25 replies to this topic

[Battlefinger]

I love the Dragon, I really do. It pains me to not be able to use it. Namely because of the right arm. If I am barely able to hit something even with an LBX/10, then something is wrong (I'm not the GREATEST shot, but I certainly ain't bad. Certainly not THAT bad).

When piloting the Dragon 5N and 1N, I've noticed that (at least with an LBX10) the actual point that the weapon fires at is absurdly far from where the arm reticle is. It's also not helped by the absolutely awful coding for all projectile-based weapons that seems to add a ridiculous delay of up to a second and a half between clicking and firing. I have noticed that the machine guns I have equipped to that arms seem to fire closer to the reticle than the LBX could ever hope to, but it's still not really accurate, and the problem doesn't seem to exist on any other mech I've piloted.

This issue has been brought up numerous times since the Dragons introduction, and I swear it has become much worse since open beta, and possibly the patch before it, I didn't get to play the previous patch as much. I'm both surprised and frustrated that it has STILL not been addressed after all this time.

I've addressed the vaguely dissapointed feeling I get about this game in other threads, so I only wish to draw attention to the issues above: The absurdly off-center aiming of the Dragons ballistics arm, and the terrible netcoding system in place for every single projectile weapon (honestly, this has never been an issue in literally ANY other online game I have played, I don't understand what it is that PGI have managed to do to mess that section up so badly. Crysis's standard netcoding isn't anywhere near as awful as this). Perhaps someone from PGI could comment on these problems for once? Thankyou.

[lsp]

Dude, the dragon owns. I didn't even read your entire post because I piloted a drg-1n for months and owned in it. The arm is not hard to use, right now it's just the crappy netcode.

[Lugh]

There is nothing wrong with the dragon arms you see that little o---------------- THAT is where weapons on your arms will hit.

The big + is where stuff from your torso/head will hit.

[Hubis]

Nah, his problem is with weapon convergence -- which DOES seem fairly inconsistent. It would be nice if PGI came out and stated how convergence actually worked so players could compensate for it. Torso ballistics are far easier to use right now it seems as a result.

[DeadlyNerd]

the ease of torso targeting is the only reason why gausscats are the cheese. With the current lack of mouse sensitivity options and ridiculous sensitivity for arms ingame it's far harder to keep a stable aim at something with arms than with the torso.

I honestly don't know why this game still doesn't have mouse sensitivity options. Hands still move at some maximum speed and you wont be getting any faster movement with high sens, only slower movement with low sens.

[Hulron]

I currently pilot the trail version of the Dragon.The only problem I've had with the arms is not paying attention to the o----- in which case my shots will be off. Arms work diffirently than the torso for sure and require a little more awarness.

[lsp]

DeadlyNerd, on 03 November 2012 - 02:26 PM, said:

the ease of torso targeting is the only reason why gausscats are the cheese. With the current lack of mouse sensitivity options and ridiculous sensitivity for arms ingame it's far harder to keep a stable aim at something with arms than with the torso.

I honestly don't know why this game still doesn't have mouse sensitivity options. Hands still move at some maximum speed and you wont be getting any faster movement with high sens, only slower movement with low sens.

1 buy a gaming mouse, 2 gausscats can't look up. Arm weapons are better, I have no issue aiming with them. I however, do have issues with the newest netcode. You can shoot your arm weapons and score hits without having to expose your CT.

Edited by lsp, 03 November 2012 - 05:52 PM.

[Battlefinger]

lsp, on 03 November 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

Dude, the dragon owns. I didn't even read your entire post because I piloted a drg-1n for months and owned in it. The arm is not hard to use, right now it's just the crappy netcode.

I know the Dragon is good, I use it as my secondary mech and have had equally good, if not better sometimes, games than that awesome one you had there. Thing is, I can't seem to get that to happen since open beta, it seems like that arms convergence got a lot worse very recently. I might be wrong, but I've been trying really dang hard and cannot make an LBX10 hit where I am aiming, even just testing it by standing still and firing at the floor in front of me, it's still significantly off-centre. I will try and screen-cap it, that might help.

Lugh, on 03 November 2012 - 10:43 AM, said:

There is nothing wrong with the dragon arms you see that little o---------------- THAT is where weapons on your arms will hit.

The big + is where stuff from your torso/head will hit.

I'm not stupid I've been playing mech games a long time. The guy below you understand my point, the weapon convergence is my issue. It's like the LBX is aiming to hit about 100m beyond the surface my arm reticle is aiming under. As I said, I haven't got a problem with the laser arm, it only seems to affect the right ballistcs arm, which I am assuming is because that arm comes so far out from the torso.

[DeadlyNerd]

lsp, on 03 November 2012 - 05:47 PM, said:

1 buy a gaming mouse, 2 gausscats can't look up. Arm weapons are better, I have no issue aiming with them. I however, do have issues with the newest netcode. You can shoot your arm weapons and score hits without having to expose your CT.

