293 replies to this topic

[Jack Corvus]

Noth, on 04 November 2012 - 07:25 AM, said:

I move back into cover and powerdown

Do not power down to avoid LRMs that are already coming at you. LRMs will always head towards the last positional data they had before their owner lost lock. Shutting down will prevent them from getting a new lock, but it just means all the missiles they had already fired are going to land on top of your head because you're still in the same place you were before you pressed the P button.

[Noth]

Jack Corvus, on 04 November 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

Do not power down to avoid LRMs that are already coming at you. LRMs will always head towards the last positional data they had before their owner lost lock. Shutting down will prevent them from getting a new lock, but it just means all the missiles they had already fired are going to land on top of your head because you're still in the same place you were before you pressed the P button.

Hence everyone that has said move into cover and powerdown to avoid LRMs have been speaking out their butt, thanks for proving it.

[0zz]

It sounds like OP don't know tactics or how LRM works at all.

I've both a scout and a LRM boat, so I'm on both end of the stick here.


Skillless LRMs
If they are as skillless as you claim, just split your team up and RUSH THEM ALL AT ONCE.
There are tons of way to WIN against LRM boats if you'd actually stop and think for a second.
"Doing the same things over and over again and expect a different result is a sure sign of insanity"

In the comstar drop, we ran up against another premade that had 2 taggers and 5 LRMs and a hunchie I think. I was the only dedicated LRM boat, by your definition, we should've loss badly. The reality is that LRMs become useless if you are able to distract them. We got one of our scouts purposely ran into the open in their LOS and back into cover to draw fire and their scouts while the main force took the long route around to pommel one lrm group. As soon as they were in position, I opened fire on the other LRM group with help of our other tagging scout, drawing THEIR fire. It became a stompfest as soon as our main force scrapped the first lrm group.

LRMs boats are usually SLOW, even in a crossfire formation. Skillless LRMs are USELESS if you pressure/suppress them.
If you can't defeat LRM dependent teams, it's your group's lack of communication/tactics.

Skilled LRM boats are another story, they are far and few in between though. I count myself in the intermediate range since I can have 1-2 mech targetting me and still support fire. The solution is simple, I stop firing and target my chaser(s) for a bit, give location to my team and call for help. As soon as someone(s) says they are coming, I run toward them or a designated spot. I resume fire at this point at whatever target that's painted. Sure, they'll shred my back armour (I'm still learning how to take hits on my arms), but usually I'll live and my back up would have them kill/chased away. I've had matches where 5 guys chase me down for a good 5 minutes and I still managed to live (barely) because of competent back ups and my jetpack or a speedy cap.

The really good LRMs that I've seen never stops moving, and know how to dodge vertically and abruptly, like full throttle -> sudden stop -> jump up -> turn mid air and run the other way/into support. They are firing while still doing this since there's a trick with the releasing and reacquiring the targetlock (still learning this myself).

As a tagger scout, I find most boats easy to handle. All you need to do is either harass it (it stops firing at your teammate), or have it focus on you (it stops firing at your teammate), or just kill it (it permanently stops firing at your teammate). Learn to use cover, don't be afraid to take SOME hits (it can't be helped). There were times where I run INTO the missiles hoping that I'd make it within 180M where the missiles become duds. If you have a partner, it's even scarier since any back up the LRM calls, will be focused on you so your partner can keep harassing the LRM.

Learn to slow down if it's a one vs one, learn to use abrupt motions, learn to use COVER (no, the missile didn't go thru the middle of the building, some missiles turn almost 90 degree from the ground to home in on you, it's one of the more advanced LRM skills), learn to keep moving, and most important of all learn to LEARN instead of whining.

Edit: Some of you claim the cover doesn't work, I've no idea since I don't stop weaving between buildings, so I hardly ever get hit from the LRM except the ones that hit my back (which usually means it's the 90 degree turn trick and I didn't turn fast enough). Also, power down DOES work, but only in between fire, it screws with their lock, so if you the last barrage just exploded, you can run, power down, power up, run again, that will delay the next barrage or they lose you completely.

Edited by 0zz, 04 November 2012 - 08:37 AM.

[Fenix0742]

Well, if you thought it was bad before, wait until patch day. They're adding in Artemis (bonus accuracy for missiles with LOS) but holding back ECM because they're worried that it will be too good. So get ready for the pain.

[Noth]

Fenix0742, on 04 November 2012 - 08:28 AM, said:

Well, if you thought it was bad before, wait until patch day. They're adding in Artemis (bonus accuracy for missiles with LOS) but holding back ECM because they're worried that it will be too good. So get ready for the pain.

Lets not forget ECM will become mandatory with how powerful LRMs currently are.

[SVK Puskin]

Daiichidoku, on 04 November 2012 - 07:13 AM, said:

PLEASE nerf the LRMS so OP can cry about new things instead

Good point!

[Bobfrombobtown]

3 ways to deal with missile boats.
1) use cover and a fast 'mech (~80 kph+), get in their face and rip them a new one.
2) group up in a tight cluster with AMS
3) Use LRMs too.

A note on powering down: LRMs can be dumb fired, meaning that if the LRM 'mech can get LOS on you, they can still hit you even if you've powered down. If they have the high ground they can often hit you, even behind cover as long as they can still see any piece of your 'mech they can get "convergence" (this dictates the arc the missiles will use and the range they will try to hit the ground at).

[T Hawk]

LRMs aren't a big deal really. SSRM2s need to be fixed.

