145 replies to this topic

[Moonsavage]

@Bluescuba.
"sustain more damage than we would if we dropped as a full premade of 8"

Are you comparing the situation today with a time in closed beta where 8-man premades could go up against random drops?

[DeVivar]

Bluescuba, on 21 November 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

I need to clarify a few things first...

1. Premades were forced to play with pugs.

Nope, PuGs where forced to play with premades.

So people that play the game exclusively with what the client gives them, where forced to play against people who use a third party product to give them an advantage.

Nah, just joking. I'm ok playing against premades. I even don't care anymore if they start moaning treads about us like this one. I hope someday the devs can make you happy by letting you play exclusively against each other. In the meantime, you're welcome stomping me and my mostly clueless lancemates of the PuG imperial Mechforce, or not. Whatever.

Oh, and I know that this should be a team based game... I don't care.

Have a nice day.

[Little Nemo]

Galenit, on 21 November 2012 - 06:31 PM, said:

The game too.

Every time you stomp a group of new players in trials, some of them will go, for ever ...

How many players do this game need, to develop to what it should be and what was promised?

Op, ask the devs how much money they need every month, then divide it by the 10% players playing in premades and you know how much is it for you to play without pugs.

You can't go up making up statistics like you have access to PGI's financials.

[Gravaar]

Moonsavage, on 21 November 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

Right.
I'm getting pretty sick of people using the term "PuG" in a derogatory sense.
People like YOU are ruining MY game, with your premade teams and voice comms.

The sooner random games do not allow groups, or groups can only fight other groups the better in my book.

Until then, count your blessings because you have an advantage over many of us who are getting pretty sick of losing through no fault of our own.

And no, I'm not QQing, I'm bloody angry - this game is not YOURS, it's OURS.

I am sorry that your game experience is unsatisfactory for you at the present time
The game is/was designed for team play with an option for solo players to have a bit of fun, unfortunately neither type has their game mode working as intended yet so.......please just hang in there , get whatever small victories you can and brush up on your piloting skills while it doesn't count because everything is so unbalanced

[Little Nemo]

DeVivar, on 21 November 2012 - 06:44 PM, said:

Nope, PuGs where forced to play with premades.

So people that play the game exclusively with what the client gives them, where forced to play against people who use a third party product to give them an advantage.

Nah, just joking. I'm ok playing against premades. I even don't care anymore if they start moaning treads about us like this one. I hope someday the devs can make you happy by letting you play exclusively against each other. In the meantime, you're welcome stomping me and my mostly clueless lancemates of the PuG imperial Mechforce, or not. Whatever.

I sure wasn't moaning, but whatever.

Oh, and I know that this should be a team based game... I don't care.

Have a nice day.

[Riffleman]

Skinny Pete, on 21 November 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

Let me start by saying I've read many threads like this and have finally reached my breaking point with the extra four pugs that join my team. Like always, I advise them to stay together, work as a team and tell the scouts to scout and not be a hero.

But of course, my group sticks together, the pugs run off and try to fight their own battles and we end up 4v8. It took me five games in a row. I honestly can't wait until we go to 8v8 premades.

No offense to lone wolves, but it just doesn't jive with how I like to play. To each their own.

You know everyone always says "what are the pugs going to complain about when theres no team boogeyman to blame for their loss" Well I say "what are tryhard bad teams going to blame their losses on when they only play other teams"

If you lost as a 4 man team 5 times in a row you should be ashamed of yourself. 4 people on a team should WALK over the other side, even if everyone on their team is suicide commandos.

If you need 4 disorganized guys on your side to help, absorb fire, or point out the other team you, not them, are doing somethng wrong.

[Moonsavage]

That's probably a wormhole you don't want to go down, Skinnypete... 10% is probably a conservative estimate.

[Little Nemo]

Riffleman, on 21 November 2012 - 06:50 PM, said:

You know everyone always says "what are the pugs going to complain about when theres no team boogeyman to blame for their loss" Well I say "what are tryhard bad teams going to blame their losses on when they only play other teams"

If you lost as a 4 man team 5 times in a row you should be ashamed of yourself. 4 people on a team should WALK over the other side, even if everyone on their team is suicide commandos.

