23 replies to this topic

[Elkarlo]

At the Moment a Player gets Damage done x10 C-Bills.

This Means if you do 375 Damage you will get 3,750 C-Bills Extra.

I am thinking that the Agency is a Cheapskinn and we should get MORE
Money for Working and Fighting, at least we are Risking our
Butts out there. ( And repair costs)

With the current Charges on Repair and Rearm we are forced to go out with
nearly fixed Mech's which are cobbled together and more a Patchwork,
or even get a Stock Trial Mech and stay around looking how the Battle went to
get the Fix 100k Money.

I think that the Agency should giv us far more Money for Damaging other Mechs.
And ONLY for Damaging other Mechs not more Money for Kills...


I think ten Times the Money would be good for the hard Work we do.

But if you think otherwise please Vote.


Giving more Money for doing Damage will make it more intresting to
aktual Fight instead of Caping or Hiding.

Let the Poeple in the Damage Dealing Setup which win the Matches for us let know
that we Appreciate it, and not that the KDR is the most important thing in the World
but Damage done, because it works for the Team, not for a single Person.


Edit.:
Horriblegoat brought up a good Point.
About how PGI needs to earn RW Money
I putt in a secound poll for C-Bill Damage Earnings Doubled when on Premium
I think ten Times the Money would be good for the hard Work we do.

Edited by Elkarlo, 29 November 2012 - 09:43 AM.

[An0n3]

It's frustrating to end a round with five assists, no kills, and be middle of the pack for your team where the top-dog is a guy who just stepped in to finish off three guys you'd almost cored and got one more assist.

At the current rewards, I think a single LRM+Artemis munition costs more to replace than it earns you in damage.

[JTAlweezy]

I agree, right now the damage done credits bonus is horrible. I also think that kill shots dont give enough exp or cbills as well. When someone with 0 kills gets more exp than me theres an issue. people should be striving for those kills and having them means you have done that much better. Also, having the damage done bonus increase, helps people who have had their kills stolen by the quick jenners that bounce in like the: Abominable snow monster that grabs you in the skifree game, just when you think your doing good.

[PhigNewtenz]

I think you're on the right track. Individual performance should lead to larger C-bill and XP rewards. The difficulty lies in measuring performance.

Not all damage is equal. People who spray-and-pray damage all over an enemy mech to kill it shouldn't get larger rewards than an experience player who hits only the sections they're aiming for.

I'd be in favor of larger rewards for damage done to some combination of:

• Head
  
• Center Torso
  
• Internals Only
  
• 'Dangerous Parts' (i.e. components containing the bulk of an enemy's weapons)
  
• Possibly legs

An0n3, on 29 November 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

At the current rewards, I think a single LRM+Artemis munition costs more to replace than it earns you in damage.

While I agree that this doesn't seem fair, the decision to bring any piece of equipment/ammo should be based on how much it will help your team win. You are not supposed to be financing your entire build through damage-done credits. To decide if LRM+Artemis builds are worthwhile, you have to consider the victory rewards you earn as well and the other performance rewards.

[LordBraxton]

100x

Its been missing a zero for a long time.

[HorribleGoat]

I think 50x is most reasonable from these choices. Id like to remind you that the game is free to play and when you have not paid a cent what do you expect? Premium timers get a bonus so maybe premium gamers could then get more from damage too? No?

As the OP is a Founder as well Id like to know if he had any thought on damage X money between premium and free players.

(PGI + No money = No Mechwarrior)

[Elkarlo]

@Phignewtenz

I think that Hitzones are already incorperated into the Damage Done Bill at the End Screen.

Even when not it would be a fast Fix for lot of Problem to increase the Earnings in Damage Done.

Like Bot Suicider, Base Rushing, R&R Cost.
x5 of current would be good i think
x10 of current would be better and the optimum as poeple can see.. 342 damage done i get 34,2k Cbills..
so they understand it easy.

Edit.:

@ Horriblegoat

Good point, Maybe the good old Trick would do.
x50 for non Premium players x100 for Premium Players

Edited by Elkarlo, 29 November 2012 - 09:30 AM.

[Serraphin]

Elkarlo, on 29 November 2012 - 08:22 AM, said:

At the Moment a Player gets Damage done x10 C-Bills.

This Means if you do 375 Damage you will get 3,750 C-Bills Extra.

