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Farming/bots - Fixing The Problem, Not The Symptoms


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Poll: Voice your opinions on the issue! (105 member(s) have cast votes)

Do you feel afk farming and bots are a problem right now?

  1. Yes, it is a major concern (57 votes [50.89%])

    Percentage of vote: 50.89%

  2. Yes, but it only is a minor concern (29 votes [25.89%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.89%

  3. Yes, but the current economy makes it necessary (7 votes [6.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.25%

  4. No, I've seen it happen but it doesn't bother me (4 votes [3.57%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.57%

  5. No, I've never even noticed it (13 votes [11.61%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.61%

  6. No, because the current economy makes it necessary (2 votes [1.79%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.79%

What kind of measures should be taken? This is a multiple choice question, so you can select all the measures you agree with.

  1. None (6 votes [3.09%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.09%

  2. Automatic detection of afk players/bots/suiciders (59 votes [30.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.41%

  3. Community feedback via a rating/reporting/votekicking system (48 votes [24.74%])

    Percentage of vote: 24.74%

  4. Captchas or a similar mechanic (9 votes [4.64%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.64%

  5. Changing the reward system (54 votes [27.84%])

    Percentage of vote: 27.84%

  6. Something else, I'll post it below! (3 votes [1.55%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.55%

  7. Changes to the economy (more free stuff and/or faster C-bill gain in general) (15 votes [7.73%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.73%

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#1 _Rorschach_

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:11 AM

So, I've been annoyed by the number of afk C-bill farmers and 'run in circles' bots and read a number of other complaints about them as well as suggestions to fix the issue on the forums. So I thought I would gather them in one place, add my own observations and opinions and create polls so you all can provide input as to what you deem necessary and sensible.

This post is rather extensive, so I'll give you an overview of what topics are addressed right here at the start.
The first part will discuss why the farming is occurring, i.e. the motivation of farmers/bots. After that I'll explain the game mechanics that make farming possible at all. Finally I'll present a number of suggestions how the issue could be dealt with.


So let's start of with the Why:
The simple answer is MONEY. By which I mean C-bills. The farmers feel they either gain too little profit each match to afford all the mechs and equipment they want in the amount of time they are willing to spend to get it without buying MCs or that rearm/repair costs are too high so they have to farm to be able to run their 'serious play' mechs for any length of time.

Personally I think the amount of credits gained in a match is pretty much ok right now. I mostly play solo with pretty tricked out heavy mechs and even in matches where our side gets steamrolled and I end up horribly shot up and cored I walk away with about 70k C-bills after repairs. Take away my bonuses and it's still around 30k.
Even if I decided to auto-rearm (which I don't, I just add one or two additional tons of ammo to offset the 25% loss due to free refill) I'd still break even in an absolute worst case scenario. From a good match I walk away with up to a quarter million within 10 minutes time. The only MC I spent so far were on an additional mech bay (still can't decide if I want a Cent 9D or a Cat C4 in there). But ofc that's personal experience and opinion.

I don't run any LRM boats (or any mech using LRMs for that matter) so I can not speak to the rearm cost for those firing in excess of 1000 missiles a match. From the little bit of math I did on that I can see that it could be a real money drain. So maybe either LRM ammo costs need to be reduced or auto-rearm set to off by default so people don't accidentally burn holes in their pockets.


Now let's take a look at the How:
There's two types of income in MWO. Individual rewards and group rewards.
Individual rewards are earned by causing damage to the enemy, spotting assists, component destruction, kill assists, kills and capture assists. They are calculated individually for each pilot.
Group rewards are win/loss/tie and capture rewards. They are the same for every player on a team. A player that is afk will obviously gain none of the individual rewards. Similarly a bot doesn't either, but they might once there are more advanced macros out there (You know they will appear. Even just randomly spamming 'R' while running circles into the ground might earn you a spotting assist once in a while).
So the farmers either use cheap custom mechs to keep repair costs at a minimum or trial mechs, so they gain the most profit from the rewards they gain without needing to participate: The group rewards.

