heat, and hold your ammo, then don't come crying us about how it's too hard. I'm sorry if I'm coming off as rude, but I've kind of had it with the games that cater only to the casuals, and leave the die-hards to bash their heads on a wall out of aggravation.
All that aside, welcome new comers, and have fun.

[Jawbreaker6]

Mechwarrior is all about heat management. Gunnery and movement tactics over Armored Core spray and pray.

[Harlequin4457]

I voted no, of course, but I do understand the "options" option, if you see what I mean.

I'm the kind of person who usually approves of giving the player options, but the true Mechwarrior in me just had to vote "no" on the heat and ammo issues.

[EDMW CSN]

Always on.

[Stormwolf]

It should not be possible to disable heat, otherwise the game will degenerate into MW4 multiplayer gameplay.

[Nik Van Rhijn]

People have said that NHUA is a matter of "giving options and choices". The thing is that will have those options anyway, by playing another game that isn't balanced around heat and ammo.

Edited by Nik Van Rhijn, 06 April 2012 - 02:07 AM.

[Nick Makiaveli]

DeformedSlowest, on 05 April 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

Thank the gods that another person sees my point. It's about the options.


Going with what I was trying to say as well, which GrizzlyViking also caught on to, it'll open up the game to the casual gamer and the non-initated players to the BattleTech/MechWarrior Universe. I'd rather have a large community which would in turn encourage further development and support of the game rather than an extremely closed, small, elitest community where development and support may not be as forth coming.

First it's an option that violates the basic concept of the game. It takes away a MAJOR component of the balance. In other words, it completely removes any semblance of simulation and turns it into an arcade game at best.

Thus, having it as an option means that instead of actually playing Mechwarrior Online, you get to play some bastardized version and supposedly get the same rewards as those people playing the real game.

As to opening it up to new and casual players etc, this implies that dealing with heat is something hard to do. With well designed mechs, it's not rocket surgery. Sure some canon mechs are built to have heat problems, but those are for advanced pilots. Seems to me like if someone started playing in the "easy" mode with no heat, and got into a regular match they would shut themselves down and get shredded so quickly and so often they would likely quit playing.

That said, I resent the implication that I am elitist because I don't support your idea. That is the definition of elitist. I don't agree, therefore I must be of lesser intelligence/education/etc. I am a long time BT fan, a VERY casual gamer due to the usual litany of RL stuff, and I will suck at this game.

Did you catch that? I will suck at MWO. I wasn't a uber twitch guy in my 20's and that was 20 years ago. I loved 16 player Duke Nukem even though I got pwned before pwned was a word. Yet you don't see me running around this forum saying Nerf this, Buff that etc. I will, however, enjoy the living **** outta MWO. So to paraphrase Fry, shut up and give me my Warhammer!!

[Stormwolf]

Nick Makiaveli, on 06 April 2012 - 04:57 AM, said:

First it's an option that violates the basic concept of the game. It takes away a MAJOR component of the balance. In other words, it completely removes any semblance of simulation and turns it into an arcade game at best.

Thus, having it as an option means that instead of actually playing Mechwarrior Online, you get to play some bastardized version and supposedly get the same rewards as those people playing the real game.

As to opening it up to new and casual players etc, this implies that dealing with heat is something hard to do. With well designed mechs, it's not rocket surgery. Sure some canon mechs are built to have heat problems, but those are for advanced pilots. Seems to me like if someone started playing in the "easy" mode with no heat, and got into a regular match they would shut themselves down and get shredded so quickly and so often they would likely quit playing.

That said, I resent the implication that I am elitist because I don't support your idea. That is the definition of elitist. I don't agree, therefore I must be of lesser intelligence/education/etc. I am a long time BT fan, a VERY casual gamer due to the usual litany of RL stuff, and I will suck at this game.

Did you catch that? I will suck at MWO. I wasn't a uber twitch guy in my 20's and that was 20 years ago. I loved 16 player Duke Nukem even though I got pwned before pwned was a word. Yet you don't see me running around this forum saying Nerf this, Buff that etc. I will, however, enjoy the living **** outta MWO. So to paraphrase Fry, shut up and give me my Warhammer!!

^This

[Aegis Kleais]

If MWO doesn't support NH variants of play to sate the will of the community (and I'm fine with that), I'm still going to personally hold players fully responsible for any lost revenues from any players it would have excluded.

There's conviction, and then there's putting your money where your mouth is. All I'm saying is that if MWO is HOLA only, make sure you thank PGI with some $$$ !

[Tannhauser Gate]

DeformedSlowest, on 05 April 2012 - 07:40 PM, said:

You have the option to not partake in those matches. Aren't you taking an elitest mentality regarding who can participate in playing the game. Aren't you barring those people from the option of playing MWO?

Thanks for replying. You make a good point but I still disagree.

My position on MWO in general is that the game should avoid the issues of the past such as boating, lack of balance between assaults and other weight classes, full customization mechlab so tro mechs and their variants are instantly obsolete and, in this case, a "no heat" option that takes away a basic condition that defines Battletech action simulation. Normally I'm all for choices but Heat is one of those options that reduces the game towards shooter. It also deeply divides the community (as it did in MW4). It may look like a good option but, imo, in practice its a game-killing option just like user-created mechs and uber configs would be game killing.

Edited by LakeDaemon, 06 April 2012 - 07:34 AM.

[Tannhauser Gate]

Aegis Kleais™, on 06 April 2012 - 05:24 AM, said:

If MWO doesn't support NH variants of play to sate the will of the community (and I'm fine with that), I'm still going to personally hold players fully responsible for any lost revenues from any players it would have excluded.

There's conviction, and then there's putting your money where your mouth is. All I'm saying is that if MWO is HOLA only, make sure you thank PGI with some $$$ !

uh.. you really think people will refuse to play just because they cant play NH? Then maybe we should demand that MWO be a shooter with options for no heat, unlimited ammo, scratch built mechs, uber configs, allow jump jets on all mechs, and god mode option because that will bring in the most players. Yes thats sarcasm but my position is that NH is so divisive to the community thats its a game killing option just like the others. Also, what kind of players will that bring and what would those options turn our game into? I say keep it action sim and avoid the issues of the past. Let MWO be the game the community has always wanted, not another shooter that the world expects from games these days.

Edited by LakeDaemon, 06 April 2012 - 07:48 AM.

[Microblitz]

QED!