19 replies to this topic

[Greyrook]

Hey Mechwarriors. So, I love PPCs, but still don't feel like they can keep up with the Guassapult. So, I finally broke down and built one for myself, and found that Guassapults are quite effective (surprising no one).

I do mention some low-end tactics, but this is more to show how effective a Guassapult is even when faffing about more than would otherwise be recommended in a PUG. However, I'm not trying to take a definitive position on the to-nerf-or-not-to-nerf question. I do state in the video that I have my doubts that the Guassapult will be going away any time soon.

Edited by Greyrook, 16 November 2012 - 11:37 AM.

[ebea51]

Gausspult Build and Tactics video???

I appreciate the effort you are putting into your videos and all.. but WHY for the love of god are you encouraging the proliferation one of the laziest/annoying/nub mech builds currently available?

[Greyrook]

ebea51, on 13 November 2012 - 06:48 PM, said:

Gausspult Build and Tactics video???

I appreciate the effort you are putting into your videos and all.. but WHY for the love of god are you encouraging the proliferation one of the laziest/annoying/nub mech builds currently available?

Now now, that's not the right attitude. As I say in the video, I do feel that it is a little too powerful, but that's no reason not to examine the build from a strategic perspective. There are tons of examples of "nub" (as you say) strategies in competitive games, and it's the responsibility of the community to try to find a way to deal with them; then if the community cannot find a tactical strategy, the nerf bat can be employed. However, there are ways to defeat gaussapults.

[Elizander]

Ah, I am so tempted to buy a K2 right now but I'm still finishing off my Atlas set. 5m to go.

[WaddeHaddeDudeda]

The Gaussapult is hands down the best mech in the game so far, ton for ton.
In organized games good Gausscat pilots will literally carry their team - even their assaults.
Why do you keep blaming people for using something which helps them to win?

IF we're talking about lame mechs, than SSRM's and LRM's would be lame - since you completely DON'T have to aim to begin with. And even then: if it helps people to win and is available to everyone it's legit.

[Hex Pallett]

I've had enough with this "Lawful-Evil" perspective for Gausspult. PGI should just f***ing ban Gausspult all over.

There isn't a single weapon in MWO that can deal 30 damage instantly, on a single spot of the target, with barely any ballistic traveling time and no minimal range, except for 2xGauss. There isn't a single weapon that can perform exceptionally well in long-range combat as well as brawling, except for 2xGauss. Dual gauss is just WRONG. And it is wrong to promote it, and even though everyone knows Gausspult already.

I hope they increase the weight of Gauss to 20ton or something.

Edited by Helmstif, 13 November 2012 - 11:13 PM.

[Greyrook]

Helmstif, on 13 November 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

I've had enough with this "Lawful-Evil" perspective for Gausspult. PGI should just f***ing ban Gausspult all over.

There isn't a single weapon in MWO that can deal 30 damage instantly, on a single spot of the target, with barely any ballistic traveling time and no minimal range, except for 2xGauss. There isn't a single weapon that can perform exceptionally well in long-range combat as well as brawling, except for 2xGauss. Dual gauss is just WRONG. And it is wrong to promote it, and even though everyone knows Gausspult already.

I hope they increase the weight of Gauss to 20ton or something.

I've got bad news, mate. Both the Cataphract and Jagermech will be able to mount dual gauss, so the number of these types of builds are going to go up, not down. I'm going to try to work on a "how to counter gaussapults" video, but I may hold off at least until the cataphract has had a chance to shine. But to address your complaints more specifically, there is always going to be a "most powerful weapon" in this game, currently it's the gauss, but it wasn't too long ago that it was SSRMs and LRMs with Artemis. There may come a point where there will be a couple weapons that have tradeoffs delimiting them for the "best weapon" position, but there's no sense in just constantly trying to bring everything to the same level.

[Greyrook]

WaddeHaddeDudeda, on 13 November 2012 - 10:11 PM, said:

The Gaussapult is hands down the best mech in the game so far, ton for ton.
In organized games good Gausscat pilots will literally carry their team - even their assaults.
Why do you keep blaming people for using something which helps them to win?

IF we're talking about lame mechs, than SSRM's and LRM's would be lame - since you completely DON'T have to aim to begin with. And even then: if it helps people to win and is available to everyone it's legit.

A true statement, but I have been in matches where my team and I get steamrolled despite me using the gaussapult. There's certainly room to say that it was just because I or my team was playing badly, but that's the definition of a competitive game and should at least identify that the guassapult can't just "1-A" to victory.

[twibs]

I like my dual-PPC + Gauss rifle loadout more. I can take those lucky shots with PPC without corcern for ammo and use gauss when I have relatively good chances of hitting.

Besides PPCs look awesome.

[Greyrook]

twibs, on 14 November 2012 - 12:04 AM, said:

I like my dual-PPC + Gauss rifle loadout more. I can take those lucky shots with PPC without corcern for ammo and use gauss when I have relatively good chances of hitting.

Besides PPCs look awesome.

