75 replies to this topic

[Psydotek]

I like the gritty realistic feel of battletech but there is a valid point... Who knows what our actual understanding of physics and technology will be in 1000 years and the kinds of machines that could be built.

[Tannhauser Gate]

This same *why don't we have 1000 year future tech* topic shows up like clock work. The whole point of BT is that 250 years of interplanetary war has reduced high tech to a rarity. "Future" doesn't mean nice clean futuristic tech.

Edited by LakeDaemon, 21 April 2012 - 07:45 PM.

[Rattlehead NZ]

Mech Pilot - "Do you think you could put an airconditioner into my cockpit?"

Tech - "Don't be silly, you think this is the future or something!"

[Vulpesveritas]

the one thing they really should put into Mechwarrior... full body cooling suits and air conditioners. Honestly. You have a fricking fusion engine, I think it wouldn't be that much of a big deal to put just a wee bit of atmosphere control in the cockpit.

[Shiinore]

Sure. How about beam swords too? Oh- and plasma rifles. Maybe we could have everything run on thermal clips. Why not make the whole thing powered by rainbows and unicorn farts?

I'm tired in seeing these "energy shields" in sci-fi games like Mass Effect and Halo. I'm in a giant walking weapons platform, not a fantasy spaceship. Mechs are a technological marvel in themselves, don't fix what isn't broken. Not to mention storywise, humanity has bombed itself into a technological impasse.

And for the record, developing this sort of tech within 1,000 years is by no stretch of the imagination "low tech". It's been 12 years since the second millennium, and I still don't have a ********* flying car.

[Listless Nomad]

Shiinore, on 22 April 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

It's been 12 years since the second millennium, and I still don't have a ********* flying car.

http://www.treehugge...-fantasies.html

Boom.

[Fresh Meat]

Lowtech! come now, mechs use depleted uranium axes. That's premium 1970's technology right there

[Xyph3r]

originalvapor, on 17 April 2012 - 03:34 PM, said:

d@*n halo one little game introduces a shield mechanic that recharges and then everyone wants one. what happened to the feel of havinf 1 hp left and adrenaline rushing as you fight furiously to the exit, I miss doom. But BT with shields no no and no. Laser sword thing was in a brit tech book years ago never caught one really (thank god) however Axemen to the front melee combat would be boss in my lowely opinion.

sry, but recharging shields were NOT invented by Halo... several space combat sims had them YEARS, sometimes DECADES before Halo was created.

but still... Shields on Mechs? go play Gundam...

[Slaughtersun]

Zakatak, on 17 April 2012 - 02:53 PM, said:

"Lance leader, I've lost power to shields! Enemy proton-tachyon-ion-graviton-muon-electron-neutron cannon is charging up!"
"Sigma 2, reroute power from the cup holder to your gravitic plates to reflect the damage! I'll stall the enemy with my telepathy."
"This is Sig 2, my computers are sparking and bursting with rocks for some reason, I'm going down!"
"Sig 2 this is Sig 3, reverse the polarity!"

Nah. Battletech is fine as it is.

Sir, your wordplay is godly.

[Aegis Kleais]

LordDeathStrike, on 13 April 2012 - 02:14 AM, said:

think of the possibilities that could be harrnessed with fusion power.

instead of bulky heavy armor, we could engineer mechs with 2 power plants, 1 for moving and weapons, a 2nd for charged force field armor. charged force field armor is quite simple, you take highly conductive armor plateing, it only needs to be a few molecules thick, and does not need to be very tough, gold foil would work very well. this skin as it were, is then charged with the massive power output of a fusion reactor across the various band spectrum of em fields.

the effect would be armor that can completely repel laser particle slug and missiles attacks that have less incoming energy then the armor is outputting. you would effectively need to over come the armors shield field to breach it!

honestly with fusion powered shields, i dont see normal mech mounted weaponry breaching them, it would take orbital bombardment with things like large asteroids going very fast slamming into the mech to do it!

but then that would be kind of unbalanced, just give me one of these mechs so i can punish anyone caught cheating in game

Too much science fiction space age in what I prefer as a gritty ground n' pound simulation. I'd expect that kind of stuff in Starcraft.