Another variant is suicide farming. In that case the player is actually playing, but not to the benefit of his team. It works like this: Use a trial light or a custom Commando stripped of all armor and with deactivated auto-rearm/repair, run straight into the middle of the enemy team, stand still, die, earn full match rewards and maybe even some spotting/damage/kill assist money.
Why isn't this method of farming more popular? The mech is then locked until the match ends, which means it can't be done continuously. It requires the player to actually do something (even if it's just holding 'W'). The whole point of farming is to gain C-bills with the least amount of work. So I don't really consider suicide farming a problem.


Now we come to the part where we think about Solutions:
We can go two basic directions here. Take away the motivation to farm/bot or take away the ability to do so.

Taking away the motivation can be achieved in a number of ways. Increased rewards, decreased repair and rearm bills, decreased mech and equipment cost, free C-bills, free mechs, ...
Basically they all boil down to one thing: cut down the time required to earn stuff. While the economy might not be perfect (LRM rearm) I already mentioned that I think it's already pretty decent. So I don't see a whole lot that can be done on that front. Also there are two fundamental problems with this approach:
The devs need to make money. They have kids to feed and rent to pay. The game may be F2P but if they give away to much stuff for free or next to nothing, it'll go from free_to-play to simply not-play because they'll have to shut it down.
Further as long as there is ANYTHING in the game that you have to earn, ANY amount of time you need to spend, there's always going to be farmers and bots to circumvent even that amount of work.

So the other approach is to take away the means to farm. There's also a number of ways to achieve this:
AFK/bot/suicide farming detection - basically trying to find out if a player is doing one of these things and taking countermeasures. That can include server side analysis of the players input, hit percentage, movement patterns, ... or community driven detection with player ratings, reporting, vote kicking, ...
Captchas or a similar mechanic - automatic kicking/revoking of rewards for players that don't successfully complete the Captcha at the start of the match. Might be quite annoying to honest players after a while. Not my favorite.
Taking away group rewards entirely and boosting individual rewards so the gains stay at the same level overall. While more advanced bots might still make some profit here and there and suicide farmers would receive some pay it would make them largely ineffective. Just playing the game to the best of your abilities would net you a lot more than running a bot.


So finally I'd like to ask you to fill out the polls and voice your opinions on the issue. The more attention this gathers the sooner we might just see some measures to fix it!

Good hunting,
Alex/pack.wolf


edit: When writing the text about match rewards I forgot about salvage. Imo salvage money should be divided somehow based on XP earned/damage dealt so again afk players or bots don't profit from it, but active players do. This might be a tough one though, because of the different roles different weight classes play and the different amounts of dmg/XP they achieve in a match.

Edited by pack wolf, 15 November 2012 - 06:59 AM.


#2 Grugore

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:47 AM

Here's a way to deal with anyone who is bad for the gaming experience. Add a way, in game, to blacklist someone. If someone's a suspected cheater or is just someone you don't care to play with, you add them to the list and you'll never drop with them again. It would be pretty hard to cheat or farm if no one will drop with you.

#3 Sayyid

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:13 AM

I like multiple choice.

#4 Roadbuster

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:30 AM

It's a problem because it has a negative effect for normal players.
One of the team afk can be managed (why do people select an Atlas if they go afk?) but I've been in so many groups where 1-2 were afk, another 1-2 had disconnect or we started with 1-2 players missing.
It's no fun if a game suddenly turns into 4-6vs8.
I know alot of the disconnects, missing players and seemingly afk players (black screen, 4fps bug) happen because of bugs and should be fixed in the future.

To reduce the number of real afk farmers I'd change the reward system to reduced base rewards but increased rewards for actions like assists, spotting, destroying parts,...
So players will try to play better to increase their income.
This would also benefit good players who did alot to help their team even if they lost.

Regarding bots, the only solution seems to be reporting suspicious activity and hope they get a ban.

#5 Critical Fumble

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:40 AM

Farming is an issue, but captcha is just a bad idea. While it wouldn't allow you to leave it unattended for hours you could still bot while doing something else. It also annoys the people who are actually playing, which is not something that this game needs more of at the moment. Although I admit that my assessment of the idea might be too harsh because the troll-poll hybrid the last time I saw it suggested that captcha would fix the bot/farm problem.

