65 replies to this topic

[Aelos03]

John Talbert, on 03 May 2012 - 04:03 PM, said:

buying a race car because you can does not make you a race car driver. I'll stick with earning my keep and likely being better for it. WOT has the same issue with premium tanks. it shows when someone buys one but lacks the ability

ye but give it hands of someone who know and you have different story also include premium shells and if you dont have premium acc you get less exp and money and when you get hight tier tank you cant make enough money to repair tank you lost in battle so if i play and my tank is destroyed i i lose money(and premium dont) now thats a p2w model if you dont pay you wont stand a chance, but if only thing that someone can buy is equipment that is available to everyone then thats ok for me i don't mind it, but i know i will rather spend my money on skins and some cool stuff like that, i like to earn things and i feel buying something that i know i will get sooner or later is wast of my money but if people want let them have it earlier then me.

Edited by Aelos03, 03 May 2012 - 05:21 PM.

[Hekler]

As long as Real money cannot buy things that time cannot earn, i don't seem a massive problem.

I don't have much time to play these type of games these days, but if after 6months if I'm way behind the average player in terms of tech and exp. the ability to catch up is nice. Not that I probably will, as half the fun is earning new stuff.

Edited by Hekler, 03 May 2012 - 07:36 PM.

[Mr Smiles]

The other big reason this won't be a big issue is, other than 'Mech chassis... what are you buying?

A Catapult will be just as good now as in two years. A Mad Cat will be amazing when it comes out... and it'll be just as amazing later on.

You can buy both of those with in-game C-Bills. It'll take a little time. But then you'll have them and... won't ever need to upgrade. You might CHOOSE to upgrade, swap out components or whatever, but you won't NEED to. There won't ever be a Catapult2, now with LRM-30s instead of 15s.

Between that and weight classes being more or less balanced by speed and utility... I'm really not worried. Player A spends a month getting himself a Black Knight, Player B gets it immediately, two years later they both still have it. So what's the problem?

[Howlin Wolf]

Stating that premium accts that earn extra C-bills and xp is wrong, is inaccurate. The idea in itself is sound so long as it is a true bonus and free players dont get penalized by making subpar rewards per battle so the premiums make and the f2ps lose. The good idea (premium) remains good so long as greed doesnt slant it into becoming a ravenous beast as one game that has been mentioned thus far has become.

I hope MWO does have a premium acct. If I see I am not getting forced into a pay to play scenario and no real money rounds and no special mechs with slanted MM bias in its favor are being sold I will be happy to support the game by purchasing premium status at a reasonable price. I believe premium accts is one sure way to get a steady flow of revenue coming in on a f2p game. How they set up premium is their business C-bills or xp or both forms of rewards is their business. Their all carrot no stick strategy seems to be a winner to me. I hope they stick with it through out the life of the game I really want to find and support a game that is fun and fair for all players.

Like everyone else I will have to wait and see exactly what they will offer for real money.

Edited by Howlin Wolf, 03 May 2012 - 10:49 PM.

[Hyperius]

Howlin Wolf, on 03 May 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

Stating that premium accts that earn extra C-bills and xp is wrong, is inaccurate. The idea in itself is sound so long as it is a true bonus and free players dont get penalized by making subpar rewards per battle so the premiums make and the f2ps lose. The good idea (premium) remains good so long as greed doesnt slant it into becoming a ravenous beast as one game that has been mentioned thus far has become.

The rest of your statement kinda became moot after you said this. People are greedy and they will abuse and exploit any system that gives them premium privileges. A lot of ideas are sound until the human element is introduced and completely destroys it. That's why so many free-2-play games degenerate into pay-2-win scenarios.

[-Ramrod-]

Well to be honest I play Yoville on Facebook. Laugh all you want I know. But its the same thing. Face it guys these developers are here to make money. If not at first, but eventually things will be available real cash only...or so monstrously high in C-Bills that you would need real cash to get that much. Game maybe made by fans...but its still a company...that wants money...nothing wrong with that...its just business.

[Howlin Wolf]

Hyperius, on 03 May 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

The rest of your statement kinda became moot after you said this. People are greedy and they will abuse and exploit any system that gives them premium privileges. A lot of ideas are sound until the human element is introduced and completely destroys it. That's why so many free-2-play games degenerate into pay-2-win scenarios.