[Volturnus]

Shiinore, on 22 April 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

Sure. How about beam swords too? Oh- and plasma rifles. Maybe we could have everything run on thermal clips. Why not make the whole thing powered by rainbows and unicorn farts?

Well, this one time in Gundam...

[Reed496]

I like Star Wars and Mass Effect since they have their own universes like BattleTech. BattleTech is definitely one of my favorite series. I mean who doesn't want to use a walking tank armed to the teeth with lasers, autocannons, PPCS, missles, etc? I like BattleTech as it is...

[sheradin]

Vulpesveritas, on 21 April 2012 - 08:10 PM, said:

the one thing they really should put into Mechwarrior... full body cooling suits and air conditioners. Honestly. You have a fricking fusion engine, I think it wouldn't be that much of a big deal to put just a wee bit of atmosphere control in the cockpit.

at one time before the session wars full body cooling suits did exsit but only ones that have them now is comstar and thier rare there

Volturnus, on 26 April 2012 - 09:25 PM, said:

Well, this one time in Gundam...

um acturaly they have interduced plasma rifles

Shiinore, on 22 April 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

Sure. How about beam swords too? Oh- and plasma rifles. Maybe we could have everything run on thermal clips. Why not make the whole thing powered by rainbows and unicorn farts?

I'm tired in seeing these "energy shields" in sci-fi games like Mass Effect and Halo. I'm in a giant walking weapons platform, not a fantasy spaceship. Mechs are a technological marvel in themselves, don't fix what isn't broken. Not to mention storywise, humanity has bombed itself into a technological impasse.

And for the record, developing this sort of tech within 1,000 years is by no stretch of the imagination "low tech". It's been 12 years since the second millennium, and I still don't have a ********* flying car.

they have interduced plasma rifles in the leter tech books for tt

[Dakkaface]

TeaL3af, on 17 April 2012 - 03:09 PM, said:

In terms of physics I think it's mostly realistic. In terms of human behaviour it's highly unrealistic.

I'm also not quite sure the heavier Mechs would be cost-effective in real life. Wouldn't it be better to spend your money on masses of smaller vehicles, especially if you assume that all the weapons can fire realistic distances instead of <1000m. The Assault mechs should just be giant sitting ducks waiting to be hit by artillery and air strikes.

I don't really care too much though, coolness trumps realism for me.

The two things that make BT mechs slightly more realistic than masses of conventional firepower:

1)BT armor. I don't know what the stuff is made out off, but it's CRAZY strong, to deal with railgun and laser hits and not be instantly destroyed. Tanks can't mount as much armor without mounting a fusion engine, at which point they get really, really big.

2)Neo-feudal system. The system lords and clanners run on a system that's close to feudal, so they want all the firepower concentrated into as few people as possible - these knights can then lord over their realms, with thier fancy armor and weapons. Decentralizing makes more sense, but means putting more power in the hands of peasants, and we can't have THAT. Clanners are all about singular warriors in ritualized battles, so similar motivations to concentrate firepower in single people. Even the Wobbies are short on manpower, and need to fight mechs.

[Volturnus]

sheradin, on 26 April 2012 - 09:55 PM, said:

um acturaly they have interduced plasma rifles

To focus only on the fact that plasma rifles have been introduced is to miss the whole point of his argument (which still remains valid).

[MrMojoPin]

I doubt anyone really cares but there is a report in the army times that more or less on this subject
"
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolog...cientists.html


Star Trek-style force-field armour being developed by military scientists
A space-age "force field" capable of protecting armoured vehicles and tanks by repelling incoming fire is being developed by British military scientists.

When a threat from incoming fire is detected by the vehicle, the energy stored in the supercapacitor can be rapidly dumped onto the metal plating on the outside of the vehicle, producing a strong electromagnetic field.
The new type of armour will use pulses of electrical energy to repel rockets, shrapnel and other ammunition that might damage a vehicle.