The current reward model (excluding any founder/premium/mech bonuses) gives 75k just for playing, and another 25k for winning. To match the minimum match payout with contribution payout you would need 38 spotting/kills/kill assists or 7,500 points of damage. The farming crowd reasons that CBills are the chief source of fun in the game; and therefore the quickest way to get it is by joining a lot of matches and then leaving as soon as they get the most the least effort (see also http://www.britannic...nishing-returns).

My opinion is that rather than the win/loss payout being the major source of income it should either be a small cushion for steamroll matches or removed as exchange for vastly decreased repair/rearm costs. Along with that the contribution rewards would be reworked as the main income source. Damage, for instance, does not take into account the usage of ammo based weapons, making you lose money relative to energy only builds. It should at least try to break even with your ammo costs at some reasonable degree of accuracy and competency.

I'm hoping that the upcoming matchmaker patches will at least remove them from the good, decent, actually playing players. It would also be funny if PGI noticed a sharp increase in the number of draw rounds:
Dev A: "Hey, you see all these draw rounds? Whats up with that?"
Dev B: ". . . LOL! All bots."
Dev A: "LOL! Mass ban time!"

#6 Stickjock

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:45 AM

Farming

Quote

We are addressing several known issues with farming.

Trial Mech Locking
  • Trial Mechs will now work the same as any BattleMech, they are locked until the match ends. This ends the ability for a macro player to "churn" matches to maximize CB.
Quitting/Disconnecting Early - While Still Alive
  • You will only receive rewards up to the point of disconnection.
  • NOTE: If you are dead, you will receive earned rewards, plus match rewards.
Idle/AFK
  • Players that fail to provide any input will be kicked from a match Although it does not prevent a macro player from simply putting in inputs, it forces them to LOOK like a bot.
Abusing this system is considered a violation of the TOS/COC.



#7 Raeven

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:56 AM

View Postpack wolf, on 15 November 2012 - 04:11 AM, said:

So, I've been annoyed by the number of afk C-bill farmers and 'run in circles' bots and read a number of other complaints about them as well as suggestions to fix the issue on the forums. So I thought I would gather them in one place, add my own observations and opinions and create polls so you all can provide input as to what you deem necessary and sensible.




I've been informed, because I've had it happen to me when I disconnected mid match, that the 'run in circles' 'Mechs aren't farming but have had a client crash. Apparently, it was very amusing watching the enemy team line up in a tango line to chase my 'Mech down to try and kill it. Or so the laughing hinted.

#8 _Rorschach_

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:05 AM

View PostStickjock, on 15 November 2012 - 06:45 AM, said:



You're probably getting at 'this is beta, they are working on it'. I'm aware and I appreciate their efforts. Imo the game is more fun than it has been in quite a while atm (although LRMs seem a little bit underpowered). That's why I try to support their work with constructive feedback. You know, like a beta tester :rolleyes:

View PostRaeven, on 15 November 2012 - 06:56 AM, said:

I've been informed, because I've had it happen to me when I disconnected mid match, that the 'run in circles' 'Mechs aren't farming but have had a client crash. Apparently, it was very amusing watching the enemy team line up in a tango line to chase my 'Mech down to try and kill it. Or so the laughing hinted.


Oh I didn't know that. I've only noticed mechs circling inside or very near their own base from the start of the game until their eventual demise. So I just assumed those where macro programs. Crashed clients that are circling should be distinguishable from those though, since they would show up as disconnected, right?

#9 Stickjock

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:09 AM

View Postpack wolf, on 15 November 2012 - 07:05 AM, said:

You're probably getting at 'this is beta, they are working on it'. I'm aware and I appreciate their efforts. Imo the game is more fun than it has been in quite a while atm (although LRMs seem a little bit underpowered). That's why I try to support their work with constructive feedback. You know, like a beta tester :rolleyes:


Simply linked the thread and quoted that the Devs really ARE working on addressing the issues... and constructive feedback is always appreciated... :lol:

#10 _Rorschach_

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:14 AM

View PostStickjock, on 15 November 2012 - 07:09 AM, said:

Simply linked the thread and quoted that the Devs really ARE working on addressing the issues... and constructive feedback is always appreciated... :lol:
I might just be reading a bit too much into comments these days since there's so many that go that way. Sorry for the misunderstanding :rolleyes:

#11 Stickjock

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:20 AM

No worries wolf... :rolleyes:

#12 Taryys

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:27 AM

I cover a solution here:

How To Reduce The Grind And Create A Great New User Experience

#13 Raeven

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:41 AM

View Postpack wolf, on 15 November 2012 - 07:05 AM, said:


Oh I didn't know that. I've only noticed mechs circling inside or very near their own base from the start of the game until their eventual demise. So I just assumed those where macro programs. Crashed clients that are circling should be distinguishable from those though, since they would show up as disconnected, right?


