30 replies to this topic

[tenderloving]

Is there going to be a maximum tonnage per lance or some other restriction to keep everyone from taking assault mechs?

[Volturnus]

Ehh, one would kind of hope, but I think it could interfere with matchmaking.

[Rejarial Galatan]

God I hope not. I am a heavy mech and assault mech pilot. I myself do not like the vulnerability I feel in medium/scout mechs. BUT, I will say this, so far, the only tonnage limitations I MYSELF have seen are in relation to your mech and what it can handle. In the end, its up to the devs, but like I said, an artifical lance weight limit is nonsense imho, if you can afford to field it, you should field it. I speak of course in terms of INGAME money for those who may think otherwise

[Naughtyboy]

I think one way to limit mech tonage as they did in mpbt3025 where they had diffrent planet limits, some was unlimited other was skirmish(light/medium) limits worked fairly well.

But again i agree with former posters that it might interfere with stuff.

[Motionless]

If role warfare works out like it's ~suppose to~ (have you read about this? I see it's your first post, check the sticky at the top of the page if you haven't) then having an all assault lance would be inferior to having one that includes a more varied team - meaning the players desire to win and do well can be the limiting factor in making sure not every game you're in will be all atlas or something in it.

We can look at a game like TF2, while occasionally you'll be on a team and need to say over the mic "We have 4 spies and 4 snipers, can we get some classes that can push this cart?" it generally isn't a major problem in most games, people would rather win than lose - and if they're determined to play X class then they might just go find another server, I know I personally switch off spy to solly when needed.

Edited by Motionless, 24 April 2012 - 06:54 PM.

[Lailoken]

If anything drop weight should factor into matchmaking I'd think. (That is if you choose your mech before you matchmake as some people suggest (the point being to not be able to optimize your mech for each match, but have something a bit more general or risk being at a disadvantage)).

EDIT: see clarification on next page if you don't get my meaning.

Edited by Lailoken, 25 April 2012 - 07:17 AM.

[Mystwolf]

you always have to remember this is not a 1 V 1 mech game. or even 2 V 2. As some have said IF Role warefare works as intended then you will want some light and Medium Mechs in your Company. and If everyone works as a team then it should not be the 30 Ton Mech Vs the Atlas. It's always about the team work though......a good team of 30-80 ton mechs working together , should be able to win agains a disorganized group of 75-100 Ton mechs.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Lailoken, on 24 April 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

If anything drop weight should factor into matchmaking I'd think. (That is if you choose your mech before you matchmake as some people suggest (the point being to not be able to optimize your mech for each match, but have something a bit more general or risk being at a disadvantage)).

why would you choose your mech POST launch of a match? me, I will not have anything BUT heavy/assaults in my bay. so, ya, im choosing before a match between my timberwolf or direwolf or marauder iic

[tenderloving]

Motionless, on 24 April 2012 - 06:53 PM, said:

If role warfare works out like it's ~suppose to~ (have you read about this? I see it's your first post, check the sticky at the top of the page if you haven't) then having an all assault lance would be inferior to having one that includes a more varied team - meaning the players desire to win and do well can be the limiting factor in making sure not every game you're in will be all atlas or something in it.

We can look at a game like TF2, while occasionally you'll be on a team and need to say over the mic "We have 4 spies and 4 snipers, can we get some classes that can push this cart?" it generally isn't a major problem in most games, people would rather win than lose - and if they're determined to play X class then they might just go find another server, I know I personally switch off spy to solly when needed.

I think TF2 is a great example of WHY we need some sort of weight class limit. Battlefied games are another example. Too many servers with 6 snipers on each team.

I'm aware of the "role warfare" but I've been on the internet long enough to know that if you can use the 100 ton mech, you will use the 100 ton mech.

If you have experience with previous mech games you will know that people will cheese the hell out of any flaw in the system. I think it would be a mistake not to have some sort of forced weight cap. It's in every mission of every mech game I have ever played, and I would assume that Battletech has some sort of limiting factor to how many tons you can throw on the table.

[Rejarial Galatan]

tenderloving, on 24 April 2012 - 08:16 PM, said:

I think TF2 is a great example of WHY we need some sort of weight class limit. Battlefied games are another example. Too many servers with 6 snipers on each team.

I'm aware of the "role warfare" but I've been on the internet long enough to know that if you can use the 100 ton mech, you will use the 100 ton mech.