Researchers at the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory (Dstl), which is the research and development arm of the Ministry of Defence, claim it is possible to incorporate material known as supercapacitors into armour of a vehicle to turn it into a kind of giant battery.

When a threat from incoming fire is detected by the vehicle, the energy stored in the supercapacitor can be rapidly dumped onto the metal plating on the outside of the vehicle, producing a strong electromagnetic field.

Scientists behind the project claim this would produce a momentary "force field" capable of repelling the incoming rounds and projectiles.

Although it would last for only a fraction of a second, if timed correctly it could prevent rocket propelled grenades, which detonate on impact, from reaching their target. The supercapacitor could then be rapidly recharged ready for another attack.

The idea is similar to the force fields portrayed in science fiction movies which produce an invisible protective shell around a vehicle or object.

Professor Bryn James, head of Dstl's armour and protection science and technology centre, said the electric armour had the potential to dramatically decrease the weight of military vehicles and tanks.

Currently few tanks are able to carry enough armour needed to resist impacts from RPG rounds, which produce jets of molten copper capable of punching through more than foot of solid steel upon impact.

He said: "The supercapacitor material can be charged up and then discharged in one powerful event to repel incoming fire.

"You would think this would require huge amounts of energy, but we have found it can be done with surprisingly small amounts of electrical power.

"Conventional armour is just a lump of metal but an RPG round can punch through more than a foot of steel. Carrying around enough armour to protect against that is extremely heavy.

"The real advantage to the electric armour is how light it can be by comparison."

Sophisticated tracking systems will also need to be developed to work in conjunction with the new armour so that incoming threats can be identified and the electrical discharge timed correctly to repel the rocket.

It is unlikely that such a system would be used against fire from small arms as the outer skin can be made to be bullet proof.

Armour piercing rounds, RPGs and "shaped charge" roadside bombs pose a far greater threat to armoured vehicles and tanks as it is not possible to put enough armour plating on all parts of the vehicle to protect it completely.

The comparatively lightweight electric armour, however, could be used to protect the entire outer shell of a vehicle by using a thin cloth-like flexible supercapacitor material.

This can be used to form a lining beneath the armour that turns the vehicle into a giant battery pack.

An early incarnation of a different type of electric armour technology has already been trailed by Dstl.

It used several layers of metal which have electric current flowing through them.

When an RPG round penetrates the outer layer, it completes the electrical circuit creating a highly electrically charged field between the layers.

This charged field vaporises the copper jet that shoots out from the front of the RPG warhead, preventing it from penetrating the inner hull of the vehicle and keeping the soldiers inside safe.

At a test in 2002, senior British Army officers saw the chassis of a Warrior infantry carrier, which was fitted with the early electric armour, survive repeated attack by RPGs before being driven away with only minor damage.

Scientists from Dstl outlined their plans to use this technology at an MoD showcase of military technology last week.

The MoD has tasked Dstl with reducing the weight of armoured vehicles by 70 per cent over the next decade in a bid to improve speed and manoeuvrability.

Dstl has also developed an experimental armour steel that is covered in holes known as Super Bainite, which could also be used on vehicles.

Scientists found they could double the ballistic performance of the armour by introducing the holes to the steel, while halving its weight.

Professor Peter Brown, who headed the Dstl team that developed Super Bainite, said: "This is because when a bullet hits, it's always near to the edge of a hole.

"This causes the bullet to topple over, turning it from a sharp projectile to a blunt fragment which is easier to stop."

Now there’s also something floating around that uses plasma to create a "window" this somewhat on the grounds of a "force shield" used in star trek but not really. It would in theory kept the vacuum of space out and pressure air in. I think the last time I check the “hole” only about the size of a American quarter.

So some of the idea’s this guy has aren’t that far out. Just my thought.