I am thinking that the Agency is a Cheapskinn and we should get MORE
Money for Working and Fighting, at least we are Risking our
Butts out there. ( And repair costs)

With the current Charges on Repair and Rearm we are forced to go out with
nearly fixed Mech's which are cobbled together and more a Patchwork,
or even get a Stock Trial Mech and stay around looking how the Battle went to
get the Fix 100k Money.

I think that the Agency should giv us far more Money for Damaging other Mechs.
And ONLY for Damaging other Mechs not more Money for Kills...


I think ten Times the Money would be good for the hard Work we do.

But if you think otherwise please Vote.


Giving more Money for doing Damage will make it more intresting to
aktual Fight instead of Caping or Hiding.

Let the Poeple in the Damage Dealing Setup which win the Matches for us let know
that we Appreciate it, and not that the KDR is the most important thing in the World
but Damage done, because it works for the Team, not for a single Person.

An0n3, on 29 November 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

It's frustrating to end a round with five assists, no kills, and be middle of the pack for your team where the top-dog is a guy who just stepped in to finish off three guys you'd almost cored and got one more assist.

At the current rewards, I think a single LRM+Artemis munition costs more to replace than it earns you in damage.

And if you loose in an atlas giving lrm + art support you lose c-bills , what a joke.

[Orkhepaj]

0

[Elkarlo]

@ Serraphin
I am playing LRM+ Art Support in a Cat, i seldom get under 400 Damage more properly around 700 would be my average..
x50 would give you 28k more and x100 would give you 62k more money per Game.
So it would reduce the Problem.
Yes your Artemis Build LRM support mech will be still Expensiv but you will get some Refound from fighting well.
So you have a CHANCE of getting the Money out of your Expensiv Build... at the Moment you don't have,

[Deadoon]

This would curb costs of higher efficiency designs greatly, by making it so their ammo pays for itself when they get a shot off that contacts. I'd support a 50x or 100X myself but i think 100X is a lot more viable with higher cost per damage ammo like the Artemis system. I average around 300-400 damage myself due to I tend to jump between targets a lot, as opportunities arise.

[SteelPaladin]

I think the rewards could be tweaked to better incentivize performance, but I don't know that damage is the metric that needs a tweak. Not all damage is created equal. A player getting 600 damage in the match but spreading it all over every mech on the other team because he can't target very well is not contriburing nearly as much as the player only netting 150 but dropping most of the other team because he headshots all the time, every time.

[Deadoon]

SteelPaladin, on 29 November 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

I think the rewards could be tweaked to better incentivize performance, but I don't know that damage is the metric that needs a tweak. Not all damage is created equal. A player getting 600 damage in the match but spreading it all over every mech on the other team because he can't target very well is not contriburing nearly as much as the player only netting 150 but dropping most of the other team because he headshots all the time, every time.

This could easily be alleviated with Higher salvage bonuses for lightly damaged mechs you did the most damage to that contributed to the kill.

[Urza Mechwalker]

An0n3, on 29 November 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

It's frustrating to end a round with five assists, no kills, and be middle of the pack for your team where the top-dog is a guy who just stepped in to finish off three guys you'd almost cored and got one more assist.

At the current rewards, I think a single LRM+Artemis munition costs more to replace than it earns you in damage.

that is exaclty into the point. Ammo tha hits the target should NEVEr cost more to replace than you gain for the damage its done. The money loss should come from shots you missed and repair of your mech.

[Elkarlo]

@ SteelPaladin
Didn't want to go into this Waters about Headhunting etc...

Atm for a Kill Poeple get 2k C-Bill for the Finisher and 2k C-Bill for the Person doing Most Damage to the killed Target.
( Kill and Kill-Assist). Personally i am not so found in Head hunting and i am glad that Kil and Kill-Assist brings the same Money. I would like to keep it so, but maybe a rise to 5k would be fine.

There are Extrem Examples like i had with 1,100 Damage done and gathering 0 Kills but 7 Assists and
the other Player had 7 Kills and 0 Assist and around 400 Damage. ( the last one was shared beneath the other 6 players)


Who did more for the Killing? Korrekt Answer would be: Nobody, he was in the Atlas i am in the LRM boat, i simply pressed Mousebutton and kept the Range and Terrain open at 600 Meters... he had the Working and deserved the 7 Kills. But i made them Possible because i hammered his Victims... So an increased Kill/Assist would be okey but personaly not over 5k... as i said this are different waters and maybe another Poll for that.

