299 replies to this topic

[Flyby215]

In Starcraft 2 there's a few levels I don't like playing in order to obtain useful units. In Diablo 3 you need to kill some very annoying bosses to beat the game. In the Sims you need to annoyingly make lots of family friends to advance careers. It's part of every game, everywhere.

I have not purchased any MC yet, but I have master on 3 Catapults (C1, A1, K2) with pugging only. It doesn't take that long. Can't wait for the Stalker. I'll happily dish out some money for extra mech bays or colour schemes on my Stalker (hint, hint, want my money? Hurry up with Stalker!)

[Harmatia]

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

Cosmetics have nothing to do with grind at all. Besides if you have a rind generally it is considered wise to at least try to hide that fact. Most players only like one version of a mech, and hate being forced to play other configs that can often be vastly inferior. Hell the Jenner K has no reason to exist beyond unlocking elite certs. How is that not a flawed system?

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 09:48 AM, said:

Thankfully no. However you get barely any money from selling your mechs because PGI loves to try and brute force players into spending money.

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 09:55 AM, said:

Just enjoy losing an edge because your basic efficiencies are no longer doubled and you have no elites. Just because PGI aren't pointing a gun at player's heads and making them grind doesn't mean the system is any less stupid.

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 10:00 AM, said:

Well the assumption was that we would have more than 4 mechs actually worth using. PGI have however been rather poor on delivering that. How is it not the point?

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 10:08 AM, said:

They already made back all their dev costs and turned a profit. Just because the game is free to play does not mean they need to gate off everything with stupid amounts of grind that players hate in the off chance they will pay for shortcuts instead of leaving for one of the many better ran F2P titles out there. When I say run I mean both in how they do business and the game not being a buggy trainwreck that crashes every hour. Also Mechwarrior was already being revived before MWO was even started as a free mod called Living Legends, you may not have heard about them much since PGI slapped a cease and desist order on their *****.

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 01:46 PM, said:

Too bad the game isn't worth $1.50 in it's current state.

Man you ***** a lot.

[Mousepup]

This ****-party board software's censor is driving me utterly nuts! I have no clue what you just said because it could be something like "whine" or something awful, because apparently common words like [a synonym for rooster] and the name of some one VERY important to remember the actions of due to the gravity of the consequences lest we forget [yeah, think of the most utterly absurdly dramatic interpretation of that and you'll probably be right] are filtered yet [a medical/hygiene device whose name is used as a term for "asshat"] is not filtered. It's like whomever they bought this solution from just hired a hundred or so random peops, assigned each a portion of a dictionary, and instructed them to input every "offensive" word for Censortron's vocabulary with absolutely no guiding principles for what does or does not qualify...

[Weiland]

Is it inconvenient? Certainly.

Is it a good, solid, working system? Yep, and here's why.

Let's start with the practical aspect. Simply grinding experience into a single mech wouldn't amount to much of a challenge. I generate enough experience in a few hours of gameplay to fully master the pilot tree of any mech. It wouldn't be much of a challenge at all to reach if I just had to grind one mech.

And here's the working aspect. I used to groan about having to max three individual variants in order to get my Elites. Initially, it looks a bit much to ask. Almost looks like purely a money sink, in fact, and it's unlikely that a lot of bottomfeeders simple, everday players will see past that. After getting all of my Hunchbacks to Elite, however, I ended up seeing the value to it. I learned so much as a Hunchback pilot between building three different variants, adapting my techniques, and learning the intricacies of the mech to make her a success. I would consider myself at a loss and possibly a dire loss if I'd not actually had to build out three variants. As a result, I'm actually contemplating a fourth - no lie.

Regarding the apparent lore aspect, a Mechwarrior in BT could only ever afford about one mech and mastering the mech was a lifelong process (and since being a Mechwarrior was inherently hazardous, the premium on expert pilots was significant). Seeing as how MWO allows you to practically own and operate an entire company - or more - worth of mechs, I don't really see lore as amounting to much here.


TL;DR: Keep it. It's a valuable system and it forces incompetent noobs how to pilot better encourages players to really get the feel for their mech.

[Scytale]

I voted no because:

I just got all three basic on the commando chassis. I felt that the different hardpoint configuration of each one I worked on taught me different aspects of playing the mech, and I think I've come out better for it. It feels like I've earned the right to increase my top speed by 10%, because I know a lot better what the mech is about.

[Ricama]

Well punishing is a relative term, it is the source of the "grind" for MWO. If you want a maxed out gaussapult, you're going to have to go missiles and energy. If you want a maxed out fastback, better get used to the gaussrifle/ac 20 (though you can do it with missiles if you like). Odds are good you will find a combination you like that you would have never tried without being forced but still it's the grind ... and it isn't really that bad, you can max out a mech in a determined day.

