200 replies to this topic

[Noth]

Lonestar1771, on 13 November 2012 - 09:48 PM, said:

It's shameful. I have like 74,000 chassis xp for my founders Atlas because I don't feel the need to improve past the basic "inefficiencies". They all go unnoticed and un-felt and seem tacked on like an after thought. Why waste money and time piloting other variants when you can do just fine with out the efficiencies. We want ROLE WARFARE with separate ROLES that offer DIFFERENT skills and bonuses. Nothing about the current system is fun, engaging or worthwhile.

The mech trees are not role defining, nor were they meant to be. They were simply meant to be small boosts to your mech without being game changing. They do not want you locked into a choice you might regret. Pilot skills and how you build your mech are what will be role defining. By doing this they allow you to specialize (since modules are limited by mech) while being flexible (you just switch out modules). It also adds a grind that this game really needs at higher levels.

Edited by Noth, 13 November 2012 - 10:24 PM.

[Stoicblitzer]

Ya it's pretty spartan at the moment. Too bad there has already been so much grind. Guess it's too late to change unless they refund my 535,000XP then I'll be happy.

[Rejarial Galatan]

right now, this system is pointless. the boosts are near negligible on larger mechs, and far too potent on smaller mechs imho. A jenner for example already accelerates like a dragster, and kinetic boost is a potent boost to such a light machine, and for say the atlas, that is like a cruise ship to start up/stop, kinetic burst is like an extra propeller, nice thought, but basically useless. right now, its all a time waster. what I would love to see is a way to force scouts to SCOUT and not be mech killers, because, and you can hate on me all you want, killin mechs is NOT the job of a scout, find em, report the location, harass and get the heck out of there, THAT is a scouts job.

[Noth]

Rejarial Galatan, on 13 November 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

right now, this system is pointless. the boosts are near negligible on larger mechs, and far too potent on smaller mechs imho. A jenner for example already accelerates like a dragster, and kinetic boost is a potent boost to such a light machine, and for say the atlas, that is like a cruise ship to start up/stop, kinetic burst is like an extra propeller, nice thought, but basically useless. right now, its all a time waster. what I would love to see is a way to force scouts to SCOUT and not be mech killers, because, and you can hate on me all you want, killin mechs is NOT the job of a scout, find em, report the location, harass and get the heck out of there, THAT is a scouts job.

Once knockdowns get put back in, you'll see less killer lights. Further if/once they add in kncokdown from large ACs, lights will be even less of a problem.

[Gozer]

I agree we're waiting for something "more" than just the basics that we have now.

[Rejarial Galatan]

my biggest problem lays with the fact that I punched a jenner POINT BLANK with a GAUSS rifle, and it did not die. Sorry, but canon and Lore describe the fact that it is a 15 dmg weapon, so, that hit should have CRIPPLED the jenner and allowed my 4 ML follow up to destroy it, but did it? NO, I died, in an ATLAS to a jenner that LORE describes should have been torn open like a tin can in the grip of a jaws of life. btw, i accept death, when it makes sense, but to a scout, now thats just BS. btw btw, FULL armor value at the time, with rear torso red outline, CT orange solid... no head dmg, standard engine.... go figure

[barnmaddo]

Compared to the Talents in WOW or LOL, the "you get everything, just choose which you want first" is pretty boring.

[Noth]

Rejarial Galatan, on 13 November 2012 - 11:26 PM, said:

my biggest problem lays with the fact that I punched a jenner POINT BLANK with a GAUSS rifle, and it did not die. Sorry, but canon and Lore describe the fact that it is a 15 dmg weapon, so, that hit should have CRIPPLED the jenner and allowed my 4 ML follow up to destroy it, but did it? NO, I died, in an ATLAS to a jenner that LORE describes should have been torn open like a tin can in the grip of a jaws of life. btw, i accept death, when it makes sense, but to a scout, now thats just BS. btw btw, FULL armor value at the time, with rear torso red outline, CT orange solid... no head dmg, standard engine.... go figure

They want mechs to be able to at least have a chance against others. Right now Lights are the counters to assault mechs. It's not about lore and more about making a good competitive game. As I stated before knockdown coming back in and the wanted (by the devs) for projectile knockdowns, whill help immensely with dealing with lights. We just have to be patient.

barnmaddo, on 13 November 2012 - 11:28 PM, said:

Compared to the Talents in WOW or LOL, the "you get everything, just choose which you want first" is pretty boring.

