146 replies to this topic

[ShadowDarter]

the ecconomy of war in MWO, should be a large part of the game, a lot of discussions are on how bad it is. My opinion is that it should be a major part of how everyone takes to battle, another layer of complexity to the game.

In all seriousness, there are to many games out there that offer a free ride or at least a cheap way out. Running a Mech is a very expensive affair and that was commented upon in just about all of the books.

Open for discussion, folks no flaming or trolling lets look at the other side of the discussion.

[Max Liao]

+1

[Blaank]

You would not make any money ever. Even the best players would be running negatives.

[Deadoon]

hey that 10 tons of armor your cent mounts, yeah that is 100k a match.

Oh you got cored? too bad your engine is now dead another mil and a half down the drain.
Wait it was an xl? another 2-3 gone.


Seriously, bad idea and a very quick way for this game to die or turn into trial warfare.

Unless you were to make match rewards be in the 2 million a match range, you would be in the negs constantly for using anything beyond a trial.

Edited by Deadoon, 29 November 2012 - 02:38 AM.

[Max Liao]

He didn't say 'keep everyone broke,' he said to make it another layer of the game.

For example, you only bring out the tricked out Atlas when you're in a MUST WIN situation. While for your daily skirmishes against Periphery trash you pilot your standard tech Centurion. Risk/reward ... choices have good/bad consequences.

[Brilig]

At the games current stage I don't think making mechs more expensive to run would be a good idea. Game is still in testing, and a large portion of the game has not been implemented. Better to let people earn enough cash to run varied builds so more data can be gathered.

[Deadoon]

Max Liao, on 29 November 2012 - 02:38 AM, said:

He didn't say 'keep everyone broke,' he said to make it another layer of the game.

For example, you only bring out the tricked out Atlas when you're in a MUST WIN situation. While for your daily skirmishes against Periphery trash you pilot your standard tech Centurion. Risk/reward ... choices have good/bad consequences.

Actually by removing free repairs, you would kill the entire economy in this game and make it so there is no such thing as a viable build.

Also calling pugs periphery trash is one of many reasons this game may not succeed with this form of elitist playerbase.

[ShadowDarter]

Max Liao, on 29 November 2012 - 02:38 AM, said:

He didn't say 'keep everyone broke,' he said to make it another layer of the game.

For example, you only bring out the tricked out Atlas when you're in a MUST WIN situation. While for your daily skirmishes against Periphery trash you pilot your standard tech Centurion. Risk/reward ... choices have good/bad consequences.

Thanks i was about to post something on this lines but you beat me to it. My main point is that if you take expensive Tech out into battle, expect a high repair bill, FF Armor is expensise same with XL engines and other high level tech. Also on the same hand if you take a standard machine out then you should even on a losing game be able to at least break even with a small profit.

Picking and chosing when and where you fight with your blinged out machine, this would become a part of your thoughts.

"Can i afford to lose this battle, should i use lower grade tech... is this battle worth the costs."

Edit: This would mean a total revamp of the economy and i understand that.

Edited by ShadowDarter, 29 November 2012 - 02:45 AM.

[Cola]

Things need to cost more, damaged weapons and equipment needs to be replaced at cost, Equipment/Armor needs to be salvageable from downed enemies. Engines need to not hold true to that as it would be cost prohibitive.
But we need full ammo and repair costs, at a minimum and a bump to the C-Bills earned or at least other ways to earn them in drop.

[Kobold]

It would quickly turn into "LaserWarrior: Online"

[Noth]

Kobold, on 29 November 2012 - 03:15 AM, said:

It would quickly turn into "LaserWarrior: Online"

Correction: It would quickly turn into a dead game.

[Nostram]

Having to actually replace destroyed equipment would be a nice addition, but only in a Solaris VII setting. High risk/high reward matches would be fun to watch and/or participate in. But in the casual game with casual players I feel it would not be the best idea. As it is there are already instances of people getting wins and still losing cbills. That is not a way to keep players in the game.

