38 replies to this topic

[Carionte]

OMG....
I just remember when I played MechCommander 1 and 2. By that time, if I saw a streak build in the field, the first thing I would have forbid my mechwarriors was to close the gap.
Now, all you are saying is "this is OP bububu take it off so I can be a bad player and do pew pew". OMG, it is just one possible build, not even a good one because you can blast it off with almost any other weapon at medium range. Just learn to keep your distance and wait for the netcode fixes.
Whenever I see a streakwhatever I just run like hell into and out of his sight. He follows me: he is dead by any other guy's whatever weapon. He doesn't follow me: I get to live a little longer in my ****** Cicada.

[TickingTimeTit]

I feel like Voidsinger had the best proposal so far, as well as many in this thread:

http://mwomercs.com/...streak-control/

[Fate 6]

Franchi, on 26 November 2012 - 06:10 PM, said:

Put it on the mech then come back and talk.

Streaks on lights aren't a problem, net code IS.

Your example is fail a cicada should lose to two jenners.

And remember your team mates ams will shoot at streaks if they are in range.

It just occurred to me tonight that with LRMS in the trash can everyone is striping AMS from their mechs contributing to the streaks are op QQ fest.

I play an A1 with 2 LRM 15s and 4 SSRM2s, so I pay a LOT of attention to who has AMS. Here's my thoughts on AMS, which I still see on plenty of mechs (and more than half of the Streak Cats have it as well):
-It's kind of useful against LRM's but it only mitigates a bit of damage
-It pretty much mitigates ALL of the damage if you chain fire SSRM2s
-It blocks some of the damage (can't tell how much) if I fire all 4 SSRM2s, but enough get through that I can kill big mechs

So against a Jenner with Streaks, AMS is godlike since they will hit you with maybe 1 or 2 missiles in a 2 SSRM2 salvo. Against a Streak Cat, it forces them to stop chain firing which helps you against the constant rocking. AMS is entirely dependent on how well you can handle streaks. On an Assault class it's pointless since you just kill the thing with streaks, on a medium or light it's actually quite good right now (almost necessary).

[Salient]

nurf the streakapult, its bs. drop range to 150m

[Kaijin]

The best solution to SSRM is L2P.

[Fate 6]

Kaijin, on 26 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

The best solution to SSRM is L2P.

It does have counterplay, but it is still somewhat frustrating. You basically can't play a light mech right now as anything other than a spotter, because if you get within 270m of the enemy team you die instantly to streaks. This is due nearly all the missile slots in mechs using SSRM2s right now.

Streaks don't need a nerf, they need a fix. And part of the "fix" is making it so it's possible to hit lights with weapons other than streaks (aka fix the netcode). The proposed lock-on fixes are also good.

SRMs also need a buff. They spread too much, making their damage to heat/weight ratio hardly worth it compared to streaks. I have 2 SRM6+Artemis on my 4SP which weighs a lot, and it is barely better than SSRM2s.

Edited by Fate 6, 26 November 2012 - 07:47 PM.

[Kaijin]

Fate 6, on 26 November 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

It does have counterplay, but it is still somewhat frustrating. You basically can't play a light mech right now as anything other than a spotter, because if you get within 270m of the enemy team you die instantly to streaks. This is due nearly all the missile slots in mechs using SSRM2s right now.

I'm not experiencing this problem, as a light pilot. I still get up to 3 kills per match when I drive a light. Thing is, I circle hardly at all, and I never circle a mech that's got streaks if I can help it. Mostly I'm spending my time standing behind another mech shooting them in the back with repeated alphas, or I'm doing drive-bys.

Streaks are in a good place right now. At most, I'd like to see each launcher take time to lock - maybe a redesign of the missile lock circle to be segmented into however many launchers a mech is carrying and have them go red as they lock. Fire before you've got a full red circle and you're not firing all the launchers at once.

[SMDMadCow]

The solution to SSRMs is ECM, it just isn't in the game yet.

[shabowie]

SMDMadCow, on 26 November 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:

The solution to SSRMs is ECM, it just isn't in the game yet.

That isn't the solution either, because ECM isn't supposed to be a required piece of equipment in every mech.

[Adeptus Odren]

Carionte, on 26 November 2012 - 06:35 PM, said:

OMG....
I just remember when I played MechCommander 1 and 2. By that time, if I saw a streak build in the field, the first thing I would have forbid my mechwarriors was to close the gap.
Now, all you are saying is "this is OP bububu take it off so I can be a bad player and do pew pew". OMG, it is just one possible build, not even a good one because you can blast it off with almost any other weapon at medium range. Just learn to keep your distance and wait for the netcode fixes.
Whenever I see a streakwhatever I just run like hell into and out of his sight. He follows me: he is dead by any other guy's whatever weapon. He doesn't follow me: I get to live a little longer in my ****** Cicada.

I agree that you have to take a streakapult out at range and not close with it. The problem is your sensors don't show it's a streakapult until it's too late.

[Fate 6]

Kaijin, on 26 November 2012 - 08:03 PM, said:

I'm not experiencing this problem, as a light pilot. I still get up to 3 kills per match when I drive a light. Thing is, I circle hardly at all, and I never circle a mech that's got streaks if I can help it. Mostly I'm spending my time standing behind another mech shooting them in the back with repeated alphas, or I'm doing drive-bys.

Streaks are in a good place right now. At most, I'd like to see each launcher take time to lock - maybe a redesign of the missile lock circle to be segmented into however many launchers a mech is carrying and have them go red as they lock. Fire before you've got a full red circle and you're not firing all the launchers at once.