You don't get everything. You can't bring all the modules with you (once more are added) that is where the differentiation will come from.

[Draco Argentum]

Rejarial Galatan, on 13 November 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

right now, this system is pointless. the boosts are near negligible on larger mechs, and far too potent on smaller mechs imho. A jenner for example already accelerates like a dragster, and kinetic boost is a potent boost to such a light machine, and for say the atlas, that is like a cruise ship to start up/stop, kinetic burst is like an extra propeller, nice thought, but basically useless. right now, its all a time waster. what I would love to see is a way to force scouts to SCOUT and not be mech killers, because, and you can hate on me all you want, killin mechs is NOT the job of a scout, find em, report the location, harass and get the heck out of there, THAT is a scouts job.

I agree. I had a thread in CB explaining that % boosts are bad because they are only good if the base number is large. Its great if you want to boat, not so good for anything else.

Noth, on 13 November 2012 - 11:29 PM, said:

You don't get everything. You can't bring all the modules with you (once more are added) that is where the differentiation will come from.

Then why not scrap the Mech XP system completely and just have a pilot system? You have yet to explain why we'd want both systems where one is boring.

[Jasta]

Incredibly boring money sink.

It's like every 50 wins or so you have to set 3 million or so cbills on fire... just so you can start again with a crappier version of a mech you just had.

One of the worst parts of the game IMO. So tedious and poorly designed.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Jasta, on 13 November 2012 - 11:57 PM, said:

Incredibly boring money sink.

It's like every 50 wins or so you have to set 3 million or so cbills on fire... just so you can start again with a crappier version of a mech you just had.

One of the worst parts of the game IMO. So tedious and poorly designed.

we have been complaining since the first iteration of the xp thing, still no change, unless you count costing us MORE xp a change....

[Noth]

Draco Argentum, on 13 November 2012 - 11:52 PM, said:

I agree. I had a thread in CB explaining that % boosts are bad because they are only good if the base number is large. Its great if you want to boat, not so good for anything else.




Then why not scrap the Mech XP system completely and just have a pilot system? You have yet to explain why we'd want both systems where one is boring.

The mech xp is a faster grind and represents progress. because of the ability to own multiple mechs it is potentially endless grind with fairly easily reached goals. It's a psychological thing. The Pilot trees, being gained with gxp is a longer grind and gives cool little bonuses that you can apply to mechs to make them unique. Additionally since the mech xp trees can fill rather fast it gives you lost of extra XP whcih encourages converting it to gxp by using MC. It is basically another way to encourage money to be spent without forcing you or flat out telling you to.

Rejarial Galatan, on 14 November 2012 - 12:00 AM, said:

we have been complaining since the first iteration of the xp thing, still no change, unless you count costing us MORE xp a change....

That's because they want the bucket method and not tree to make it fair and not lock you into anything. They said this during their Kotaku Q&A.

Edited by Noth, 14 November 2012 - 12:15 AM.

[Rejarial Galatan]

except, giving me and my atlas the same exact perks as a jenner is more than a little odd imho. Each mech/weight class should have its own specific perks, not a level ground no matter the weight class, why else have anything but lights then?

[Noth]

Rejarial Galatan, on 14 November 2012 - 12:14 AM, said:

except, giving me and my atlas the same exact perks as a jenner is more than a little odd imho. Each mech/weight class should have its own specific perks, not a level ground no matter the weight class, why else have anything but lights then?

Lights only advantage is speed. Come knockdowns, the lights will be much easier to kill and less desirable. Just because the Atlas benefits less doesn't mean that the light is always better.

[Sam Slade]

Rejarial Galatan, on 13 November 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

...what I would love to see is a way to force scouts to SCOUT...

