95 replies to this topic

[Lonestar1771]

shintakie, on 11 November 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

I think this seems to be more of an argument that trial mechs are far too gimped against pimped out mechs, possibly even that trial mechs are gimped against mildly customized mechs.The argument is not "I lost a battle and this game sucks." Its "I lost a battle and because trial mechs are fairly awful I could have done absolutely nothin to change the outcome of this battle" which is, generally, true.

More like "I lost a battle because I was over confident in my skills and went lonewolfing in the Atlas with the biggest handicap".

[shintakie]

TROWAHC, on 11 November 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

So let me get this right. You're running a Guassaphalt with a ER LL and MPL's and not enough heatsinks to counter the heat buildup?  Thats not the the game is unbalanced. Thats you not constructing a good build, or not using the mech effectively.

But by the sounds of it Mechwarrior isn't the game for you. But dont' fret there is another game that little whingy, spawn camping little a-holes like you can go and play. It's called Hawken.

So please go and play babies first mech game and leave your hate in their forums.

Readin comprehension is hard yo.

Lonestar1771, on 11 November 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

More like "I lost a battle because I was over confident in my skills and went lonewolfing in the Atlas with the biggest handicap".

I'd be confident too if I got into a fight with an opponent that was in the state his was in. If he had been in a mech that wasn't a piece of crud like the trial AS7-K he would have won that fight without breakin a sweat. As is, the AS7-K is a piece of crud that can't fight remotely efficiently in MWO.Many trial mechs have this issue and it wont stop bein an issue, really ever, unless they separate trials from normal queues which is...not the best solution (not that I have a better one).

Edited by shintakie, 11 November 2012 - 04:00 PM.

[Lonestar1771]

Sifright, on 11 November 2012 - 03:55 PM, said:

You are right I haven't, but it's a pattern i've seen time and time again in new MMOs and open beta'd projects, where people with valid complaints make posts about an issue that will effect a large number of new players and the 'old guard' loudly shout them down. The attitude is hugely prevalent and problematic. I'd go as far as saying it's cancerous to the feedback process. So many games have been utterly ruined because of it that otherwise had good potential.

I get what you are saying and feel the same way but let me be clear. I AM IN NO WAY A PGI FANBOY. PGI has taken many missteps and their inexperience is glaringly obvious.

[Lonestar1771]

shintakie, on 11 November 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

I'd be confident too if I got into a fight with an opponent that was in the state his was in. If he had been in a mech that wasn't a piece of crud like the trial AS7-K he would have won that fight without breakin a sweat. As is, the AS7-K is a piece of crud that can't fight remotely efficiently in MWO.Many trial mechs have this issue and it wont stop bein an issue, really ever, unless they separate trials from normal queues which is...not the best solution (not that I have a better one).

So.... because he failed to recognize the inherent weakness of the particular mech he was piloting and/or underestimated his opponent, it's PGIs fault? 100s of people seem to do alright with the trials why can't he?

[Keifomofutu]

Lonestar1771, on 11 November 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

So.... because he failed to recognize the inherent weakness of the particular mech he was piloting and/or underestimated his opponent, it's PGIs fault? 100s of people seem to do alright with the trials why can't he?

From his story both teams were dead and the hunch hunted him down at the end. He didn't choose the engagement.

And I'd say 1000's of people aren't satisfied with trials. The 100's can suck it.

Edited by Keifomofutu, 11 November 2012 - 04:07 PM.

[LunarWind]

All other arguments and hatreds aside:

I was under the impression that the Atlas-K was a ranged support mech.
A guass rifle, LRM 20, 2ERLL and 2MPLS?
Sounds like it's even more geared towards long-range fighting than the stock Catapult-C1.

Additionally, I have a lot of experience fighting in and against the Trial AS7-K and have found that the gauss rifle is the most potent brawling weapon it's got. Most people make the mistake of firing off the Gauss rifle at range until they have no more ammo, and then closing. Problem is, those ERLLs are AWFUL for CQC because of the heat build-up.