[Kaijin]

We've already looked at the other side in closed beta. It was ugly. Everyone not using a trial mech was losing C-Bills, win or lose. The current situation is better than that, but not ideal. This isn't Solaris. It's going to be war eventually - can anyone show me an army anywhere that has to pay to fight rather than being paid?

[Sorho]

As much as you dont like it, the finanacial model of this game relies on bringing in large numbers of casual players, and measures like this will drive away the casuals in droves.

[Murku]

in answer to the possible 'Is it really worth me bringing out my blinged mech?', in pre-battle the only thing you have control over is if you are pugging or grouped.

So, every pug will field trash, every group will field bling. The 8/0 results will become a lot more common. Not really going to make for an interesting and consistant battlefield. We need casuals for this game to survive.

Nice thoughts, but it's IRL economics that will kill or cure MWO, not game ones.

*edit for Kaijin's comment*
Battletech is one of those games that assumes people with access to multi-million cbill machines would risk them (contracts must eventually average out at a 50% chance of losing your machine, with a little less chance of dieing yourself) for less than 1/10th their value.
I don't really believe anyone would do that. Much better to sell the blasted thing and live in luxury for the rest of your days off the proceeds. So, in our reinvention ala MWO playing has to be worth our while. Remuneration bonds, ammo supplimentation, free access to workshops and materials, surely any prospective employer would need to offer such to get us to risk our breadwinning gear?

Edited by Murku, 29 November 2012 - 04:20 AM.

[multiplesanta34]

ShadowDarter, on 29 November 2012 - 02:44 AM, said:

Thanks i was about to post something on this lines but you beat me to it. My main point is that if you take expensive Tech out into battle, expect a high repair bill, FF Armor is expensise same with XL engines and other high level tech. Also on the same hand if you take a standard machine out then you should even on a losing game be able to at least break even with a small profit.

Picking and chosing when and where you fight with your blinged out machine, this would become a part of your thoughts.

"Can i afford to lose this battle, should i use lower grade tech... is this battle worth the costs."

Edit: This would mean a total revamp of the economy and i understand that.

Man, what are you talking about, all the battles are the same. You have a deathmatch, and that's it. No one drop is any more important than the other. Nothing is pre-planned and you don't even know which of the 4 maps you'll be fighting on. When/If PGI ever gets around to adding community warfare then what you say might make sense, but for now you're just roleplaying non-existant features.

[Taizan]

In the current state of the game imo its too early to take off those training wheels. Especially as long as some of your losses in a match are due to the various client issues many are experiencing.

As soon as these issues are worked out and matchmaking is in its final phase, then we can start talking about taking off the training wheels. ProbablysSomewhere in between final matchmaking phase and introduction of CW would be a good point to take this step.

[Ghosth]

Its all about choices having consequences.
Right now I bet 90% of all those running streak cats or LRM boats are not paying for their ammunition.
Streak ammo is priced high on purpose, it should be a limiting factor.

Yes you should be able to use it once and a while, but they should not be on every mech you own.
Using them non stop "should" put you into the red, and keep you there.

Its all about balance and consequences. With the free 75% ammo there are no consequences.

It is more than time to take those training wheels off.

[Asmosis]

right now the costs of repairing and rearming are balanced around *gasp* getting healed to 75% free. Its balanced on an expected R&R bill of 30k-50k which is what most people pay.

"taking off the training wheels" as you put it would require rebalancing the costs of things to fit back into the 30k-50k bracket.

The Devs have stated many times they are reasonably happy with the after match costs right now, which is taking into consideration most missile builds etc sticking with 75% ammo instead of taking 33% more ammo into matches than they do currently.

They also did mention during closed beta they were looking at laser weapons with the intention of balancing the costs of different weapons to be more equal, probably by increasing the base repair cost of those items to bring them into line with ammo based weapons.

I do like how people who start these threads pretend the Devs dont know we get 75% ammo free though, its quite amusing.

Edited by Asmosis, 29 November 2012 - 04:46 AM.

[One Medic Army]

It's one thing to encourage/discourage different types of builds through costs.
It's another to just flat out prevent the majority from using costly tech.