804 replies to this topic

[guardian wolf]

Wait, could the current Wolf's Dragoons merc units be created by the Dev team, and then, the overall AI, GM, whichever you choose, just gives out missions to keep it under control, with MAYBE, I SAID MAYBE, a little wee room to do the odd contract here and there, when we get the chance, or is this also a no no?

[Toothman]

jimsolo, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

I by no means speak for my Outfit but I have no intention of playing the game with this rule in place.

Denying use of Merc Names is wrong. Period.
Major houses I can understand but at the very least a player created outfit should be able to play as:

1) Sub-units of the Major Houses with House logo's/colors.
2) Battletech Lore Merc Units or at minimum Sub-units there of.
Preventing copies is the only rule that need be in place.

If I cannot play under the "Black Widow Company" AND her current logo's then I wont play at all.

END OF STORY

"The Customer is ALWAYS right"

I had your name first so allowing you to have it is wrong. Sorry it has to be mine or its not fair.

[Adridos]

I was sure from the beggining they wouldn't let you to become one of those "uber units". What I didn't expect, was the ceasing of the option for Houses, but it makes sense.

Overally, good news for me.

[Kenyon Burguess]

Zekester81, on 03 May 2012 - 12:14 PM, said:

Wow.....this has caused a massive amount of dissent to this project. So I guess mercs are now second class citizens here. Every one else can be what they want, except for mercs. Thanks.

i dont think so. you just need to be original and not trample on lore.

[Korbyn McColl]

Firefly, on 04 May 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

How about "Northwind Lallans"? I'm sure your resident Scots will know what that means.

lol...No, I'm pretty sure Northwind Lowlanders is definitely off the table.

[Nighthound]

Ok after reading the whole thread there are some things I have to say :

1. Blocking canon Unit names is fine (using that 5965 Units List ist fair as no one can moan about why the line was drawn at a certain point which would undoubtedly have happend) BUT it would be a total nightmare not only for you at PGI, and your CSR guys but also for your Playerbase to disallow names that could be construed as too close. For Instance, take Blue Star Irregulars, its ok (IMHO) to disallow things like "BlueStarIrregulars" or "B1ue S74r Irregul4rs" or anykind of alternate spelling nonsense, but you should realy allow things like "White Star Irregulars" or "Blue Nova Irregulars" or even "Blue Star Regulars", because if you don't then that not small list of 6000 will blow up in your faces because you would then have to disallow nearly everything that is somewhere near BattleTech related. Need another example? GDL : what about "Black Death Legion"? "Grey Death Battalion"? see what I mean? you can easily construe them as too close but actualy they are not. If you do disallow those you can add a few 0s to your "little" list.
Suggestion : You have to make a cut somewhere! Make the cut where its logical. Take your list as its already given and don't start with arbitrary restrictions because THOSE will get you in trouble.

2. After reading some Posts I begin to worry about House Units. It was clear to me that "1st Kathil Uhlans" would be protected and that I probably won't be able to recreate it, but I hoped that I would be able to create "xxth Kathil Uhlans" or somesuch (just examples).
As it stands now I wouldn't be able to create any kind of House Unit (or did I understand something wrong?).
How will we (my friends and I) be able to play together as a Unit?
If we wanted to join the Uhlans but need prestige or loyalty points or somesuch to do so how will we be able to do that? and how can we keep our group together? Not all of us have the same amount of time or skill or money or whatever to level up those points at the same rate so do we have to wait till the slowest reaches that point? It has been said that those Points decay or can be lost, what then? do we have to leave that group in order to play together?
Another suggestion : Let Players create Units that are affiliated with your restricted canon Units if they so choose (the Player Unit has to have xxxx average Loyalty Points in order to join those prestigious Units) or not. Otherwise what are House Players? Lone Wolfs belonging to a House? And what are Lone Wolfes then?

3. What about other languages? "1. Kathil Uhlanen" (German) should be off the table as its the translation but what about other stuff like "Legion des grauen Todes" (Grey Death Legion also German but non-canon as the GDL was never translated)

I'm sorry guys you are doing a great job at PGI as far as I can tell and I'm really excited to play but you should do a better job of explaining things like this because in trying to wrap my head around what has been said I only come up with more questions ..... and more severe headaches

Edit : spelling and language addition

Edited by Nighthound, 04 May 2012 - 08:19 AM.

[WerewolfX]

While it is always good to give clarification I'm more worred about established units coming back from MWL and NBT. If somebody is out there sees the name and snags it. (Ex) Wrath of Anubis tag :WoA. Well those guys have been gaming since 2001 etc and are pretty pissed off about it. What would be done in that case as I'm sure the devs want us to keep as much leet speak out of it (The name) as possible and please both parties.
This is assuming the person snagging the name is a jerk about it and it actually escalates to that point.

Edited by WerewolfX, 04 May 2012 - 08:11 AM.

