39 replies to this topic

[Murphy7]

Well, I don't think it is simply the speed of the paper doll updating - not when you track armor damage as being similar to before but see your internals vaporize instantly.

[Eshek]

Testing wether it's the doll or not should be easy. Take a mech with a known quantity of armor on its CT. Shoot it with a small laser until all armor is calculated to be gone. Shoot it again. Repeat the experiment at least a dozen times, preferably for each chassis.

I doubt that PGIs internal testing is going to do this, but whatevs.

[MustrumRidcully]

Clay Pigeon, on 06 November 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

Right now every hit to internals crits, and it only takes 3 crits to destroy an engine, and laser DoT ticks appear to each individually crit. Garth posted that DHS at 2.0 allowed him to kill atlases from behind in a jenner insanely fast and that was part of the reasoning behind the DHS adjustment. Are DHS nerfed because internal critting is bugged?


edit: here's garth's quote:

That's my question as well. 3 seconds may not have been an exaggeration, of course, there are only very few weapons that even have a ROF of 3 seconds and need heat. Basically Auto-Cannons and PPCs, and that's it.

[Vassago Rain]

MustrumRidcully, on 07 November 2012 - 05:01 AM, said:

That's my question as well. 3 seconds may not have been an exaggeration, of course, there are only very few weapons that even have a ROF of 3 seconds and need heat. Basically Auto-Cannons and PPCs, and that's it.

In the trade, we call what Garth claimed 'BS.'

Because that's what it is, and even if you don't know how the game works, you can clearly tell that it is.

[MustrumRidcully]

Vassago Rain, on 07 November 2012 - 09:26 AM, said:

In the trade, we call what Garth claimed 'BS.'

Because that's what it is, and even if you don't know how the game works, you can clearly tell that it is.

As I said, he may have exaggerated.

I am one of the people that you can fool twice, you know. I always assume ignorance before incompetence before malevolence.

[Murphy7]

MustrumRidcully, on 07 November 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

As I said, he may have exaggerated.

I am one of the people that you can fool twice, you know. I always assume ignorance before incompetence before malevolence.

A nicer term is "hyperbole" - meaning exaggeration for effect.

Same business though with the Jenner in the back of an Atlas

Only DHS at 2.0 allowed this coring to take place quickly?

None of the following had any effect: lack of a collisions, miscalculated heat on small laser and pulse laser weaponry, a potential bug in internal damage calculations, random critical into an ammo location?

There is the part of me that is concerned that the observations and conclusions drawn from those observations are not well tested or reproduced. Sometime this happens from being locked in on a particular question "Are DHS imbalanced" that leads to not giving much thought to other factors (internal damage, criticals, heat from weapons rather than heat dissipation by sinks).

[DeathofSelf]

Vassago Rain, on 06 November 2012 - 06:42 PM, said:

They'll probably not say a single word about this, due to how embarrassing it is. Like how the post about us getting camo paint today mysteriously vanished into thin air...

Where is the post about us getting camo paint in the patch yesterday?

[QuantumButler]

DeathofSelf, on 07 November 2012 - 10:08 AM, said:

Where is the post about us getting camo paint in the patch yesterday?

stealthily deleted before the patch went live.

[Fenix0742]

QuantumButler, on 07 November 2012 - 10:09 AM, said:

stealthily deleted before the patch went live.

Reading comprehension is important.
http://mwomercs.com/...0-into-the-lab/
Paint jobs is clearly under the Future Patches section. And they didn't change it after the patch, although I can't really prove that.

[DeathofSelf]

Fenix0742, on 07 November 2012 - 10:13 AM, said:

Reading comprehension is important.
http://mwomercs.com/...0-into-the-lab/
Paint jobs is clearly under the Future Patches section. And they didn't change it after the patch, although I can't really prove that.

Yes, I saw this before the patch, camo paint was under the "Future Patch" heading, and still is.

Just FYI, you guys complaining might be taken more seriously if you didn't just attack PGI, and made calm level headed complaints.

[Lightfoot]

Clay Pigeon, on 06 November 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

Right now every hit to internals crits, and it only takes 3 crits to destroy an engine, and laser DoT ticks appear to each individually crit. Garth posted that DHS at 2.0 allowed him to kill atlases from behind in a jenner insanely fast and that was part of the reasoning behind the DHS adjustment. Are DHS nerfed because internal critting is bugged?


edit: here's garth's quote:

Yes. I believe this is correct. The Atlas died in 1.4 seconds because of the Internal Structure bug.

Fix the Internal Structure Bug, give us DHS 2.0, and we'll test LRMs plus Artemis to see if they are overpowered.

