10 replies to this topic

[beniliusbob]

Hi,

I'm trying to figure out how to figure out whether or not I have room for double heat sinks on a Dragon 1N with ES and FF. I just... have no idea what I'm looking for. When viewing the different parts of my mech in the lab, I defintely seem to have filled up nearly all of my critical slots. Is it those open slots that double heat sinks will fill? And if I use double heat sinks, does that mean my 10 heat sinks will occupy triple, or 30, slots?

Thanks in advance!

-bn

[knight-of-ni]

In the mech lab, count how many blocks of three empty critical spaces you have. Treat any existing (single) heat sinks as empty spaces.

If your engine is >= 250 and < 300 then add 1 to this number.
If your engine is >= 300 then add 2 to this number.

This will be the number of the double heat sinks you can potentially add to your mech.

Note that the heat sinks internal to your engine (up to 10) do not use critical spaces.

EDIT:
forgot to account for the fact that DHS take up a continuous block of three spaces (e.g. you can't use the empty spaces in your legs). Modified to take account for this.

Edited by knnniggett, 21 November 2012 - 10:49 AM.

[Redshift2k5]

beniliusbob, on 21 November 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

Hi,

I'm trying to figure out how to figure out whether or not I have room for double heat sinks on a Dragon 1N with ES and FF. I just... have no idea what I'm looking for. When viewing the different parts of my mech in the lab, I defintely seem to have filled up nearly all of my critical slots. Is it those open slots that double heat sinks will fill? And if I use double heat sinks, does that mean my 10 heat sinks will occupy triple, or 30, slots?

Thanks in advance!

-bn

Double Heat sinks take 3 crits- If you have 10 single heat sinks mounted outside your engine, then, yes, switching them all to doubles will take 30 crits and you most likely will not have this much space.

Also note double heat sinks can only be slotted in the arms, side torsos, and inside the 'engine slots' (you get 2 engine slots in a 300 engine). DHS cannot fit in legs, CT, or head.

Using DHS and ES and FF is not a very good plan- you simply will not have the criticals to make use of DHS if you are using Endo and FF! I reccomend an XL engine and DHS if you want ot use DHS (and only if you have a very high-heat build)

Edited by Redshift2k5, 21 November 2012 - 10:39 AM.

[Hellkyte]

For a smaller mech like a dragon that has a large engine it makes a lot of sense to use DHS. The engine heat sinks will operate at 2x the regular heatsinks, so even before you use a critical slot you have 20 heat sinks, and you get them at effectively half the tonnage. And with a 300+ engine it works even better due to the additional slots.

I would drop the FF and go DHS.

[Grayzzur]

This handy java app written by one of the players helps you fit a Mech outside the game. It's quite useful.
http://mwomercs.com/...echbay-program/

A 250 engine is the "base" engine that holds 10 heat sinks, no extra math required. For every extra 25 on the engine, you get 1 extra heat sink slot (275-295 gets 1, 300-320 gets 2, 325-345 gets 3, etc.). In these slots you can put extra heat sinks.. does not matter if they are single or double.. you pay the tonnage, but not the crit space, for the sinks. For every 25 LESS than 250 on your engine, you lose 1 heatsink, but you are still required to have a minimum of 10 total for a valid mech build. (Lose 1 for 225-245, lose 2 for 200-220, etc.) In this case, you must bring your total up to 10, paying for both tonnage and crit space. Beyond that, you pay the tonnage and crit space as normal for what the engine doesn't hold.

EDIT: Number typos are Bad.

Edited by Grayzzur, 21 November 2012 - 03:12 PM.

[John MatriX82]

only by upgrading those in the engine you'll get double DHS which will dissipate 2 times what you actually have. If you are using any engine above 275 (1 slot), 300 (2 slots), 325 (3 slots for hs) you can store further DHS within the engine without sacrificing further criticals.

My dragons mostly feature 10/11/12 DHS (total number) right for this.

[Frenchtoastman]

Hellkyte, on 21 November 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

For a smaller mech like a dragon that has a large engine it makes a lot of sense to use DHS. The engine heat sinks will operate at 2x the regular heatsinks, so even before you use a critical slot you have 20 heat sinks, and you get them at effectively half the tonnage. And with a 300+ engine it works even better due to the additional slots. I would drop the FF and go DHS.

^^^this
That Ferrofib is only saving you one-ish ton or less, get rid of it and you'll save money on repairs too.

The DHS in the engine alone will probably be matching the cooling you have right now, anything more will be a plus.

I'd personally stay away from XL if you can avoid it, but it's up to you if you end up actually running out of weight.

Would you mind telling what current engine+weapons+heatsinks you're running, AND what you're trying to add or change?

Edited by Frenchtoastman, 21 November 2012 - 04:57 PM.

[beniliusbob]

Thanks, everyone, for the tips!

Frenchtoastman, on 21 November 2012 - 04:16 PM, said:

Would you mind telling what current engine+weapons+heatsinks you're running, AND what you're trying to add or change?

I totally miscalculated when I bought the FF: I thought it would save me way more tonnage. I was a little disappointed, but I figured I could stick with it. Now that I know it's behind my 80k repair bills, I guess I can ditch it. It looks like doing so will cost me 300k, but it might be for the best.

That said, I don't know how much more I'll play around with the 1N. I really like the Dragon, despite the difficulty I've had equipping it, so I'll probably just get another variant. Right now, though, my 1N is equipped with:

Standard 300 engine
10 heat sinks
1 LBX + 2 tons ammo
1 SRM6 + 1 ton ammo
2 Medium Lasers
1 AMS + 1 ton ammo
Something like 380 armour
FF and ES

This build has been a lot better than the other ones I've tried, like twin AC2s or AC2 + AC5. But I have a little compulsiveness when it comes to filling all the slots, so I'm contemplating twin Large Lasers, twin Streak SRMs, and twin Machine Guns - which is why I'm wondering what options are open to me in terms of heat management. For some reason, I didn't even think about just adding regular heat sinks, which would work for that build.

But, like I said, might just buy a new model, because I have the bills and tons of experience on the 1N.

Thanks again for the advice, and any further ideas - especially in terms of the best kit for this Dragon variant - are greatly appreciated!

-bn

Edited by beniliusbob, 21 November 2012 - 06:02 PM.

[Frenchtoastman]

That looks like a fun build, might be hard to drop the Ferro right now without having a way to drop weight. Double heatsinks are a fine upgrade though, you only use the ten in the engine anyway so you'll just be doubling that for no added weight or space. Even if the engine ones get nerfed sometime you'll still get four free heatsinks outta the deal.

How is that lbx in the arm treating you? I've heard some people end up with wonky firing patterns.

Edited by Frenchtoastman, 21 November 2012 - 07:21 PM.

[wanderer]

Yep. Ditch the ferro-fibrous armor, it's the upgrade that gives you the least return.

Think about it this way. Endosteel eats 14 crits. That's equal to taking up every free space in your torso. FF armor takes up another 14. That's virtually every space in your arms besides if you had both mounted,leaving virtually zero space open for equipment.

The only 'Mechs that should really consider both at once are lights that don't pack much else to begin with- and even then, FF armor is likely not worth it.

[Krazy Kat]

I did the math before switching to double heat sinks and found out my heat dissapation got a little worse (not enough slots.) But I did it anyway for the tonnage it frees up. With the free tons I bought a bigger engine. The bigger engine had 2 more heat sinks than the smaller one. The end result was a much faster mech with better heat dissapation. Win