29 replies to this topic

[Kanatta Jing]

After re-reviewing the BattleMech Efficiencies table it suggests that there is a cumulative bonus to obtaining the Elite rank in each variant of a Mech.

http://static.mwomer...ev_blog4_01.jpg

As someone interested in spending a lot of time in a Catapult, I then checked the number of variants of the Catapult likely to be available at release.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Catapult

CPLT-C1, 2 LRM 15s and 4 Mlas. The model we are all familiar with.
CPLT-K2, 2 PPCs, 4Mlas and 2 Machine guns. As has been shown in screen shots.
CPLT-C4, 2 LRM 20s and 1 Slas. This would totally make sense.
CPLT-C1 "Butterbee", 4 SRM 6s and 4 Mlas. This could totally make the cut.
CPLT-A1, 2 LRM 15s. This is the kicker.

Every Catapult pilot will have to spend time in the A1 to get the full bonus's. Buying the Mech, and engaging in multiple battles with that Mech until they have the coveted Elite tag.

I will also assume that the A1 has no torso based weapon mounts at all.

The A1 is strictly a missile boat, meaning you could gimp your primary function as a tool of long range bombardment and rig one arm with SRMs or be entirely unable to fire on brawlers.

When you pilot the A1... Everyone else in your lance is going to yell at you at some point for failing to contribute as much as they think you should to the engagement. No matter what you do.

I thus suggest that we coin the term "A1ing it" as a general term for someone forced to pilot a substandard chasis to the anguish of their team mates to grind bonus's.

[Leetskeet]

If the A1 is just a Catapult that dropped the lasers for a bunch of LRM ammo, I don't see that as being a variant available in the game. Easily made in the mechlab, but not sold as an actual stock variant.

I expect the C1, K2, and the SRMpult to be the variants available, assuming they're going for 3 variants for each mech. There's no reason to include a dumbed-down version as an actual variant when the stock variant can just drop the lasers in the mechlab if some one wanted to waste their time.

[pursang]

Isn't the Catapult's base configuration the C1? I would think it would make more sense for new players to start off with the C1 rather then the heavier-armored A1. Anyway, there's always the chance of getting yelled at by noobs who don't know what fire support and the like means. It's best just to ignore those kind of people.

Edited by pursang, 06 May 2012 - 01:38 AM.

[Kanatta Jing]

pursang, on 06 May 2012 - 01:35 AM, said:

Isn't the Catapult's base configuration the C1? I would think it would make more sense for new players to start off with the C1 rather then the heavier-armored A1.

I propose that they would start in the C1 but go back to the A1 for the Elite 1 +0.5% stacking bonus.

[Leetskeet]

Kanatta Jing, on 06 May 2012 - 01:38 AM, said:

I propose that they would start in the C1 but go back to the A1 for the Elite 1 +0.5% stacking bonus.

But the A1 isn't going to be in the game, and that's actually something I can say with certainty. You can turn a C1 into an A1 with how they're setting up the mechlab.

There will be a few variants that give you different hardpoint options, i.e. the difference between the K2 and C1's weapon loadouts, but there's not going to be a variant to grind that is nothing more than the stock variant minus secondary weapons, because the mechlab handles that.

Edited by Leetskeet, 06 May 2012 - 01:43 AM.

[Hayden]

Kanatta Jing, on 06 May 2012 - 01:21 AM, said:

CPLT-C1 "Butterbee", 4 SRM 6s and 4 Mlas. This could totally make the cut.

Butterbee is actually a prime example of a 'mech lab design. It's a one of a kind as far as I know?

[Kanatta Jing]

Hayden, on 06 May 2012 - 01:53 AM, said:

Butterbee is actually a prime example of a 'mech lab design. It's a one of a kind as far as I know?

I thought it was a prime candidate for the "extra module slot" variant.

[Akenatum Malthus]

looking at the loadouts mentioned the c1 "butterbee" can be made with the standard c1 mechlab as well since missile hardpoints don't distinguish between types of missiles, i am assuming here that an lrm15 would take up 2hardpoint slots while a srm6 would be taking up 1 slot therefore meaning that they would be the same chassis with diff loadouts... (i'm just bassing this off the small mock up to describe the mechlab and prior mechwarrior games having that.)

rofl i should read entire thread someone said this already

Edited by akenatum, 06 May 2012 - 02:03 AM.

[Gun Bear]

If there are three variants of the same 'mech I think the third might actually be CPLT-C2 which uses an XL engine and an endo chasis and carries artemis supported LRM 15's and two LBX/AC 2

[Gun Bear]

Or the C3 with an Arrow IV Artillery.

Those are both different enough to count as full fledged variants.

[Evex]

I never got the point of piloting multiple variants for a bonus to the mechs abilities. Lets assume that the abilities tie across the mechs. Well lets do a theoretical situation where, if these bonuses do go across the mech, and you have to unlock the first six again over x number of variations. Then the mech could be close to a super mech in theory. Another thing to consider is that a pilots abilities are directly connected to unlocking the ability points used by pilots. Is there a limit on how many points a pilot can get and use for abilities, if not whats stopping a player who has a pilot that can do everything? One last thing to consider is with some mechs having multiple variants, which most are not available from the start, if a new variant is added would a mech lose its elite bonus?