If you have experience with previous mech games you will know that people will cheese the hell out of any flaw in the system. I think it would be a mistake not to have some sort of forced weight cap. It's in every mission of every mech game I have ever played, and I would assume that Battletech has some sort of limiting factor to how many tons you can throw on the table.

there are those who prefer the lighter options, my buddy is one of them, he likes the agility of a scout mech.

[osito]

I don't think they will have a weight limit for the entire company. I see enough people who like running mechs besides assaults. They may have some weight limit in certain drops, If that match has a specific goal. Like they are running a raiding match or something like that.

[Motionless]

tenderloving, on 24 April 2012 - 08:16 PM, said:

I think TF2 is a great example of WHY we need some sort of weight class limit.

Do you plan on explaining this at all or are you just going to throw it out there? Feel free to actually contribute something instead of just saying I'm wrong about tf2.

tenderloving, on 24 April 2012 - 08:16 PM, said:

I'm aware of the "role warfare" but I've been on the internet long enough to know that if you can use the 100 ton mech, you will use the 100 ton mech.

If you have experience with previous mech games you will know that people will cheese the hell out of any flaw in the system. I think it would be a mistake not to have some sort of forced weight cap. It's in every mission of every mech game I have ever played, and I would assume that Battletech has some sort of limiting factor to how many tons you can throw on the table.

None of the previous mech games were attempting to have a 'role warfare' element to them. If you remember MW4 mercs single player basically gave you a letter grade on the mechs you can field specifically with bigger=better. They were consciously attempting to do the OPPOSITE of role warfare often in previous games.

If there is a flaw in the role warfare system maybe they should fix the flaws so you need to play all the roles to win rather than forcing players into roles by things like weight restrictions. Weight restrictions would not fix a fundamentally broken role warfare system, it would simply mask one of the symptoms of it.

And in MW3 we used 55 and 70 tonners all the time as C5 was one of the most played gametypes. Largely Daishi and Anni were so slow and big you had to load only the longest range weapons on them or they would simply be picked off at that range, largely due to the maps had very little terrain features and were very open.

And There wasn't weight caps in MW4 mercs. You could deploy X number of mechs at any tonnage (besides solaris weight-class matches), you just payed more for heavier drops.

Edited by Motionless, 24 April 2012 - 08:33 PM.

[Rejarial Galatan]

motionless you mention fundamental flaws in role warfare, but never directly point them out. you just skip around to why weightlimits would mask it and about events in mw3.

or did i miss something?

[Motionless]

Rejarial Galatan, on 24 April 2012 - 08:40 PM, said:

motionless you mention fundamental flaws in role warfare, but never directly point them out. you just skip around to why weightlimits would mask it and about events in mw3.

or did i miss something?

I was speaking about a hypothetical situation. The person I was speaking to, Tenderloving, said essentially that the dev's 'role warfare' system WONT get people in the roles and they'll all run for assault mechs. I'm saying that if it is true, and we all run for assault mechs and that is really the most effective way to fight, they need to think about how to make the other roles more effective so that people will have incentive to play them, not simply just force people into less effective roles (which weight limits would do.)

My point about MW3 was to refute his idea that all previous mech games have simply been assault mech slug fests.

Edited by Motionless, 24 April 2012 - 08:48 PM.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Motionless: Ok, i see your point there. And Well, wierdly, I agree. But, I also gotta imagine especially with all this rabid fanbase of trashcan lovers that we will see some scouts and mediums in the mix XD

[Valkyrie Onyx]

Interesting topic I see your point but I think there shouldn’t be restrictions because I’m sure allot of people like assault mechs, and want to blow **** up without getting pwnd lol.

Edited by Valkyrie Onyx, 24 April 2012 - 09:12 PM.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Valkyrie, you plannin on opening a Pawn Shop in the battle fields? cuz, why would they end up getting pawned mid fight. I am sorry, no amount of yelling at me will EVER make me see PWN as more than an abbreviation of PAWN.

[Solarflux]

Rejarial Galatan, on 24 April 2012 - 09:19 PM, said:

Valkyrie, you plannin on opening a Pawn Shop in the battle fields? cuz, why would they end up getting pawned mid fight. I am sorry, no amount of yelling at me will EVER make me see PWN as more than an abbreviation of PAWN.

Ah, it all comes down to salavage once again.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Naw, more of: if hes opening a pawn shop mid field, im storming it and leveling it

[Solarflux]

But but but.. maybe it has something nice for sale.