No idea. All I know is it was 3 or 4 minutes into the game, I was circling around in a fight when I CTD'd. The game kept my Jenner moving in the same manner I was going when I crashed, so it looked like I was just doing a tight circle mid map.


Beginning of match disco's are apparent to the client. Mid game CTD's, not so much.

#14 Sable Hawk

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 12:06 PM

It would be nice if the pay out at the end of the match was more team based.

Reduce the Win/Loss bonus (10,000/5,000) so that there is still incentive to win, but it isn't the end all be all of the battle.

Implement "Investiture" If you are invested in the match, you get the most out of it. Spend less than 60 seconds on the Battlefield, you get 0% C-Bills & Exp. At 2 Minutes you get 50%. at 3 Minutes you are fully invested. If you happen to win a round before the 3 minute mark, anyone still connected is automatically fully invested. This would be based on connected time (so the suicide/AFK farmer still has to sit around to get their payout making it more of a hassle while the active player won't have to change at all). Granted this would not give any rewards to those who black screen, freeze, or get disconnected but there is no mechanic that could accurately identify them either. Not to mention, the Devs are working hard to eliminate those problems (right??).

Give bonuses for multiple hit targets. Kill shots and assist kills would still we rewarded, but an additional bonus for hitting a target that someone else is also actively engaging. So that scout tagging the lumbering Atlas while LRM's rain down upon him, even if they don't end up killing the Atlas, both scout and LRM boat get a bonus for acting like a team. And the bonus grows with each person. So if said Atlas is getting hit by a Gauss kitty, a hunchback while getting tagged and rained upon, they would each get more of a bonus than if it had just been scout/LRM. (say something like scout/LRM both get 1.2x assist bonus; while Kitty/Hunchie/scout/LRM would each get 1.4x assist bonus). This would encourage team play and focus fire.


edit:typos

Edited by Sable Hawk, 15 November 2012 - 12:08 PM.


#15 renahzor

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 01:34 PM

View PostSable Hawk, on 15 November 2012 - 12:06 PM, said:

Implement "Investiture" If you are invested in the match, you get the most out of it. Spend less than 60 seconds on the Battlefield, you get 0% C-Bills & Exp. At 2 Minutes you get 50%. at 3 Minutes you are fully invested. If you happen to win a round before the 3 minute mark, anyone still connected is automatically fully invested. This would be based on connected time (so the suicide/AFK farmer still has to sit around to get their payout making it more of a hassle while the active player won't have to change at all). Granted this would not give any rewards to those who black screen, freeze, or get disconnected but there is no mechanic that could accurately identify them either. Not to mention, the Devs are working hard to eliminate those problems (right??).


So that increases the minimum time in a round to 3 mins, and does nothing else to address the problem overall. It just makes people stay in for 3 mins then suicide, doesn't actually get them to play nice. Also I'm pretty sure at this point the blackscreening on drop and random CTD with no warning is a feature, at least it's been in the game long enough to feel like it.


Basically the entire rewards system needs an overhaul in a major way, and the trial mech system along with it.

Step 1 is to move a majority of the rewards off of win/loss bonuses for trial mechs. Currently they make up over 50% of every trial mech's payout. Change the rewards structure by adding in many more "active" in match rewards(like spotting bonus etc, but for flanking, TAG/Narcing, focus fire, etc etc). In addition, add in daily, weekly, lifetime and milestone bonuses to cbills for performance.