Edited by T Hawk, 04 November 2012 - 08:41 AM.

[FlareUKCS]

I find LRM's to be a minor nuisance these days, now Guass Rifles... they are a pain to deal with.

See a LRM swarm coming at you, select which shoulder you want to use to shield your self while walking off to break LOS and grab some cover, you can torso twist to have your shoulders and arms take some of the damage, then twist again to have the other side take some.

... Gauss ? Most of the time your only warning is a part of you mech suddenly goes into the red and you hear a clank, then you hope you can duck fast enough to not get cored by the second volley.

I rather face LRM's personally.

[HugeGuns]

LRM Boats that sit at distance from each other, covering each other and covering most angles on a map...

That's where you get f****ed up.

[Stunner]

T Hawk, on 04 November 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

LRMs aren't a big deal really. SSRM2s need to be fixed.

I agree with that.. How many folks go "Hey, LRM boat watch out he's dangerous!" Every time we see a Streak boat that's our first target and of course we take it out at range because you can't brawl with a streak boat.

As far as countering an LRM boat. Our unit only runs a few LRM units and it takes just a few scouts to tie them up and keep them preoccupied.

Now for those units that run almost all LRM's that is different and I hate seeing an Atlas wasted as an LRM boat. I would prefer to see the Atlas used as a brawler/tank but then again in this game we have guassapults as well.

[0zz]

HugeGuns, on 04 November 2012 - 08:45 AM, said:

LRM Boats that sit at distance from each other, covering each other and covering most angles on a map...

That's where you get f****ed up.

Coordinated scout rush will fix that up in a jiffy.

[Stunner]

FlareUKCS, on 04 November 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

I find LRM's to be a minor nuisance these days, now Guass Rifles... they are a pain to deal with.

See a LRM swarm coming at you, select which shoulder you want to use to shield your self while walking off to break LOS and grab some cover, you can torso twist to have your shoulders and arms take some of the damage, then twist again to have the other side take some.

... Gauss ? Most of the time your only warning is a part of you mech suddenly goes into the red and you hear a clank, then you hope you can duck fast enough to not get cored by the second volley.

I rather face LRM's personally.

Exactly you can see the LRM's coming and can do something about it. There isn't much you can do to avoid the Guass fire that you can't see.

[StonedVet]

/facepalm

Have had it with these repeating thread topics...

PGI plz install a filter that disallows thread copying so we dont need to see multiple threads on LRM's/Gauss/Jenners/Lagshields/QQ'n/entitled children ...

Thx

[Tebbo]

If you're being completely destroyed by LRMs...
I have to wonder what you're doing.

Move smartly. Stay in cover, power down once you get into cover and there isn't another enemy mech staring at you.

[LanceHavenbay]

Coming from other Mechwarrior games, I honestly do not remember LRMS being quite like this. Yes, you can take cover. But these maps, not even the urban ones, contain enough cover to actually confront your target in a decent amount of time. Usually when we pit against a missile boat, we get pitted against all of them. People either get tired of sitting under cover, or get destroyed withing 10 seconds of running out of cover. AMS seems to be highly ineffective, even with 2 systems running on your mech. I never really used AMS in other games, so I cannot complain against effectiveness. And yes, I shutdown upon fresh cover.

Noth, on 04 November 2012 - 08:25 AM, said:

Hence everyone that has said move into cover and powerdown to avoid LRMs have been speaking out their butt, thanks for proving it.

That is why you shutdown and power back up as quickly as possible. They hit your LAST location. The faster you can shutdown and resume, the better chance you have for the LRMs to not hit you. Shutting down behind cover prevents new locks from being established easily, as well as preventing you from getting pummeled by lasers and bullets.

Edited by LanceHavenbay, 04 November 2012 - 09:02 AM.

[Noth]

LanceHavenbay, on 04 November 2012 - 09:04 AM, said:

That is why you shutdown and power back up as quickly as possible. They hit your LAST location. The faster you can shutdown and resume, the better chance you have for the LRMs to not hit you. Shutting down behind cover prevents new locks from being established easily, as well as preventing you from getting pummeled by lasers and bullets.

Which in all my experience is never fast enough to mitigate any meaningful amount of damage.

[Shalune]

Reign Of Courage, on 04 November 2012 - 06:27 AM, said:

Well I was in a group which just did brawler rushes & just zerged through the map & we scattered the lrm boaters really efficiently. Depends on group setup and mentality I suppose.

Versus pugs which typically have no AMS & don't stick together, its really easy to burn them down with LRMs, so yeah it is kinda fotm.

Pretty much this. I agree LRMs do too much damage right now. AMS being mandatory isn't interesting for anyone. Still, LRMs are not flat out OP as they can be easily countered with simple organization. But guess what pugs don't have?

I think there is an issue here worth addressing, but the severity of it looks a lot worse through the lense of pugs.

[GODzillaGSPB]

Silra, on 04 November 2012 - 06:57 AM, said:

LRM boat is one of the easiest ways to get accustomed to the game. You don't have to try to run around like a maniac, you can just try to pepper things from range while learning the maps and your buttons.

[...]

Learning the maps while staying in the base. Brilliant!

[Kread]

I agree fully with the OP, trial mech with LRM's doing damage and stuff, outrageous..

Just remove LRM's from trial mechs to balance the game.

If that still gives the trial mech a fraction of a chance at any game-play whatsoever, I would further suggest removal of the legs of all trial mechs,

That would complete the new player experience.