As it had been stated earlier in the thread real money equates to time. time = C-bills, xp. If they do a poor job of keeping the game fun and fair with such an option to all players then i wont support it. I played that other game for over a year and paid for one month of premium and never begrudged people getting a return for supporting the game.

Only the devs can exploit any pay model. I will just have to wait and see as everyone else will.

Edited by Howlin Wolf, 03 May 2012 - 11:16 PM.

[Hyperius]

Ramrod AI, on 03 May 2012 - 11:07 PM, said:

Well to be honest I play Yoville on Facebook. Laugh all you want I know. But its the same thing. Face it guys these developers are here to make money. If not at first, but eventually things will be available real cash only...or so monstrously high in C-Bills that you would need real cash to get that much. Game maybe made by fans...but its still a company...that wants money...nothing wrong with that...its just business.

Depends on how successful their initial business model is really. If they can offer everything to everyone without forcing them to pay real money and they still turn an adequate profit then they'll keep it going. Once they start losing profit, most likely due to dwindling population, then they will change it. And I would argue that there actually is something wrong when the ultimate goal of every endeavour is to make money but we probably shouldn't get into that.

[-Ramrod-]

Hyperius, on 03 May 2012 - 11:16 PM, said:

Depends on how successful their initial business model is really. If they can offer everything to everyone without forcing them to pay real money and they still turn an adequate profit then they'll keep it going. Once they start losing profit, most likely due to dwindling population, then they will change it. And I would argue that there actually is something wrong when the ultimate goal of every endeavour is to make money but we probably shouldn't get into that.

Yea that's one of them controversial subjects aint it? Definitely not for a Mechwarrior forum .

[Howlin Wolf]

Ramrod AI, on 03 May 2012 - 11:07 PM, said:

Well to be honest I play Yoville on Facebook. Laugh all you want I know. But its the same thing. Face it guys these developers are here to make money. If not at first, but eventually things will be available real cash only...or so monstrously high in C-Bills that you would need real cash to get that much. Game maybe made by fans...but its still a company...that wants money...nothing wrong with that...its just business.

They are in the business to make money. Hopefully they can make money and not turn the game into a huge grinding monster. I wont stick around for that. But i will support a game that i can have fun in without spending money. I hope they make tons of money and dont try fleecing me in the process. I dont like getting fleeced.

[Sassori]

To use your cup analogy:

You have a cup that holds amount A of water.

You can purchase a cup that holds amount B of water.

Amount A is less than B. Therefor B = Better right?

Possibly.

However: If amount A is more than enough water to quench your thirst already, then B is not really any better than A.

In other words: If I buy a PPC that has green energy bolts instead of Blue energy bolts, for example, is that better? If you like Green more than blue, hell yes it's better. Otherwise, it's not.

Also: If I can buy with RL cash an Atlas (For example), but I can also buy that very same Atlas with in game money and no RL cash, then how is it Pay to Win?

Anyways, they'll make WAY more money on cosmetic stuff like chassis and paint jobs than they will by selling 'better' guns.

[Hyperius]

Howlin Wolf, on 03 May 2012 - 11:14 PM, said:

As it had been stated earlier in the thread real money equates to time. time = C-bills, xp. If they do a poor job of keeping the game fun and fair with such an option to all players then i wont support it. I played that other game for over a year and paid for one month of premium and never begrudged people getting a return for supporting the game.

Only the devs can exploit any pay model. I will just have to wait and see as everyone else will.

Yes but anytime paying real money gives players a substantial and unbalanced advantage it will ruin the fun and fairness of the game. This is when it moves from being a profitable f2p to a p2w because many players will exploit this advantage and the rest will either give up or be forced to pay if they want to continue to have fun.

It's like free game demos kind of. You can get it for free and play a limited portion of the game but in order to get the full experience you need to shell out the money. In this model the free portion only exists to push players into paying money for the full game rather than being a full game unto itself with optional micro-transaction opportunities. As far as I know, the latter is the direction PGI wants to take MW:O, at least at first.