[Max OConnor]

Let me just throw this one out here for the DEV's consideration so we know up front.
And let me say this has not been decided yet. We are all doing internal polls and voting on a new name but this is the one I like the best and I'd love a yes or no so I can know if its even something to be considered.

The Northwind Expeditionary Force
*RP back story*
An independent unit formed to keep check on the NWH for possible rebellious actions so that they never have to go through the events that caused the Highlanders to break with Northwind for House Liao 400 years earlier.
Much like how Heimdal watches the actions of Loki in House Steiner.

Is the Northwind Expeditionary Force too similar that it could be construed as part of the NWH?

[Toothman]

Is anybody else getting the urge to dig up some really obscure Merc unit names and see if you can get them through? :-)

[Wyzak]

I don't understand why people are threatening to boycott MWO over this, but I do think it's important to have all the canon units accessible in game through some system. Which is why I'm advocating for pilot progression, server distribution, or random assignment as systems to put that into place.

Pilot progression: As your pilot progresses, you can switch to slightly less obscure units, based on a table predetermined by the team.
Server distribution: All obscure units are sequentially assigned new pilots, and size is ensured to be roughly equal (once every corp has been assigned two pilots, pilot three is assigned to the first corp, and so on)
Random assignment: The computer randomly assigns you to an obscure unit if you choose that option - to reduce complexity, you only get the name of that unit, or as people are randomly placed, people with the same randomly chosen unit coalesce into groups. But the computer moderates by randomness so there are no interpersonal conflicts created.

[Firefly]

Devil Man, on 04 May 2012 - 08:09 AM, said:

lol...No, I'm pretty sure Northwind Lowlanders is definitely off the table.

Whit're ye sayin'? Tae guid fae Lallans? Ye ken, there's grunds why the capital of Scotland is in the Lallans an' nae Innerness.

[David Decoster]

Personally, I COMPLETELY support the Dev's take on this. I can understand some people are big fans of such-and-such unit or clan, but you can always use your imagination and work that unit/clan into the baackstory of the unit you and your friends will be creating. Look at it this way, isn't better to create your own legacy, like Bryan said, instead of borrowing someone else's?

P.S. To the people threatening with boycots and such: it makes you sound like a 10 year old throwing a hissy fit in the toy aisle...

[wwiiogre]

Its very funny when I read responses from House unit players or future clan players that say: Why are you mad, you shouldn't get to play that canon unit xxyy. It is very funny because PGI says all House and Clan players will get to play their very own special unit and House or Clan.

Stop crying that you didn't get any cake, the whole time while they stuff cake in their mouths.

As for the "We knew all along it was going to be this way" crowd. WRONG

The quote they used to say it was going to be this way, uses the word SOME and not the word ALL. There is a bit of a difference in magnitude especially when you realize there are 6000+ in all and a few in some.

I have never said I was going to take my ball and go home. I specifically said this is not a deal breaker to me. I have never said I or anyone in our unit wanted to be THE Northwind Highlanders, we have always merely wanted to be associated with NWH.

So had BRYAN E. came on yesterday and told the community that all Merc players get to be in any of the Merc units they want, and then said NOBODY can be part of a House unit but are generically just in the house, or nobody can be part of a known Clan unit. Then the shoe would be on the other foot and the players that are Steiner, Davion, Liao, Rasalhague, Free Worlds or Kurita or any of the CLANS would be a little upset.

But instead we get true uncomprehending people posting here saying stop crying, while laughing cause they got what they wanted, and others did not.

Truly the worst sort of behavior and absolutely trolling of the cruelest sort.

I have been part of BT since Droids, I have played just about every computer version of the game since DOS. I have always been a merc if possible. I have setup my own companies, I have been parts of known companies. Sometimes I don't have the time or energy to setup my own. I instead want to step into something I am familiar with (cough House unit) like a known canon/lore/fiction/HISTORICAL unit because it feels right and its easy.

NOTE the Northwind HIGHLANDERS is a fictional unit based on a REAL WORLD military unit and associated with it as they are associated with the Stewart Clan of Scotland. As a member of the Stewart Clan of Scotland and I also have family who were Highlanders. What gives anybody the right to say I cannot associate with something that is taken from my own family and military service history? Some will take this last statement as whinging or crying, but it is a matter of fact. It is one of the reasons I associate myself with the Highlanders in game, it is family pride and heritage and respect for what that means. The NWH represent that to me in BT, I have no problem associating myself with what they represent. A lot of people feel that way about many of the known Merc units, Houses or Clans.

To have PGI say its ok to associate with X House and Y Clan but don't touch Z merc unit. Seems to be the biggest foolishness of marketing I have ever seen. Look at the url above it says MWOMERCS, not MWO. but Mercs. Yet they give everyone but mercs a seat at the table and say here enjoy the rich history of the BT universe. Associate with all these famous Houses and Clans. You Merc scum get away from the table, no food for you, go make your own. REALLY?????????