MWO is completely broken now so just let us test DHS 2.0. with the Internal Structure bug fixed. DHS 1.4 is not sufficient cooling for Battletech's stock energy 'mechs. To be balanced with taking up 3 criticals per DHS, DHS must provide twice the cooling of Single HS, otherwise you have the ridiculous effect of making 29 Single HS better than maximum DHS 1.4's.

[MustrumRidcully]

DeathofSelf, on 07 November 2012 - 10:16 AM, said:

Yes, I saw this before the patch, camo paint was under the "Future Patch" heading, and still is.

Just FYI, you guys complaining might be taken more seriously if you didn't just attack PGI, and made calm level headed complaints.

Might. That's the operative word here.

I have no idea if the systems guy from PGI has ever seen, heard, read or understood any of the level-headed, detailed analyses of the game's balance that me and other posters provided. And if he hasn't, then maybe screaming loud may be just as helpful as being level-headed.
That may very well mean "not helpful whatsoever", but maybe at least it helps someone's ease of mind if he can at least vent his frustration.

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 07 November 2012 - 10:25 AM.

[QuantumButler]

Fenix0742, on 07 November 2012 - 10:13 AM, said:

Reading comprehension is important.
http://mwomercs.com/...0-into-the-lab/
Paint jobs is clearly under the Future Patches section. And they didn't change it after the patch, although I can't really prove that.

Screw reading comprehension I am 2 kool 4 skool.

[DeathofSelf]

MustrumRidcully, on 07 November 2012 - 10:24 AM, said:

Might. That's the operative word here.

I have no idea if the systems guy from PGI has ever seen, heard, read or understood any of the level-headed, detailed analyses of the game's balance that me and other posters provided. And if he hasn't, then maybe screaming loud may be just as helpful as being level-headed.
That may very well mean "not helpful whatsoever", but maybe at least it helps someone's ease of mind if he can at least vent his frustration.

That kind of thinking is largely what is wrong with this forum. Even if the devs didn't pay attention to us (and they have shown that they do pay attention), screaming at each other is unproductive and childish, especially when people are just pointing fingers and throwing out insults.

We all want a good game, so lets help by having informed level headed discussions.

[QuantumButler]

DeathofSelf, on 07 November 2012 - 10:31 AM, said:

That kind of thinking is largely what is wrong with this forum. Even if the devs didn't pay attention to us (and they have shown that they do pay attention), screaming at each other is unproductive and childish, especially when people are just pointing fingers and throwing out insults.

We all want a good game, so lets help by having informed level headed discussions.

>>The Internet

>>Level headed discussions.

Ahahahahahahaha.

[Squid von Torgar]

The new skins were never scheduled for this patch.

That said, I find it intriguing that perhaps the internals bug is behind the perceived OPness of DHS.

Even with DHS there is no way on earth that a jenner can core an atlas in 3 seconds. Its easy to do the maths and see that something is wrong.

We really do need a shakeup here. Things are getting worse with each patch not better.

[MustrumRidcully]

Squid von Torgar, on 07 November 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

The new skins were never scheduled for this patch.

That said, I find it intriguing that perhaps the internals bug is behind the perceived OPness of DHS.

Even with DHS there is no way on earth that a jenner can core an atlas in 3 seconds. Its easy to do the maths and see that something is wrong.

We really do need a shakeup here. Things are getting worse with each patch not better.

I will be fair to the systems guy - he may have been confused as well how DHS could lead to this effect. But he was forced to adopt changes rapidly?

Ah, I can only guess what really happened. For all we know the build they tested didn't eve have the internal damage bug, or had a completely different bug, or when Garth said 3, he meant 9, or whatever... But the story is way too inconsistent for my taste.

[Sa7aN]

QuantumButler, on 06 November 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

Wouldn't put it past PGI.

^ this ^

[Squid von Torgar]

Quote

But the story is way too inconsistent for my taste.

Yes there are a lot of suppositions there, I guess we will never know the full story.

But unless PGI's development stratergy is "Lets totally break things and then fix them up from there" I really struggle to see the thinking behind some of their choices. And we arent talking about minor stuff here. DHS are incredibly important given the timeframe the game is set in.

It seems that Tear 2 tech is just too complex for them.

Actually thats probably unfair. I think its too complex for their internal testers to comprehend how it should actually work.

[Murphy7]

Squid von Torgar, on 07 November 2012 - 11:00 AM, said:

It seems that Tear 2 tech is just too complex for them.

Actually thats probably unfair. I think its too complex for their internal testers to comprehend how it should actually work.

If part of the planning is that the old tech needs to always remain competitive in their minds, then yes I would agree with you.

But if that was their plan, they are in for a world of hurt when the Clans arrive, which they are planning for.

They need to willing to allow old equipment to exist and become obsolete. I can understand a reluctance towards that right now with limited mechs, variants, and equipment but it is part of what we are expecting as the timeline advances.