[Hyperius]

Howlin Wolf, on 03 May 2012 - 11:21 PM, said:

They are in the business to make money. Hopefully they can make money and not turn the game into a huge grinding monster. I wont stick around for that. But i will support a game that i can have fun in without spending money. I hope they make tons of money and dont try fleecing me in the process. I dont like getting fleeced.

But that's the issue. A model where unfair privileges are given to payers will, in essence, fleece everyone else into paying as well to even the field. That's what people are worried about.

[Magnificent Bastard]

LOL. Another F2P thread. These are getting quite comical people. I look forward to the day when threads like this pop up and people start responding with OLD.jpg

Edit: Here's new and different content in a thread like this for people to enjoy...

Edited by Magnificent Bastard, 03 May 2012 - 11:37 PM.

[Howlin Wolf]

Hyperius, on 03 May 2012 - 11:30 PM, said:

But that's the issue. A model where unfair privileges are given to payers will, in essence, fleece everyone else into paying as well to even the field. That's what people are worried about.

I have never felt at a disadvantage while not paying in WoT until they made it hell for free players. Odd I paid them just before they started tightening the screws on free players or they wouldnt have gotten a month out of me. Guess its a matter of perception. And ours are totally different.

[RedHairDave]

after the disaster of world of tanks, i wont play another p2win title. i love mechwarrior more than i love just about anyhting else in life, but even then.

[SideSt3p]

Again, we have nothing handed to us. I think if you want to get a good idea, go look at League of Legends. You can buy skins (paint jobs), champions ('Mech Chassis), and Boosts (C-bills and Experience). OBVIOUSLY this isn't an exact comparison, but we don't have anything to play either!

So again, we can sit here and just base stuff off of pretty much nothing or be patient and we'll see it when we see it.

[EDMW CSN]

Cash = C-bills. You can either grind for C-bills OR pay cash and get that mech now. It can be unbalanced at a certain stand point if the guy just bought ER Larges and a Gauss rifle without grinding, but ultimately you will get there. Just when ?

Thankfully BT uses a Hp / ablative armor system, so no shots pinging off your enemies ala WOT style. A guy with a trick out assault still has **** poor rear armor and head armor after all.

Edited by [EDMW]CSN, 04 May 2012 - 07:12 AM.

[Aelos03]

Howlin Wolf, on 03 May 2012 - 10:42 PM, said:

Stating that premium accts that earn extra C-bills and xp is wrong, is inaccurate. The idea in itself is sound so long as it is a true bonus and free players dont get penalized by making subpar rewards per battle so the premiums make and the f2ps lose. The good idea (premium) remains good so long as greed doesnt slant it into becoming a ravenous beast as one game that has been mentioned thus far has become.

I hope MWO does have a premium acct. If I see I am not getting forced into a pay to play scenario and no real money rounds and no special mechs with slanted MM bias in its favor are being sold I will be happy to support the game by purchasing premium status at a reasonable price. I believe premium accts is one sure way to get a steady flow of revenue coming in on a f2p game. How they set up premium is their business C-bills or xp or both forms of rewards is their business. Their all carrot no stick strategy seems to be a winner to me. I hope they stick with it through out the life of the game I really want to find and support a game that is fun and fair for all players.

Like everyone else I will have to wait and see exactly what they will offer for real money.

[xHeero]

Orzorn, on 03 May 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

The item/mech that he buys with real cash is the same item/mech that I buy with c-bills. Its not better, he just got it faster.

For some reason people refuse to accept this. The expanation is clear. Someone spending money could unlock something faster than you. You would have to play several games to acquire the in game currency to get what the other person spent real money to get right away.

If anyone wants a great example of this go look at League of Legends. There are cosmetic "skins" that make a character look cooler/different. You can ONLY buy these with real money. Then there are in game unlockables like champions and runes. You can earn in game currency to buy these, or you can spend real money to get them without having to play a bunch of games. There isn't really much complaining about this F2P model with League of Legends. You can play a very fun game for free, and then if you want to unlock some stuff faster, or buy a cool skin for your favorite hero you are free to spend some real money on the game.

No, there will not be a mech or weapon that you can only buy with real money that is better than anything else in the game. That has been made very clear.