If you need 4 disorganized guys on your side to help, absorb fire, or point out the other team you, not them, are doing somethng wrong.

Waxing hypothetical doesn't prove anything.

[Taizan]

As long as we all get jumbled into one pot thanks to the random team finder thing, we are all a PUG.

Full Premades ruin(ed) the random team finder as well, because well it wasn't really random any more was it. Well PGI has taken countermeasures and now often I read things like "Hey we are a four man" and further information on what they are going to do. Sometimes it works out and its nice teamplay from everyone, sometimes it doesn't.

Just saying PUGs ruin the game and looking at it from on the high horse is not contributing anything, Either try to work as a full team even though 4 are not on your holy golden cow voice chat or try to work out how to effectively give commands that everyone can work with. Just using the Command map function can do wonders.

[Sybreed]

honestly, all these threads would die if PGI would implant in-game VOIP

/thread

[Riffleman]

Bluescuba, on 21 November 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

I need to clarify a few things first...

1. Premades were forced to play with pugs. I have never read a thread where premades cried about being stomped by pugs, the opposite is what I read. To be frank about 75% of the time it wasn't even true, as 3 out of 4 times the pugs were facing other pugs. But rather than fixing their broken match making system, pgi listen to the qqing and forced premades to drop in 4s plus pugs. So if anyone has a right to complain about the current state of match making it is the premade players.

2. Premades play the game utilising role warfare, this means that they ran with specific (specialised) mechs that did different tasks. Players depended on their team mates to a much greater extent, and the diversity of the builds in the old 8 man premades reflected this. Role warfare is one of the things that pug group are worst at, how could it be otherwise as they drop randomly. Accordingly, since the 4 + 4 match making has come into effect premade 4s, have had to change to more general mech builds, reducing the game's diversity.

3. Premades were formed, in order that players could communicate. When do you think all the premades were created? Most of them formed or increased when pgi decided to close the mwo beta ts channel. Prior to that a lot of premade player pugged in voip drops. Once pgi removed this the premades were born. Current puggers for some reason do not want to communicate, and refuse any attempt or suggestion that they use voip.

4. In the current game at the end of a match it is the premades players that are in the top 4 slots for xp (score) 9 out of 10 times, we have the most kills, assists and damage output. So whatever you say it is the premades who are carrying the pugs.

5. Do premades lose more games now? To be honest yes, but only by a very small percentage, what is telling, however, is the fact that when playing with pugs we expend more ammo and sustain more damage than we would if we dropped as a full premade of 8.

So now to answer the question...

Yes playing with pugs does ruin the games for premades, because premades are forced to play with pugs, Do pugs ruin the game for other pugs? No why would it.

The question I would ask is do premades make the game better for pugs? On one hand yes because they will win more often but on the other hand no because the premades carry them so they do not improve their game play.

The last thing I will say on this matter (which is something I have said in many posts) is that premades find playing pugs boring and would always prefer playing against other premades.

Sweet god man, how do you continue??! You say your taking EVEN MORE DAMAGE NOW?!? and that ammo costs have gone up! I bet your kill death ratio dropped from 9/1 to something more like 8.75 to 1. Truely you are a source of inspiration to be able to carry on like this.

LOOK AT WHAT YOU MONSTERS HAVE DONE TO THIS MAN AND HIS FRIENDS! Personally Im with you, I cant have fun in a game where I have a small chance of not winning byas much as possible.

Skinny Pete, on 21 November 2012 - 06:52 PM, said:

Waxing hypothetical doesn't prove anything.

sir, you cannot use this phrase to try and deligitamize someones post, when your post is essentially the opposite but same.

Edited by Riffleman, 21 November 2012 - 06:56 PM.

[Taizan]

Sybreed, on 21 November 2012 - 06:55 PM, said:

honestly, all these threads would die if PGI would implant in-game VOIP

/thread

THIS. and give a quick dial F-Keyed Menu. Attack/advance/help etc. blah done in so many games. Has already been suggested.
/close /thread /please

[Bluescuba]

Moonsavage, on 21 November 2012 - 06:42 PM, said:

@Bluescuba.
"sustain more damage than we would if we dropped as a full premade of 8"

Are you comparing the situation today with a time in closed beta where 8-man premades could go up against random drops?