You're much better off using the ERLLs at range and waiting until enemies come to find you, or you have an opportunity to fight 1 by themselves. Then, having saved at least 25% of your gauss rounds for CQC, you can take those few choice shots to really punch holes in the opposition. Don't even rub the trigger on your ERLLs, much less pull it, unless you are certain it'll be the killing blow.

That said, sometimes you just lose. You cannot, in a game this slow-paced and tactical, expect to always have a K:D ratio over 1:1. With no way to regain health or ammo, you just have to die sometime, and the chances of losing fights theoretically increases by a large margin every time you win combat and begin another.

Anyways, Blah blah blah, I hate Zvero as well, but let's not shoot the messenger.
Let's shoot the message.
With advice.

TL:DR
It's the 'mech and the situation which are the problems, not the game.
You can't win every fight, especially when your 100-tons of paper meets 50-tons of scissors.

[Vernius Ix]

TLBFestus, on 11 November 2012 - 03:47 PM, said:

I always enjoy reading your posts, but not for any reason you'd understand.

/micdrop

[Sifright]

Lonestar1771, on 11 November 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

So.... because he failed to recognize the inherent weakness of the particular mech he was piloting and/or underestimated his opponent, it's PGIs fault? 100s of people seem to do alright with the trials why can't he?

More importantly the read outs on the trial mechs is useless. I could probably play a couple of them semi competently but they are horrendously bad mech load outs. The only way to see how they will play is to trial them... heh.

The problems comes from the fact that none of them are heat sinked in any way appropriately for the weapons systems they bare. The first experience users will get is with trial mechs and they are awful and they are fighting against people with custom mech load outs which will obliterate them. Any one who isn't a battle tech fan is going to be turned off so fast it's unreal. I nearly chose not to stick with it because of how much of a chore the trial mechs are to grind in for the money for THE first mech. and that was in the previous patch where the trial mechs were a bit more tolerable.

Edited by Sifright, 11 November 2012 - 04:12 PM.

[Lonestar1771]

Keifomofutu, on 11 November 2012 - 04:06 PM, said:

From his story both teams were dead and the hunch hunted him down at the end. He didn't choose the engagement.

And I'd say 1000's of people aren't satisfied with trials. The 100's can suck it.

Actually he chose to engage another Atlas by himself instead of sticking with his team and thus put himself at a severe disadvantage. That's Atlas 101: STAY WITH YOUR TEAM. Any good Atlas pilot knows this, trial or otherwise.

[Sifright]

Lonestar1771, on 11 November 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

Actually he chose to engage another Atlas by himself instead of sticking with his team and thus put himself at a severe disadvantage. That's Atlas 101: STAY WITH YOUR TEAM. Any good Atlas pilot knows this, trial or otherwise.

Skill is acquired through experience or through teaching utilities (really a'ids is asterisked? what the hell) such as tutorials castigating a player when he has neither sure is a great way to encourage participation his complaints are perfectly valid given the context of the game as a whole currently.

Edited by Sifright, 11 November 2012 - 04:14 PM.

[john shadow]

ok here we go yes ats are big and slow as hell even with the bigesed eng.but with good tictics and not freking out you can hold your own all be it with sum dficty.i have a at with 3 lrg pals lazers and heat is a pain in the butt.but went i blow away a jen it feels so good!its hard but very good when you kill a light mech. all i can say is tweak your mech till you fine the best all around config!PS my game runs at 15 fps or less cus my net sucks but i still have fun so if your game runs faster you have nothing to cry about just get better at the game!

[Wingbreaker]

Oh no, you managed to overheat in a mech that depends largely on high heat weapons.

Then you died. The game is broken!

Quel Surprise.

Edited by Wingbreaker, 11 November 2012 - 04:17 PM.