Wait wait wait, so you're proposing I spend $50 just to play 1 game properly? You must be joking. Right?
FYI I have a quite expensive gaming mouse but some of us prefer playing this game with low sens instead of the insane reflex fest like CS:S.
FYI again, Dpi on a mouse is its resolution meaning the more you lower it the more it increases the "grid like" mouse movement. Sorry but playing with 800 dpi just so I can control the arms is not the way I imagined using my gaming mouse. I rather use my $5 dota mouse instead.

EDIT: Gausscats can use jump boosters. Elevation problem solved.

Edited by DeadlyNerd, 04 November 2012 - 04:18 AM.

[Elric Bloodstone]

The new Yen Lo Wang has the same problem with it's ballistic arm. At first i thought i was crazy, but it definately isn't firing where it's supposed to.

[Denim Dan]

I've never used a LBX10 on my dragon so it might make the difference here but when shooting UAC5/AC5/AC2 I lead the target. Always figured lasers are instantaneous and ballistics you have to allow for projectile travel. Kind of like sniping a running target, you must lead the target. You have to remember these mechs are moving 50-100km/hr(forget what the speed is measured in). So I fire one round, watch where it goes and adjust my reticule to correct if I miss. Maybe I don't think anything of it because of lag shooting back in the day.

[Dead3ye]

DeadlyNerd, on 04 November 2012 - 04:17 AM, said:

EDIT: Gausscats can use jump boosters. Elevation problem solved.

You just utterly and completely failed. Gausscats cannot use jump jets.........

[Thedrelle]

it's impossible to add jumpjets to a K2? i know they don't come with them, but i would expect that any cat could have them fitted

[DeadlyNerd]

Dead3ye, on 04 November 2012 - 05:28 AM, said:

You just utterly and completely failed. Gausscats cannot use jump jets.........

So they can't. My point still stands though, torso aiming is far more practical than arm aiming. If you don't understand why yourself, explaining it is pointless.

[Orion ji]

Perhaps the guns boresight went out while crossing over rought terrain? Did you account for windage in your long range shots?

[Nintyuk]

As I understand is that the ballistics aim exactly were the o is, but as they have travel time so you normally have to lead. But the gun then focuses to hit the spot in the distance were cursor is aimed over which is different then the middle distance you want to hit. Also you need to take in to account the point of fire, so you need to adjust you aim differently if the target is more on the right or left of you.

So basically they require a lot of practice but can lead to be allot more flexible then torso cannons could ever be.

[Luxan]

Its not just the Dragon, the effect is noticeable on any mech with weapons mounted on fully articulated arms (e.g. those that can aim left, right, up and down). The problem seems to be that weapon convergence is set by the torso cross-hair and not the arm reticule. So, the problem becomes most noticeable at close range where the relative difference can be the greatest (i.e. if your torso cross-hair is over some background object in the distance and your arm reticule is over a nearby target.) I find that I can compensate somewhat by aiming more to the side than I intuitively would (i.e. if the target is to my right, I will put the reticule even farther to the right, and vice versa for aiming left.)

[wanderer]

DeadlyNerd, on 04 November 2012 - 04:17 AM, said:

EDIT: Gausscats can use jump boosters. Elevation problem solved.

K2's can't use jump jets. But yes, it's tougher to fire arm mounts vs. torso mounts, and ballistic shots especially. I usually have to fire "straight-on" for reliable hits.

Edited by wanderer, 04 November 2012 - 08:15 AM.

[Arcturious]

I believe there is a known issue where sometimes the shot will go astray. People have tested and we believe the issue is to do with the fact that sometimes the arms become disassociated from the reticule as you cross uneven terrain for example.

The end of the arm will swing physically - the enemy will see if drop / cross over in front of the mech etc. The reticule will stay on target.

If you shoot as this happens, the shot will go where the arm is physically pointing at, which can be at right angles even to where you were aiming. Again, this does seem to occur in close quarters more often.

Happened to me last night once, but is very infrequent. Shot was a snipe right across from me at long range, AC5 shell went practically vertically upwards and into space.

I was spectating an Awesome using PPC's a little later - he took a shot and both PPC's went right on target. He then started walking backwards while on cooldown, just as he took the second shot his arms jostled and crossed in front of his chest - the shots of both PPC's crossed about 20m in front of him and shot off into the distance.

[GL Chozo4]

lsp, on 03 November 2012 - 05:47 PM, said:

1 buy a gaming mouse...
<snip>
I however, do have issues with the newest netcode.

Don't see the difference a 'gaming mouse' and most other mice would honestly have nowadays. Using an old ball/wire mouse from 13+ years ago (Genius NetMouse PRO) and it still rocks in every game I've played really.

Far as netcode is concerned I think we can all agree on that being an issue far as hitbox misalignment is concerned. Tried a dragon back when myself and honestly the aiming isn't all too bad though the main ballistics arm is a bit vulnerable. That's where shielding comes into play to keep it out of fire (turn>fire>hide arm again).