293 replies to this topic

[Secundus]

I just find LRMs to be way too easy to use and do far too much damage. I'm not sure how to balance this, but the fact that there's so much fire and forget that does HUGE damage across a huge range when every other weapon requires a modicum of skill with line of sight and usually being within half the distance. LRMs are easy mode for the people who can't aim with a laser or lead a target with a PPC or ballistic.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

iHover, on 04 November 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

Is it just my drops or has this game become nothing more than an LRM contest?
I played for four hours yesterday and most of the drops where nothing more than sitting back waiting for the missile boats to blow the other team away ( or for us to get blown away). The game now seems to be dominated by Assault missile boats packing three or four LRM launchers with enough double heat sinks and ammo to fire nonstop through out the match. These monsters piloted by unskilled players move to a single position and go from target to target raining wave after wave of missiles.
Even in the organized drops Ive been in play out like this. The LRM boats even lay waste to targets that are already being handled by brawlers.
The game just seems to be completely out of balance. IMHO LRMs need to be nerfed by at least 50% and their cost needs to be raised by the same amount.

I dare you to actually use them yourself for a few games, then come back and read all what you typed.

[Dirkdaring]

I shelved my mech for a LRM boat. I now rain fire with zero skill like everyone else. My damage has doubled and kills tripled.

Can't beat em, join em. Now I hope they whine on the forums more and more to get it nerfed so I can go back to a skilled mech.

[hanitora]

The only mech I have problem with against LRMs is my own LRM boat.. because I have neither AMS or speed. On my scout I eat like 500-600 LRMs every match without dying.

[Secundus]

Bluten, on 04 November 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

I dare you to actually use them yourself for a few games, then come back and read all what you typed.

In my experience using LRMs is the easiest thing in this game and I always do the most damage when I use them. It's just dreadfully boring. I haven't played a game yet where there isn't a scout running ahead, I find some highish ground within 1000m of my enemy and fire and forget and do tons of damage. It's easy and takes no skill, just a couple of brain cells to make sure your missiles don't clip the landscape/obstacles. Someone please explain to me the challenge here, and how that's balanced against energy and ballistic weapons that do apparently less damage, require aiming and target leading/tracking skill, require skilled piloting, and generally have half to one quarter of the range.

[hanitora]

Secundus, on 04 November 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

Someone please explain to me the challenge here, and how that's balanced against energy and ballistic weapons that do apparently less damage, require aiming and target leading/tracking skill, require skilled piloting, and generally have half to one quarter of the range.

The challenge is coordinating with your scouts and brawlers to actually retain lock and position on a mech to ensure that your entire barrage actually hits him instead of flying harmlessly into an obstacle or the ground. And surviving long enough for your team to save your *** when a scout or brawler gets within 180 range of you and starts ruining your ****.
A lance of LRM boats vs a lance of brawlers is faceroll for the brawlers if they move in a group and have AMS.

[Father Ted Kerensky]

hanitora, on 04 November 2012 - 12:45 PM, said:

A lance of LRM boats vs a lance of brawlers is faceroll for the brawlers if they move in a group and have AMS.

Stop speaking the truth, it's like ******* in the wind around here!

[GODzillaGSPB]

Father Ted Kerensky, on 04 November 2012 - 12:52 PM, said:

Stop speaking the truth, it's like ******* in the wind around here!

Another truth is that I have never seen a group full of LRM boats, nor a group with full of brawlers. Usually LRM boats are backed up by either scouts who paint their targets or Assaults wo paint their targets while attacking. And neither of those can be ignored. So you can't simply steamroll the LRM boats.

[hanitora]

GODzillaGSPB, on 04 November 2012 - 01:42 PM, said:

Another truth is that I have never seen a group full of LRM boats, nor a group with full of brawlers. Usually LRM boats are backed up by either scouts who paint their targets or Assaults wo paint their targets while attacking. And neither of those can be ignored. So you can't simply steamroll the LRM boats.

You're not really making a point at all.

Point is, LRM boats aren't good in a vacuum. They are good as part of a group and only if the group caters to their needs, which is target lock a specific target for prolonged time (and TAG helps a lot).

So basically the argument that LRM boats are OP stems from the fact that your team is **** and the team that has "LRM boats" isn't. Goal of the argument is to make LRM boats unviable because they take little to no skill on part of the LRM boat pilot while a lot of skill from the lance leader, brawler, scout to employ effectively in a SUPPORTING role.

It's a flawed argument from the mind of players who play in a vacuum of 1v1 times 8 which is why I brought up that example. These players want their slow moving brawler to be able to 1v8 LRM boats or be completely un-targetable so he can spend 10 minutes killing a Jenner that is running loops around him without help from anyone else effectively coming out a winner in a 2v1 scenario.

LRM boats are effective in a team or if the enemy lacks a team. No, they aren't hard to play. No, they don't have to be hard to play.

[Stone Wall]

The easiest way to beat LRM builds that are camping, is instead of running a straight line to their base, go around the border of the map. They never turn around in time to see you.

[Allekatrase]

Have to vent. The last few matches I've played have been nothing but LRM spam. It's not interesting or fun. What makes it really obnoxious is a high percentage of the LRM boats are assaults that also have other weapons so they're not defenseless when the said brawlers get close. I'm just tired of everything on my screen being LRMs.

Also, all your supposed skill and coordination is a joke. All you need is one person with a lock. It takes far more coordination to defeat lrms than to use them and that's what's truly broken about them. I hear the artemis is supposed to be in soon increasing the effectiveness of missiles even more. When that happens they should drop the damage back down to 1 per missile. They should probably do that anyway. They'd still be ridiculous given the numbers they're used in currently.

Maybe ECM will fix everything, but the amount of LRMs I'm seeing is making this game very uninteresting to play.