Daily and weekly bonuses would be for achieving the goals within that timeframe, say 10 spots in a day, or 50 in a week give a 10k/50k Cbill bonus, doable every day/week respectively. Lifetime bonuses would be rolling bonuses tracked separately, and giving increasing rewards as you progress through the tiers. 10 lifetime spots = 1k Cbills, 25=3k, 50 = 7k, 100, 250, 500, 1,000 spots and beyond all ramping up rewards as the person gets more and more of these in. Lastly milestone rewards would be one time payouts based on a milestone achieved within a match. 1 spot, 5 spots, 10 spots, 20 spots 30 spots each having its own milestone, and increasing bonuses as they become increasingly difficult. Doing a set of objectives like these laid out for every type of in game action (damage, kills, assists, spots, spot assist, and a slew of other new categories as well) would allow them to move rewards off of win/loss bonus and on to actual in game participation and mech exploding.

Second step is fix the trial system. The trial mechs are obsolete, tabletop variants in a game which cannot and will never replicate tabletop balance. The baseline variants all tend to favor well rounded range options and many run hot even in TT, let alone a game where the mechs generate more than 2x as much heat as they should for most weapons. Swap to a trial system that gives players modified loadouts that are either popular, voted in by the community, or at least SANELY setup with this game's systems in mind. A few base models are barely serviceable in MWO, but that number is dwarfed by the remainder which simply do not work well in this system and are being thrust upon new players.

#16 Usagi

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 02:42 PM

View Postrenahzor, on 15 November 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:


So that increases the minimum time in a round to 3 mins, and does nothing else to address the problem overall. It just makes people stay in for 3 mins then suicide, doesn't actually get them to play nice. Also I'm pretty sure at this point the blackscreening on drop and random CTD with no warning is a feature, at least it's been in the game long enough to feel like it.


Basically the entire rewards system needs an overhaul in a major way, and the trial mech system along with it.

Step 1 is to move a majority of the rewards off of win/loss bonuses for trial mechs. Currently they make up over 50% of every trial mech's payout. Change the rewards structure by adding in many more "active" in match rewards(like spotting bonus etc, but for flanking, TAG/Narcing, focus fire, etc etc). In addition, add in daily, weekly, lifetime and milestone bonuses to cbills for performance.

Daily and weekly bonuses would be for achieving the goals within that timeframe, say 10 spots in a day, or 50 in a week give a 10k/50k Cbill bonus, doable every day/week respectively. Lifetime bonuses would be rolling bonuses tracked separately, and giving increasing rewards as you progress through the tiers. 10 lifetime spots = 1k Cbills, 25=3k, 50 = 7k, 100, 250, 500, 1,000 spots and beyond all ramping up rewards as the person gets more and more of these in. Lastly milestone rewards would be one time payouts based on a milestone achieved within a match. 1 spot, 5 spots, 10 spots, 20 spots 30 spots each having its own milestone, and increasing bonuses as they become increasingly difficult. Doing a set of objectives like these laid out for every type of in game action (damage, kills, assists, spots, spot assist, and a slew of other new categories as well) would allow them to move rewards off of win/loss bonus and on to actual in game participation and mech exploding.

Second step is fix the trial system. The trial mechs are obsolete, tabletop variants in a game which cannot and will never replicate tabletop balance. The baseline variants all tend to favor well rounded range options and many run hot even in TT, let alone a game where the mechs generate more than 2x as much heat as they should for most weapons. Swap to a trial system that gives players modified loadouts that are either popular, voted in by the community, or at least SANELY setup with this game's systems in mind. A few base models are barely serviceable in MWO, but that number is dwarfed by the remainder which simply do not work well in this system and are being thrust upon new players.


There are some interesting ideas here. I very much agree with having more things like spotting, component destruction and kill assist at the end of a game (for people like me...always the kill assistor...never the killer XD). And, though you didn't say it, i would like to see their values increased, and the static win/loss/tie value decreased. But only to the point that an average player would make roughly the same in a match as they do now, just for different reason. The actual, final, numbers of the current economy are working out fairly well.

I like the idea of benchmarks over a time period too. However, i don't think they should have a very steeply increasing reward value, if any at all. Mostly because it could get to be either too much on the high end, or laughably small on the low end. Getting a flat amount for each step of the accomplishment would be better for new players, as you'll likely earn the lower tier ones faster, and basically get some "new player bonus money" for just discovering how things work. Then, after you're more veteran, you can actually attempt to achieve the higher numbered ones more concertedly, or just let them come as they may.