[Weiland]

Scytale, on 18 November 2012 - 03:15 PM, said:

I voted no because: I just got all three basic on the commando chassis. I felt that the different hardpoint configuration of each one I worked on taught me different aspects of playing the mech, and I think I've come out better for it. It feels like I've earned the right to increase my top speed by 10%, because I know a lot better what the mech is about.

Ergo the idea of "tweak" in Speed Tweak.

Edited by Weiland, 18 November 2012 - 03:20 PM.

[197mmCannon]

every game needs some sort of grind or players get bored and just quit.

It's just gamer fact.

I feel ya on not liking it. I only like one Centurion model and it sucks to have to grind through 2 mechs I don't like to get the XP unlocks.

But honestly it's not that bad. How about grinding through 9 tanks on world of tanks just so you can finally get the Tier X and start doing Clan Wars? You have to grind out money to buy them and you have to grind out xp to unlock them first. Hopefully you like playing the tanks but there is always 1 or 2 in every line that just sucks to have to play.

I honestly feel like they should have made the XP system more of a grind. Add some specialization.

It's just too easy.

[Scytale]

Weiland, on 18 November 2012 - 03:19 PM, said:

Ergo the idea of "tweak" in Speed Tweak.

I don't follow?

[AlbinoSlug]

It's PGI trying to frustrate you into spending cash. So yes.

[Scytale]

AlbinoSlug, on 18 November 2012 - 03:24 PM, said:

It's PGI trying to frustrate you into spending cash. So yes.

Loving the straight-up assertions with no backing-up reasoning. Well done.

[The_Desert_Tiger]

I voted no. I would like to see the trees expanded and the idea of forcing you to grind three mechs is a great way to have people learn more than one mech. Diversity is not a bad thing.

And anything that encourages people to put money into the game is not a bad thing.

[Harmatia]

Scytale, on 18 November 2012 - 03:27 PM, said:

Loving the straight-up assertions with no backing-up reasoning. Well done.

It's the world, brother. People will whine and blame someone else when they're not good at, or don't like, something.

[Weiland]

Scytale, on 18 November 2012 - 03:23 PM, said:

I don't follow?

When you tweak something, you're fine-tuning it to perform supra-optimally. Hence why the name Speed Tweak makes sense in correlation with your example.

[Aquilus]

I don't mind having to buy 3 variants. It makes you actually specialize in certain mechs. The problem is that some mechs' variants don't actually vary much at all, some are simply inferior versions with no upside. An example of this would be the JR7-K, which is basically just a JR7-D with one less missile hardpoint. (And one more module slots, so you can equip more modules than are currently available, useful!). If/when they tweak the stats of variants to make them differ more, I don't think this is a bad idea at all.

[Dirkdaring]

Enig, on 18 November 2012 - 09:41 AM, said:

I want to drive my 4x now until the end of oblivion. But even if I put in thousands of hours into my 4x I will never be a master? How does that make sense?

It doesn't make any sense. Because it's a money sink. They want you to spend actual $.

[Weiland]

Dirkdaring, on 18 November 2012 - 03:33 PM, said:

It doesn't make any sense. Because it's a money sink. They want you to spend actual $.

Hmm. I don't see putting actual money for a mech that's not a Hero. I'm able to grind three variants inside of a weekend casually.

[Celros]

I voted no, why because I feel game truly needs longevity and time until everyone gets master status. Also this aint arcade mech shooter

[Harmatia]

Dirkdaring, on 18 November 2012 - 03:33 PM, said:

It doesn't make any sense. Because it's a money sink. They want you to spend actual $.

It makes perfect sense, the game has no admission cost and is totally reliant on micro transactions for funding. Such as purchasing mechs. In fact, if a player was incredibly cheap they could just grind out CB and never drop a penny of actual currency on anything relevant to playing the game. If someone wants to minimize the time spend doing those things, they can option for the ability to purchase with real currency. All actual money does in MWO is provide shortcuts and customization options. If people are too impatient to earn CB, use a credit card. If people are too cheap to use a CC, well then they've become their own problem.

[SmilingElf]

Sephlock, on 18 November 2012 - 09:43 AM, said:

For one thing, some variants would almost never be used otherwise.

At that point, I'd wonder why they made them in the first place? (Other than to fill out the 3 variant requirement to progress.)

Personally, I would rather see a growth tree that allows us to customize the mech we're driving, rather than just having to grind xp to have the mech reach its full intended potential.