This here is why we have a general application skills progression; the one thing MMO communities have demonstrated over and over again is that they HATE being forced into a specific role. Whether it's done via 'mandatory' gear sets(Yeah! Diablo 3 is here and.. oh...) or through an over reliance on a players adherence to a storyline or otherwise 'key' game concept(Star Wars the what now?), players have always shown their displeasure at being pigeon holed into one definitive role.

The Mechlab allows you to take a mech chassis and make it into almost anything you want it to be. Sure you can make it better by unlocking those Efficiencies but are they game changing? Does having them give you an 'I win' button? Thankfully they do not. A well planned and executed mech build, combined with a cool head and a bit of skill, will ALWAYS beat a poorly made mech no matter what the XP level of the Pilot Tree; and thank god for that.

If Mechwarrior Online ever became a matter of 'time served' over intuitive and intelligent mech design then I think you could safely call it a dead end/pay to win/money suck game. Right now brains beats grind hands down... again... this is a good thing.

[Rejarial Galatan]

then lets just do away with all assaults, all heavies, all mediums and just go lemming it up with lights, since, the growing oddity is: a light should be just as able to kill an assault as any other mech, which, is not in the mechs design specs, its why its light, fast, lightly armed and armored.

[Sudden Reversal]

XP implementation is extremely poor.

To infer that no pilot can be better than Green, without owning multiple variants of their preferred Mech in the form of entirely distinct chassis, is spurious to say the least and a blatant money grab\time sink to boot.

Quite frankly it stinks and is most probably the weakest aspect of MWO at present, barring the matchmaking which is being addressed.

I hate it. We should all hate it.

It needs to be changed.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Sudden Reversal, on 14 November 2012 - 12:35 AM, said:

XP implementation is extremely poor.

To infer that no pilot can be better than Green, without owning multiple variants of their preferred Mech in the form of entirely distinct chassis, is spurious to say the least and a blatant money grab\time sink to boot.

Quite frankly it stinks and is most probably the weakest aspect of MWO at present, barring the matchmaking which is being addressed.

I hate it. We should all hate it.

It needs to be changed.

agreed. 100%. why? in lore, a mech pilot may spend his or her ENTIRE CAREER in a SINGLE variant of a mech. I spend 99.99% of my time in my AS7-D. I hate the K model, I hate the RS, I hate em all but the D. Why? I like its flexibility, the others, not so flexible. to force me into mechs I ultimately sell back is insulting.

[Noth]

Rejarial Galatan, on 14 November 2012 - 12:34 AM, said:

then lets just do away with all assaults, all heavies, all mediums and just go lemming it up with lights, since, the growing oddity is: a light should be just as able to kill an assault as any other mech, which, is not in the mechs design specs, its why its light, fast, lightly armed and armored.

A smart atlas can kill lights pretty easily. Further when knockdowns are put back in lights have to fear being knocked down much easier than the other mechs which will drop their survivability. Different mechs and mech classes have different strengths and weaknesses. This promotes a team game. I've lost count of how many times I've killed lights with relative ease in non lights. The mech trees don't change that. Further the mech trees do not make enough of a difference to matter in a real match scenario.

[Sam Slade]

Rejarial Galatan, on 14 November 2012 - 12:34 AM, said:

then lets just do away with all assaults, all heavies, all mediums and just go lemming it up with lights, since, the growing oddity is: a light should be just as able to kill an assault as any other mech, which, is not in the mechs design specs, its why its light, fast, lightly armed and armored.

Knockdown will return.

Sudden Reversal, on 14 November 2012 - 12:35 AM, said:

XP implementation is extremely poor.

To infer that no pilot can be better than Green, without owning multiple variants of their preferred Mech in the form of entirely distinct chassis, is spurious to say the least and a blatant money grab\time sink to boot.

Quite frankly it stinks and is most probably the weakest aspect of MWO at present, barring the matchmaking which is being addressed.

I hate it. We should all hate it.

It needs to be changed.

Wait for the modules: it is being worked on.