You could actually divide them by weight class, too. With something like the weekly, you can have "tag or narc 20 targets, that then get hit with missiles" for lights and then "destroy 20 components" for mediums, up to like "score over 250 damage in one match 20 times" for an assault class or something.

Also, on the lightly touched subject of repair and rearming. LRM costs are too high, just straight up. I have a fairly standard LRM cat (founders cat, with 2 LRM 20s and 4 medium lasers) and i have to over-load on ammo to actually use it (utilizing the 75% rearm for free). Doing the math, firing one volley of LRMs from that costs roughly 7000 c-bills. No matter what that shot does, it will never make back that money. For ammo, I'd like to see the current costs listed be the cost to install an ammo housing on a mech, basically. But have the cost to refill it with ammo drastically reduced. That goes for almost all ammo based weapons, really, ballistic or missile. The second part of repair/rearm that bugs me (and it's a bt of a personal soap box :D) is the cost of armor versus internals. My repair costs usually have (unupgraded) armor costing roughly 75-80 times as much to repair as (unupgraded) internals. This baffles me. it costs 75 times as much to bolt a plate on, then it does to repair much more delicate and complex structures. But, even ignoring the "common sense/reality" that could be applied to that (because I do believe that game balance trumps "reality" every time) it discourages a pilot from piloting well. It says "sure, you can twist, turn, and take those shots on your armored parts to stay alive longer, but we'll punish you for it later" instead of making the external armor cheaper to repair, and "punishing" someone for having their internals blown apart. It shouldn't cost as much for my atlas to repair it armor as it does to repair it's gauss, and two ER large lasers, XL engine and all internal damages. But, almost every fight, the cost for armor, and the cost for structure and "items" is almost identical. usually within about 5K c-bills of each other.

Also, it's nice to see the OP here has a clear personal view on this subject, but made a poll that look pretty even haded at the same time. Good job on that.

#17 _Rorschach_

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 03:36 AM

A daily bonus for the first victory is a pretty neat idea. I am definitely in support of this! But I'm unsure about other daily/weekly achievements and rewards. Once matchmaking is finalized and groups can challenge specific other groups that could lead to achievement farming, similar to Team Fortress 2 idle- and achievement-servers.
One time lifetime rewards would be cool too. As long as they are done in a way that they can be achieved by regular play and don't require you to do stuff that would otherwise be seen as bad gameplay or unfavorable for the team, just so you can grind your rewards. They have to 'happen' during normal play.

#18 Sid Vishus

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 04:35 AM

look new players are forced to drive crap mech and die so what do you expect its not the typ of new player experience anybody would want and i believe that they are loosing players directly because of it not to mention the game is totally unplayable mess at the moment with fps issues and wildly unbalanced weps just b4 the last patch i shelled out 50 dola and hav not been able to play properly sins is pisst off--- this is what happens when making money **** before making a good game ffs mech warrior 4 is a free download --- is sad but gameing is about how much muney they can get out of you and how often and from what i hav seen in my 3 weeks here thes guys canot organise a pissup in a brewery

#19 Slanski

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 05:20 AM

MWO is a game. Games are all about incentives and outcomes. Actually games are models of live behaviour under certain incentives.

If you have unfun, non conductive game behaviour, you have set up bad incentives.

Solution:
Get rid of trial mechs. Place any new player in a semi stock commando which requires little upgrades that can be afforded from first rounds played.

Consequence:
Immediate identification with ingame avatar. Immediate "skin in the game." Your mech is non discardable and is yours. Even with little CBill consequence you treat your own ride different from a rental car that you don't have to pay repair costs on.

For the MW fans: The Commando of MW Mercenaries was ideal for this. The feel of coming into a big world with an underpowered ride that you could tweak from your first earnings.

#20 Ewigan

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 05:36 AM

this whole "give away free commandos" thing... i dunno about that.
on one hand: i earned my commandos. i did the grind (twice) and through that i learned a LOT about weapons, damage, piloting, etc. and it was quite satisfying to FINALLY have my own mech.
on the other hand: yeah, getting a own mech to instantly tinker with sounds cool. you will learn what works and what won't work on your mech this way. as an addition: no one ever will take me in my commandos seriously. finally my k/d ration will get up :)





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