I've seen people use that build, but it never seemed very effective for me (but that is pretty much just hearsay). The way I see it, you either need to dedicate to one or the other; with PPCs, you need to get as many heatsinks as possible in order to fire them often enough to warrant loading them. With gauss, you need to have as much ammo as possible. Having both seems like you're losing out on the strengths of either weapon, but I'd love to hear your full build to see for myself.

Edited by Greyrook, 14 November 2012 - 07:52 AM.

[Infavol]

tactics for a gaussapult? hah good joke

[Railgun05]

Helmstif, on 13 November 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

I've had enough with this "Lawful-Evil" perspective for Gausspult. PGI should just f***ing ban Gausspult all over.

Heh... I cant wait to hear your opinion when the clan mechs get here. (Take a look at the Vulture "C" variant sir.)

[ZionStation]

I have no problems with twin gauss, but they don't belong in the tiny side torso's of a catapult. Also, if we are to expect more twin gauss they should probably balance the damage and heat ratio so that it will take a more advance mech to tame them and use them effectively.

[Mhael]

I've used a gauss ppc K2 build before, but I would recommend using a 1x gauss 2xLL build instead. It has more raw dps than either the ppc or 2x gauss build (though it lavks the 30 pt punch at a single point). It also doesn't require an xl engine and has very manageable heat with dhs in engine plus one or two outside. The LLs also give it more of a defense against lights.

[White Bear 84]

IMO an easy way to create more balance here is for the twin gauss to not converge - just imagine your cat, with two gauss sticking out - straight out in fact. why should they converge?

[twibs]

Greyrook, on 14 November 2012 - 07:51 AM, said:

I've seen people use that build, but it never seemed very effective for me (but that is pretty much just hearsay). The way I see it, you either need to dedicate to one or the other; with PPCs, you need to get as many heatsinks as possible in order to fire them often enough to warrant loading them. With gauss, you need to have as much ammo as possible. Having both seems like you're losing out on the strengths of either weapon, but I'd love to hear your full build to see for myself.

On the other hand if you have DHS you have plenty of heat capacity that you aren't using at the moment. You can use PPC without corcerns for ammo so you can use the gauss for those bit more sure shots.

I'll post my build once I get back home.

[DivineEvil]

I thin we'll end up with premade 8x Gausspults just leveling everything in their way. Since matchmaking takes only mechs with same classes in both teams, any other Dragons or Catas in opposite will end up trashpiled in 4 minutes. Three shots, Dragon cored,rince and repeat. ERLL are only weapons that can stand against these and their DPS is so much lower. Not speaking about PPC's - not even 14x Drive DHS + 6x DHS in slots can manage this pathetic heat-factory parody of a weapon.

Edited by DivineEvil, 15 November 2012 - 11:39 AM.

[Greyrook]

DivineEvil, on 15 November 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:

I thin we'll end up with premade 8x Gausspults just leveling everything in their way. Since matchmaking takes only mechs with same classes in both teams, any other Dragons or Catas in opposite will end up trashpiled in 4 minutes. Three shots, Dragon cored,rince and repeat. ERLL are only weapons that can stand against these and their DPS is so much lower. Not speaking about PPC's - not even 14x Drive DHS + 6x DHS in slots can manage this pathetic heat-factory parody of a weapon.

It's a possibility, there were certainly instances of this in closed beta, however once the game went open I didn't see this employed even when 8 man groups were still allowed. I would imagine that in the final incarnation of the matchmaker, this type of "strategy" will not be popular, perhaps not even possible after all.

[Outfoxed]

I get the feeling all this Gaussapult-hate is more prominent right now, simply because of the limited number of mechs currenty. We likely will see alot more duel Gaus, and hell if an assault mech can maybe tripple in the future. End of the day that is their choice. I personaly prefure stomping in my one of four centurions is just more fun to play.

Though 30pts of damage is not the most you can fire off in one shot; assuming you hit, would duel AC/20 not be 40pts of damage? 9 medium lazers for 45 pts?

[Greyrook]

Vafer, on 16 November 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

I get the feeling all this Gaussapult-hate is more prominent right now, simply because of the limited number of mechs currenty. We likely will see alot more duel Gaus, and hell if an assault mech can maybe tripple in the future. End of the day that is their choice. I personaly prefure stomping in my one of four centurions is just more fun to play.

Though 30pts of damage is not the most you can fire off in one shot; assuming you hit, would duel AC/20 not be 40pts of damage? 9 medium lazers for 45 pts?

Your first point I would agree with, and I'm interested to see how their "fragility" balance will help with this (Gauss rifles will be extremely easily damaged soon). The reason dual gauss is invariably considered superior to the dual AC20, is because of the heat generated by AC20's, the lower-yield ammunition supplies for AC20s, and the gauss rifle's superior range and flexibility. There are some planned features to help differentiate the weapons more, such as increasing the impulse value of the AC20 even farther. As for 9 MLs, I'd be interested in seeing the mech that can keep up with the heat on that scale, but still have the maneuverability to get within the distances required to make it effective.