No we sustain more damage because we do a disproportionate amount of the fighting. Back in the day of 8 man premades damage would be distribute more evenly, but now we have to fight in non specialised mechs soaking up a disproportionate amount of damage because pugs have either got themselves killed, run off to the middle of nowhere or are using their weapons incorrectly (point blank lrm and ppc, 500m ml and srm shots???). Are there some good puggers? Yes but they are out numbered by the vast majority of bad ones.

[DeVivar]

Skinny Pete, on 21 November 2012 - 06:50 PM, said:

I sure wasn't moaning, but whatever.

You're not the only one contributing to the thread. I actually think your original post was quite civil... Redundant, but civil. But we all know how this kind of thread allways end, don't we?

Edited by DeVivar, 21 November 2012 - 07:04 PM.

[Little Nemo]

Taizan, on 21 November 2012 - 07:00 PM, said:

THIS. and give a quick dial F-Keyed Menu. Attack/advance/help etc. blah done in so many games. Has already been suggested.
/close /thread /please

You're in no position to suggest closing of anything, friend.

[Streeter]

Taizan, on 21 November 2012 - 07:00 PM, said:

THIS. and give a quick dial F-Keyed Menu. Attack/advance/help etc. blah done in so many games. Has already been suggested.
/close /thread /please

function command keys maybe, in game VOIP Im not so sure. Team Speak is free and takes about 5 mins to setup. I dont believe anyone wanting communication would be that lazy not to be able to set it up. They just dont want to communicate that way.

[197mmCannon]

Skinny Pete, on 21 November 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

Let me start by saying I've read many threads like this and have finally reached my breaking point with the extra four pugs that join my team. Like always, I advise them to stay together, work as a team and tell the scouts to scout and not be a hero.

But of course, my group sticks together, the pugs run off and try to fight their own battles and we end up 4v8. It took me five games in a row. I honestly can't wait until we go to 8v8 premades.

No offense to lone wolves, but it just doesn't jive with how I like to play. To each their own.

You realize that your implying that the enemy either has 2 4 man premades or has puggers that are sticking together and focus firing.

[Bluescuba]

Riffleman, on 21 November 2012 - 06:57 PM, said:

Sweet god man, how do you continue??! You say your taking EVEN MORE DAMAGE NOW?!? and that ammo costs have gone up! I bet your kill death ratio dropped from 9/1 to something more like 8.75 to 1. Truely you are a source of inspiration to be able to carry on like this.

LOOK AT WHAT YOU MONSTERS HAVE DONE TO THIS MAN AND HIS FRIENDS! Personally Im with you, I cant have fun in a game where I have a small chance of not winning byas much as possible.

You think I care if I lose? My statements regarding taking more damage etc were there simply to illistrate the fact that it is the premade 4s which are doing the majority of the fighting in these bastardised groups nothing more.

[Taizan]

Skinny Pete, on 21 November 2012 - 07:04 PM, said:

You're in no position to suggest closing of anything, friend.

Actually everyone can suggest it because this thread has run its course before it even started, if a moderator decides to go through with it or not is not my or your decision though.

Nevertheless, let me try to help you out as it seems you want to befriend me in a mysterious way. You do have a bit of an overbearing undertone in your writing, if you communicate the same way with your 4 random teammates when joining a pug match, maybe that explains why they don't care and you are having such unfortunate experiences.

Its the tone that makes the music.

[Little Nemo]

Taizan, on 21 November 2012 - 07:16 PM, said:

v
Actually everyone can suggest it because this thread has run its course before it even started, if a moderator decides to go through with it or not is not my or your decision though.

Nevertheless, let me try to help you out as it seems you want to befriend me in a mysterious way. You do have a bit of an overbearing undertone in your writing, if you communicate the same way with your 4 random teammates when joining a pug match, maybe that explains why they don't care and you are having such unfortunate experiences.

Its the tone that makes the music.

Once again, you're saying something with the confidence that your troll clan will back you up. Back on topic, I am willing to guess that the majority of the population would rather have 8v8 premades.