I will still play this game. I had planned spending lots of money on this free game, at this point I would rather buy more table top miniatures. Because I feel I have been purposefully taken out of the story/fiction/history of the game. When that is what brings fanatical players like me to the franchise. As an adult and one who has run huge businesses, this actually shocked me. Since why would a company that have put all of their eggs in one basket, then drop half the eggs on the floor? It makes no sense.

Our group will remain our group, what that means we are not sure, but it wasn't nice to log in here yesterday and get kicked in the nuts while they patted the heads of the House and Clan players. Just saying.

Chris

[freaktrain]

I'm actually curious how this affects the BattleCorps Legion, which is a fan unit started on the BattleCorps website (official fiction location) and which was canonized in various publications. A number of the writers and non-writers who frequent the BattleCorps Regiment section of that website would have preferred to game together as the Legion.

I presume we, as unofficial writers/readers for that canon unit, are also excluded?

[David Decoster]

Uhtredd, on 04 May 2012 - 03:27 AM, said:

Tbh i am pretty disgusted with the whole way this has been handled..

After posting merc units names and links to websites, after all the dev interaction with some of the afore mentioned merc units, and the time/effort ppl have put in to them, it is outrageous to change it now.

If this was going to be the case why the hell not tell ppl weeks ago..

If it had been clear from the start it would not have been an issue..

Although I can certainly understand your frustration, please try and show some empathy to the Dev's here... It's not like this is an industry first. Something similar happened in City of Heroes years ago, when Marvel superhero lookalikes had to change their names / characters because of an impending Marvel lawsuit. Not saying this is the same case here, but the Devs do have to put the game's best interest before the individuals / clan's...

[Max OConnor]

David Decoster, on 04 May 2012 - 08:21 AM, said:

Personally, I COMPLETELY support the Dev's take on this. I can understand some people are big fans of such-and-such unit or clan, but you can always use your imagination and work that unit/clan into the baackstory of the unit you and your friends will be creating. Look at it this way, isn't better to create your own legacy, like Bryan said, instead of borrowing someone else's?

P.S. To the people threatening with boycots and such: it makes you sound like a 10 year old throwing a hissy fit in the toy aisle...

Agreed on all parts. We have taken the lemon and are trying to make lemonade and truthfully it gives us fantastic flexibility to form our own back story and logos and such , what we don't want is to have all our hard work to be shot down because someone thinks its vaguely too familiar to a canon unit.

[Chuckie]

Prosperity Park, on 03 May 2012 - 12:45 PM, said:

What about derivatives of Merc Units, such as claiming to be part of a non-canon-existent branch of a canon Merc Company?

I think we will all just have to wait until the game is released and we can see how they plan to handle this complex and sensitive subject.

I'm sure PGI has a structure thought out.. but is still probably working on the HOW of implementing it in the game.. we all need to sit back and wait and quit getting our panties in a bunch over something that probably hasn't been fully fleshed out.

Units while an important part of RP, in the overall scheme of things is probably really low on the list of " Important things PGI NEEDS to get done before launch ".

Keep that in mind.. Seriously, do we want the game finished so we can play it sooner than later, or do you want to tie PGI up on minutiae of having to figure out the names and such of player units.

I simply plan to have fun, blow up sh*tuff up and when it comes time I will make a unit within the guidelines.

Anything else would be putting the Cart before the Horse (or Dropship in the Mech as it were)

I mean seriously, all those that put in a lot of effort I understand why you would be upset. But, you shouldn't be mad at the Devs. This is a forum for a game that has NOT BEEN COMPLETED.. They have been sharing IDEAS, and PLANS.. But not the final product. As its still a game in DEVELOPMENT..

So long story short.. Its' not their fault that you jumped the gun..

Edited by Chuckie, 04 May 2012 - 08:38 AM.

[Xyph3r]

good thing i never wanted to join a major canon unit and instead decided to write my own legacy.
now all i have to do is wait patiently until the Invasion starts xD

ASC, on 03 May 2012 - 03:33 PM, said:

Can I mount PPCs on a T-Rex?

that´d kinda look like a Tau Krootox from WH40k.... (although it´d be about twice as awesome as the Krootox )
[for another doubling of awesomeness, let a Hula Girl ride that thing^^ ]

[Mezzanine]

I can empathize with those who have worked hard to build canon merc units and are now left looking for a new option. I also think the developer stance makes a lot of sense, given that it's been the precedence in other MMOs.

I think the best solution would be a la MW4. If you remember, you created your own merc unit, but chose to affiliate it with one of the major merc "houses" a la GDL, NWH, etc. I think that all merc units should be able to have this option when they are created or even down the road. You might lose some of the control over your unit, given that you report to an NPC/GM faction, but you would still have your own smaller organization and be recognized as a part of the major canonical unit. In my opinion, this will closely mirror what it sounds like they're doing for the House units, and would be a good compromise.

Whether or not this can go in at launch, please consider (or better yet, promise) that a system like this can be established for canon merc units.

[Opus]

_{Steps on last smolder ember}

Wow, that was fun.