[Lonestar1771]

Sifright, on 11 November 2012 - 04:13 PM, said:

Skill is acquired through experience or through teaching utilities (really a'ids is asterisked? what the hell) such as tutorials castigating a player when he has neither sure is a great way to encourage participation his complaints are perfectly valid given the context of the game as a whole currently.

That is a totally different argument. Do I think the game needs a better tutorial system? YES!!!! But PGI has done what they can with their little videos and guides. Also it never hurts to ask in the forum or in game chat. But Mr. Buffyvampslayer has PLENTY of experience and should have known better.

[shintakie]

Lonestar1771, on 11 November 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

Actually he chose to engage another Atlas by himself instead of sticking with his team and thus put himself at a severe disadvantage. That's Atlas 101: STAY WITH YOUR TEAM. Any good Atlas pilot knows this, trial or otherwise.

You seem to ask a whole lot of new players.Fun fact, if the OP hadn't known what he was doin chances are he would have been obliterated by the Atlas he fought earlier if it were not a trial mech.

[Sifright]

the problem is trial mechs are broken. You can build the exact same mech in terms of damage output but make it objectively better in every single way with little difficulty using the mech lab if you had the chance to jig the load out.

It's beyond ridiculous to have trial mechs facing customised and kitted out mechs with obviously vastly more experienced players fighting against newbs in trials.

[christophermx4]

I'm an Atlas pilot. For what it's worth (and not much really), my K/D ratio is over 5.0. I know what I'm doing behind the controls of that 100 ton Mech, and I feel like a walking machine of death when I walk onto the battlefield in my Atlas.

I've played the Trial Atlas. While I'll admit that it has a heat problem (all of the stock Mechs do), it can wreck havoc on the enemy team if you play it correctly. It's more of a long range Mech that should never be closer than 500 meters from the enemy. Those medium pulse lasers are only meant to be a weapon of last resort.

But you know what? I'm scared to death about facing a faster mech one on one in ANY Atlas. That Hunchback that cored you - there was just a skilled pilot at the controls that exploited the natural weakness that every Atlas has: A distinct lack of maneuverability. As a result, it's not uncommon for a talented pilot in a smaller Mech to rip apart an Atlas.

But guess what? The Atlas isn't meant to be the BEST mech in the game, and it's also not meant to be the easy button. The Atlas can possess overwhelming firepower and nearly unbreakable armor but...it comes at a cost. A balance that's GOOD for gameplay. One thing the Devs have stressed (and I completely support) is role warfare. Every Mech has place on the battlefield, and natural weaknesses that be exploited on the battlefield. What if you faced that Hunchback mid-game in a long range head to head fight? You would have torn him apart in short order - faster than he could kill you.

[Congzilla]

tl; dr the OP sucks at MWO.

[Sarevos]

Sifright, on 11 November 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

the problem is trial mechs are broken. You can build the exact same mech in terms of damage output but make it objectively better in every single way with little difficulty using the mech lab if you had the chance to jig the load out.

It's beyond ridiculous to have trial mechs facing customised and kitted out mechs with obviously vastly more experienced players fighting against newbs in trials.

trial mechs require no R&R. Being costless as they are theyre for grinding money and shouldnt be as good as customs which can net you actual loss of money if you balls up badly enough and ive gotten quite a few kills in trials with more cautious game play but i do believe new players should start with some cbills

Edited by Sarevos, 11 November 2012 - 04:25 PM.

[Lonestar1771]

shintakie, on 11 November 2012 - 04:19 PM, said:

You seem to ask a whole lot of new players.Fun fact, if the OP hadn't known what he was doin chances are he would have been obliterated by the Atlas he fought earlier if it were not a trial mech.

He knew better, or should have. Yeah its 50/50 with 1 on 1, Atlas vs Atlas. The problem is that he put himself in a very disadvantageous position. He was using the mech wrong, AKA PILOT ERROR and he payed for it and is now QQing about it nothing left to be said.

[DraigUK]

Thought he had a refund and left again? Or is he back again? I lose track now.

Anyway. Stop firing ER Large when in danger of overheat.