Mr Mojo

[TKG]

The issue with the plasma rifles is that I think some are disappointed witht he fact that no, you cant utterly destroy a group of attacking enemies and then utterly have a witty comment or for that matter have a name for the attack that you tell just before the attack.
I think this is because the folks who put together maximum tech realized....wait...Battletech does not use anime's warped idea of the universe and thus implemented a weapon that is deadly, but still has drawbacks and is limited by the laws of physics.

In short... Battletech does not need any of the 'perfectionist' technologies that were suggested by the original poster to this thread, it is perfectly gritty in a cold war sort of mindset as it needs to be.

[Strum Wealh]

Xyph3r, on 26 April 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

sry, but recharging shields were NOT invented by Halo... several space combat sims had them YEARS, sometimes DECADES before Halo was created.

but still... Shields on Mechs? go play Gundam...

Agreed on the first statement.

As for the second...
1.) For the record, most Gundams (and other MS/MA... and most battleships...) didn't have any sort of protective omni-directional energy barrier (the type of shield under discussion).

2.) The BattleMech-like "HERCs" from the MetalTech games (Earthsiege and Battledrome) of the mid-1990s featured recharging protective omni-directional energy barriers.



3.) It is not at all unheard-of for BattleMechs to be armed with a conventional, physical shields - examples include the Colossus, the Sasquatch, the Valiant, theTBT-XK7 variant of the Trebuchet, and the Yen-lo-Wang (after repair and refit by Danai Liao-Centrella).

4.) The Blue Shield Particle Field Damper (an anti-PPC energy field/shield generator) was developed by the NAIS (the FedSuns' equivalent of DARPA) in 3053.

5.) One form of electrically-charged armor (using two spaced plates with an electrical charge applied to the outer plate) had been in testing during the early 2000s (see here and here). Granted, it's not Trek-style polarized plating, but there it is.

It is possible to appreciate how (relatively) low-tech BT/MW is (and even how much they're "advancing") without invoking other mecha franchises as insults...

Edited by Strum Wealh, 27 April 2012 - 04:44 AM.

[Zakatak]

So you want something like the Norseman (found on DeviantART, in TRO: 3250).



90 tons
2x LRM-20
2x ER PPC
2x Heavy Large Laser
4x ER Small Pulse Laser
Endo Steel Chassis
XXL 390 Engine
Nanotubular Armor (2x strength 0.5x mass)
Particle Field Dampener
GECM
BHP
Small Cockpit

Edited by Zakatak, 27 April 2012 - 08:02 PM.

[LordDeathStrike]

Vulpesveritas, on 21 April 2012 - 08:10 PM, said:

the one thing they really should put into Mechwarrior... full body cooling suits and air conditioners. Honestly. You have a fricking fusion engine, I think it wouldn't be that much of a big deal to put just a wee bit of atmosphere control in the cockpit.

roll down a ****** window maybe? except on vacuum maps, or hostile atmo maps, or most scenarios really.

i know i know! run refrigerant through the seat cushions, ahhhhhhh icey balls.

and i dont see why my atlas cant mount a few GAU-8 gatling guns, 1 on earch arm 1 in the right torso? they fire uranium slugs at supersonic speeds, very rapidly, they exist now, surely in 1000 years they are tried and true tech for large war machines wanting to inflict massive dmg on armored targets 1 mile away or closer.

http://www.fas.org/m...equip/gau-8.htm
number of barrels 7 Feed: Linkless feed system calibre 30 mm Ammo types PGU-14/B API Armor Piercing Incendiary [DU]
PGU-13/B HEI High Explosive Incendiary
PGU-15/B TP Target Practice muzzle velocity 1067 meters/second Armor penetration 69mm at 500 meters
38mm at 1000 meters Maximum Range over 1,250 meters Accuracy 5mil, 80 percent
80% of rounds fired at 4,000ft hit within a 20ft radius cannon weight 281 kilograms cannon length 6.40 meters

Edited by LordDeathStrike, 27 April 2012 - 08:16 PM.