[Dirkdaring]

Allekatrase, on 04 November 2012 - 02:30 PM, said:

Have to vent. The last few matches I've played have been nothing but LRM spam. It's not interesting or fun. What makes it really obnoxious is a high percentage of the LRM boats are assaults that also have other weapons so they're not defenseless when the said brawlers get close. I'm just tired of everything on my screen being LRMs.

Also, all your supposed skill and coordination is a joke. All you need is one person with a lock. It takes far more coordination to defeat lrms than to use them and that's what's truly broken about them. I hear the artemis is supposed to be in soon increasing the effectiveness of missiles even more. When that happens they should drop the damage back down to 1 per missile. They should probably do that anyway. They'd still be ridiculous given the numbers they're used in currently.

Maybe ECM will fix everything, but the amount of LRMs I'm seeing is making this game very uninteresting to play.

Yep, totally agree. Buy a LRM boat and join the crowd. If enough people complain they will fix LRMs.

[Nazira]

For the record, I agree with the OP that many matches now are simply turning into LRM humpfests. As a Closed Beta participant for the past 3 months, I have played both sides of the LRM boat scene. It is annoying and frustrating on the receiving end (i.e., after waiting 5-10 minutes in tunnels/valleys/cover) and mind-numbingly boring on the giving end (i.e., "R", 1, 1, 1, 1, "R", 1, 1, 1, 1). I remember several guys rage-quitting in All chat and eventually wondered whether they or I was really having any fun. As it turns out...not so much, and I left the Beta after a couple of weeks hoping the LRM issue would be balanced. Now, having returned at the start of Open Beta, I see it has not really changed (and seemingly worsened).

Maybe this is the way the Devs intended it, but I agree that it gets really old/stale really fast. LRMs were never this OP back when I played TT Battletech, Mechwarrior and all of the PC-based versions since. The penalties for long range, shooter/target/spotter movement, indirect fire and terrain rarely made it worth expending the ammo, but here...just click the LRM 20 racks as fast as you can.

Anyway, I will simply join them in my Awesome/Atlas LRM boats and clicking the R and 1 keys while watching TV until I get bored or the LRMs get some balancing.

[PC_Joe]

I have to say this is a tough one. Constant LRM strikes can drive you mad and ruin your experience. People all say rush them, but as soon as I see mechs rushing our LRM Mech’s I intercept them. Knowing they won’t be able to even see me as the LRM boats pour on the pain. But on the other hand it is a reasonable system, LRM boats usually trade of direct firepower for missiles and as stated at close range they are at a large disadvantage.

I have found the best strategy is to go in a mission as a light mech, wait until you see the missile spray up. Then try and sneak behind the lines and attack the LRM boats, don’t focus on killing them just give them all a spray, get them to follow you around and give your team some time to advance. Of course if your team doesn’t push you are left high and dry as more enemy player attack you.

[White Nitro]

We need a dedicated AMS mech build, like a AA gun but for missile.

ECM will, prevent mech from being targetted from past I beleive 400 meter., with default radar. exept if being tagged/Narced or against artemis assited mech.

Thats some sort of counter.


If they follow the cannon, ECM , like any electronic , increase the ennemy home missile potential . So it has its flaw. I believe ECM could also prevent a mech from being ''invisible by out of sign'' when within close range.

Edited by White Nitro, 04 November 2012 - 04:28 PM.

[Duck Hunt]

QQ

is all i see on these forums wth

[wanderer]

White Nitro, on 04 November 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

We need a dedicated AMS mech build, like a AA gun but for missile.

ECM will, prevent mech from being targetted from past I beleive 400 meter., with default radar. exept if being tagged/Narced or against artemis assited mech.

Thats some sort of counter.


If they follow the cannon, ECM , like any electronic , increase the ennemy home missile potential . So it has its flaw. I believe ECM could also prevent a mech from being ''invisible by out of sign'' when within close range.

I've always said that AMS should be legally mountable in ballistic slots as well as AMS-specific ones- like TAG is used in energy hardpoints and NARC missile ones.

I'd find triple-AMS mounts on a Hunchback rather nice, in terms of using it as an escort to swat down incoming missiles.

[hanitora]

wanderer, on 04 November 2012 - 04:55 PM, said:

I've always said that AMS should be legally mountable in ballistic slots as well as AMS-specific ones- like TAG is used in energy hardpoints and NARC missile ones.

I'd find triple-AMS mounts on a Hunchback rather nice, in terms of using it as an escort to swat down incoming missiles.

Just remove the LRMs at that point. Why even have them? So you can waste tonnage on AMS?

Edited by hanitora, 04 November 2012 - 05:01 PM.

[wanderer]

hanitora, on 04 November 2012 - 05:00 PM, said:

Just remove the LRMs at that point. Why even have them? So you can waste tonnage on AMS?

Triple AMS mounts might chew LRMs up like candy, but it'll also be an incredible ammo hog in the process. Want to watch AMS burn out in a hurry?

Mount an LRM 15 on a Raven-3L left arm and stream missiles. Watch every AMS in the area engage every single missile in the 1-1-1-1-1... salvo at hideous levels of ammo use. But I have no problem with people dedicating that many hardpoints and firepower towards a conditional thing. You want to dedicate multiple hardpoints and tons of ammo (explosive ammo at that) to defeating missiles, be my guest. We already have dual-AMS in the form of the Atlas-K. I'd also remove AMS hardpoints from 'Mechs that already have ballistic HP's in those cases, however. Make defense a decision that costs something.

[PC_Joe]

I agree! Like a missile boat that sacrifices its direct firepower, Mech’s can also sacrifice weight for missile defense. Maybe different, heavy variants of AMS, rather than seeing a Mech covered head to toe in AMS systems.