All I know is that when I run a mech with 4 streaks I can 2 shot Commandos. Jenners are annoying, but they don't stay around for long since I stick with my team and even 2 streaks will kill them fast enough. There just needs to be a cooldown on either the lock-on or a bit longer cooldown on the weapon itself. Streaks are close to where they need to be, they are just dumb in large numbers (more than 3). Mostly it is because of constant cockpit shake (although this can be remedied by using AMS). The smoke is kind of annoying too.

Adeptus Odren, on 26 November 2012 - 08:35 PM, said:

I agree that you have to take a streakapult out at range and not close with it. The problem is your sensors don't show it's a streakapult until it's too late.

It's also more than likely that the streakapult is faster than your mech since they have tons of extra weight for engine upgrades.

Edited by Fate 6, 26 November 2012 - 08:37 PM.

[Asmosis]

I have 7 tonnes of ammo on my streakcat and i do run out if the match lasts a long time or team mates dont deal much damage (but dont die either so i survive long enough to deal dmg). half the ammo per ton, That would limit heavy mech killing ability.

1v1 it takes about 100 rounds for a med, 200 rounds for a heavy or 300 rounds for an assult mech to kill them, provided they dont allow me to keep shooting the same place i.e. keep circling the same way even though they just had an arm blown off. half the ammo would limit it to light mechs + 1 or 2 others, not a bad solution.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

Much better to bump the heat generation up a bit, and increase the cooldown time to half again that of standard SRMs.

[zrap]

Kaijin, on 26 November 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

The best solution to SSRM is L2P.

That helps against a lot of the streakcats out there, as well as coordination and focus fire. but that doesn't make streakcats balanced in any way. we did a little "experiment" last night, we dropped like 15-20 matches as a 4 man premade with 3 streakcats and one AS-D-DC (also 3 streaks...).

besides being pretty lame and kind of a troll-team it was completely ridiculous (sorry for all the non-streakcats we encountered). Even with only trials, afk-farmers and what not on our team (matches we'd usually end up loosing) up against mostly founders and some other premades (some of them probably better players) we managed to win all games but one pretty easy, imo simply because we had tons of streaks (21 SSRM2 in our 4 mechs) most of the games none of us even died, and the only loss was due to us failing by not working together any more (because it usually just isn't even neccesary if half of your team is boating streaks). Conclusion: streaks, especially boated, are OP - nothing new to most I guess, but some ppl are still arguing that they are fine obviously.

reduce ammo/ton, make streaks weigh 2 tons, generate more heat, increase cooldown, reduce shake/blur... are all viable options IMO to balance streaks. IDK which or what combination would be the best.

ECM may be a solution, and it might be best to wait and see how that will work out - but it can even be abused to get close with a bunch of streakcats without even eating any LRM's if you have some ECM-Mechs with you that first cover you, and then counter enemy ECM. But at least that requires some coordination from different mech chassis involved, so it might be enough of a nerf, but i doubt it.

[Suicidal Idiot]

Another viable solution:
Stop allowing mechs to be customized. You run one of the avaliable variants, period.
If PGI doesn't offer a streak cat variant, no streak cats.

Problem solved, and PGI makes more money. And people quite whining about OP everything.
(The last is a joke, since people will always whine about SOMETHING being over powered.)

[Sable Hawk]

After reading the Posting called :Streak-SRMs - OMG NERF THEM! - Nov 23 - Update & now this thread here is my suggestion:

Each SSRM adds a lock on time delay and/or narrows the lock on zone for targeting.

To clarify, a mech with 1 SSRM takes the standard time to lock on to a target. Once a second SSRM is added, the time to lock on is increased by 20% (i.e. Lock on takes 1.2x standard). This is due to the fact that the mech's targeting computer has to run two separate missile locks simultaneously. Now add a third launcher and that increases it by 20% more. So a mech with three SSRM's takes 1.44x as long to obtain a lock on. To really have a StreakCat, one has to have at least four launchers which would increase the lock on time an additional 20%. Which means your entry level StreakCat would have a lock on time of 1.73x the lock on time of a mech with only one SSRM. And that 6 SSRM-2 Cat? For him to obtain a solid lock, necessary to fire would take 2.49x as long as a single SSRM would. This maintains the viability of a mech outfitting itself with one or two, even three SSRM racks, but also adds in a diminishing returns element that renders a full Streak Boat ineffective.

Alternatively, one could narrow the range that one can obtain a solid lock on with each additional SSRM. Looking at this logically, it does make sense. The targeting computer is a finite resource and the more sets of calculations it must do, either it must increase the time necessary to make them or must limit the amount calculated. Thus, while the lock on field for a single SSRM could be the forward 90 degree arc in front of the mech, with 2 SSRM's, that aiming arc decreases to 80 degrees. A third SSRM and the arch decreases to 60 degrees. Add a fourth SSRM and your aiming arc is now only 50 degrees wide or 25 degrees to either side of the reticle. Run a full Streak Cat with six SSRM's and your aiming arc is now only 30 degrees wide, a very narrow field to be sure, but one that a truly talented Streak Cat pilot could maintain. Now running that Streak Cat is not uber-drool but uber-skill.

Either 'fix' offers diminishing returns without affecting the efficiency of the SSRM launcher itself. Thus, the weapon does not get 'nerfed' at all (though lazy players will whine about it) it only forces those who wish to specialize in it to hone their skills and not rely on game mechanics to score their kills.

It doesn't outlaw SSRM boats or even punish those who run them so much as it balances the potent damage a Streak Boat can inflict with the skill needed to inflict it.

[Codejack]

Suicidal *****, on 29 November 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

Another viable solution:
Stop allowing mechs to be customized. You run one of the avaliable variants, period.

I would quit, like, 2 seconds after they did that and never look back.