The thing is the catapult only has two missile hard points, which means it can only mount two missile based weapons. So the C1 catapult would only be able to mount 2x srm-6, or 2x MIas. It not capable of mounting eight types of missiles at the same time. If we were talking critical spaces with out the hard point system in place. Then yes it would be able to do so, if the critical space was available. The A1 also lacks the beam hard points of the C1 in exchange for more ammo, and armor. Granted you can make an A1 out of a C1, but the thing is you would need to know the technical specifications, of how much more armor the A1 has over the C1.

[LackofCertainty]

akenatum, on 06 May 2012 - 02:02 AM, said:

looking at the loadouts mentioned the c1 "butterbee" can be made with the standard c1 mechlab as well since missile hardpoints don't distinguish between types of missiles, i am assuming here that an lrm15 would take up 2hardpoint slots while a srm6 would be taking up 1 slot therefore meaning that they would be the same chassis with diff loadouts... (i'm just bassing this off the small mock up to describe the mechlab and prior mechwarrior games having that.)

rofl i should read entire thread someone said this already

You won't be able to mount 2 srm's where you mounted 1 LRM. The devs have said that hardpoints limit the number of weapons without reguards to size.

If you put an SRM-2 into the arm harpoints on the Catapult, those hardpoints are full. (you'd have a lot of spare crit space for modules and such, but you couldn't put any more weapons in there.

On the other extreme, if you somehow found the weight for it, you could mount 2 PPC's in the LT and RT medium laser slots. (They wouldn't fit in the CT slots, because of crit space, however)

Kanatta Jing, on 06 May 2012 - 01:21 AM, said:

CPLT-C1, 2 LRM 15s and 4 Mlas. The model we are all familiar with.
CPLT-K2, 2 PPCs, 4Mlas and 2 Machine guns. As has been shown in screen shots.
CPLT-C4, 2 LRM 20s and 1 Slas. This would totally make sense.
CPLT-C1 "Butterbee", 4 SRM 6s and 4 Mlas. This could totally make the cut.
CPLT-A1, 2 LRM 15s. This is the kicker.

The strike through indicates variants that won't show up in game. (the devs said that they won't put in variants that could be made by modifying the base chasis)

The butterbee I highly doubt will be in the game, because if the Butterbee existed, the stock version of the Catapult would be obsolete. (you could just buy the butterbee and pull off the SRM's and toss a LRM-15 on both sides)

Instead, I suggest this as the third variant:
CPLT-C2 replaces the ML's with 2 LBX AC2's. (note that this makes it functionally different than the other mods, because of the ballistic hardpoints it'd come with)

With the C1, C2, and K2, you'd have 3 distinct choices for hardpoints.

C1- Missles + energy
C2 - Missiles + Ballistics
K2 - Energy slots + ballistics

Ta-dah!


Edit:

Gun Bear, on 06 May 2012 - 02:24 AM, said:

Or the C3 with an Arrow IV Artillery.

Those are both different enough to count as full fledged variants.

Arrow 4 is still a missile, you silly goose. Quit forgetting everything the devs have said about hardpoints.

Edited by LackofCertainty, 06 May 2012 - 02:30 AM.

[Kanatta Jing]

But the C2's autocannons are LBX's. I don't think those will make the initial release.

Or the Arrow IV for that matter.

Edited by Kanatta Jing, 06 May 2012 - 02:33 AM.

[Gun Bear]

LackofCertainty, on 06 May 2012 - 02:27 AM, said:

Arrow 4 is still a missile, you silly goose. Quit forgetting everything the devs have said about hardpoints.

Hey its 6:30 AM cut me a break. Besides it fires like artillery...

[LackofCertainty]

Kanatta Jing, on 06 May 2012 - 02:32 AM, said:

But the C2's autocannons are LBX's. I don't think those will make the initial release.

Or the Arrow IV for that matter.

You do have a legitimate point there, but it's simple enough for them to just replace the LBX's with normal AC 2's till the LBX's are available.

Edit:
And I still think that it's the only other viable cannon variant, because all the other variants could either be made from the default Catapult, or would make the default catapult obsolete (in the butterbee case)

Edited by LackofCertainty, 06 May 2012 - 02:37 AM.

[pursang]

We'll be able to use the LBX-10 at launch, but not the -2,-5, or -20 until 3058. I'd also like to point out that the "Butterbee" is a unique variant from a canonical character.

Edited by pursang, 06 May 2012 - 02:37 AM.

[Kanatta Jing]

pursang, on 06 May 2012 - 02:35 AM, said:

We'll be able to use the LBX-10 at launch, but not the -2,-5, or -20 until 3058. I'd also like to point out that the "Butterbee" is a unique variant from a canonical character.

Like every character of a certain class of a certain level carrying around a certain supposedly one of a kind item?

That stuff happens all the time.

[pursang]

Kanatta Jing, on 06 May 2012 - 02:42 AM, said:

Like every character of a certain class of a certain level carrying around a certain supposedly one of a kind item?

That stuff happens all the time.

Huh? The Butterbee isn't a production model nor even a prototype. It's an "unofficial" variant of the C1. One that can easily be re-created using MW:O's MechLab.

Edited by pursang, 06 May 2012 - 02:45 AM.

[Cruxshadow]

If I were to go power gaming with a Cat variant, I would go with a Savage Wolf (Mad Cat Mk4). I like the extra versatility that the Mad Cats give.

[Gun Bear]

Cruxshadow, on 06 May 2012 - 04:12 AM, said:

If I were to go power gaming with a Cat variant, I would go with a Savage Wolf (Mad Cat Mk4). I like the extra versatility that the Mad Cats give.

*Le sigh*

We aren't talking about the Timberwolf, we are talking about the Catapult.