[N0MAD]

What about that important guy, the scout that risks everything so his team mates get Batlefield info and lights up the target?
Hes not going to be getting most of the kills yet without him the outcome could be very different. He is not going to get reward for his effort?

[Nonoka]

Great, I already have the K/D Kiddies running between me and my target to get the last shot and pad their precious stats, and now you want to reward them for doing it......

Are you nuts?

All I see above is "I" this and "I should get that." Here is a novel idea, final multiplier is how well the team performed as a whole. I bet this would get people to start actually working together and cut down on a lot of the felonious douchbaggery.

[Elkarlo]

As i said to Paladin, this is different water, but the other rewards are to low too
You get around 500 C-bills for spotting atm. 2,5k would be more appropiate.

But go out and blame the Cheapskins of your Agency that the Base Mission Price is to high compared to the Objektives to Achive.

And thats the Real Problem which Base Rushers and Bot suiciders Provoke. You get 100k flat 200k for winning (Premium on my side) when you fight your *** of and lose closely then you get 120-140k When winning around 220k-250k. With my Change i would get on several losses when fought well around 180-200k on a loose ( when i am not Gaussed at the beginning i usually do 400-500 in a lost game) Compared to 100k flat on loosing it makes a difference.
On a win it would be less rewarding but you would still get around 40-50% extra instead of 10-20% like at the moment.

With the Damage done at x100 alone.

I think with Rewards for Spotting Kill etc increased you should get around 200-230 k in a very well played lost game and around 350k in a very well played win game in premium mode. This would improve gameplay in General and reduce Bots or Base rushers effectivly. But first i am on the Damage Done, as it is WAY to low compared to Ammo costs.

And in a Jenner i do around 240 Damage so it wouild be 20k more too.. i attack only when the enemy team is occopied then then from behind.

Edit.:
@nonoka
that i meant with deep waters about headhunting.

Edited by Elkarlo, 29 November 2012 - 10:32 AM.

[Nonoka]

Elkarlo, on 29 November 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

As i said to Paladin, this is different water, but the other rewards are to low too
You get around 500 C-bills for spotting atm. 2,5k would be more appropiate.

But go out and blame the Cheapskins of your Agency that the Base Mission Price is to high compared to the Objektives to Achive.

And thats the Real Problem which Base Rushers and Bot suiciders Provoke. You get 100k flat 200k for winning (Premium on my side) when you fight your *** of and lose closely then you get 120-140k When winning around 220k-250k. With my Change i would get on several losses when fought well around 180-200k on a loose ( when i am not Gaussed at the beginning i usually do 400-500 in a lost game) Compared to 100k flat on loosing it makes a difference.
On a win it would be less rewarding but you would still get around 40-50% extra instead of 10-20% like at the moment.

With the Damage done at x100 alone.

I think with Rewards for Spotting Kill etc increased you should get around 200-230 k in a very well played lost game and around 350k in a very well played win game in premium mode. This would improve gameplay in General and reduce Bots or Base rushers effectivly. But first i am on the Damage Done, as it is WAY to low compared to Ammo costs.

And in a Jenner i do around 240 Damage so it wouild be 20k more too.. i attack only when the enemy team is occopied then then from behind.

Edit.:
@nonoka
that i meant with deep waters about headhunting.

Well, I feel stupid...

I read your post as I was running back and forth making lunch and I TOTALLY misread it.....

Anyway, more money (IMO) will not work. It will only encourage more of what we already have and it doesn't give anyone the incentive to try to get better.

It SHOULD be painful to lose a match with a fully tricked out Mech. I have a cheap build for the occasional pug match and the rest are for when I run with the guys.

Now, I know it's painful to start the match 2-3 down to to discos, suicides etc. I have an idea for that. Now, this is making a leap of faith that they get the crash to desktop fixed and remove the mech from the match.

If you disconnect from the match for ANY reason prior to death, you get 0, nothing, nada. Same applies for out of bounds. Now, when this happens a multiplier kicks in. At the start, everyone's multiplier is 1.0. At the start of the match, you have one that fails to connect, now everyone's c-bill bonus is 1.2 because we are undermanned. Win or lose, you will still make a bit more. AKF and out of bounders get nothing. The ALT-F4 to save my stat guys get nothing. Everyone who actually participates in the match gets rewarded AND compensated for being undermanned.

This way when you get crushed in a 5 vs 8, it helps a bit more in covering the repair cost.

I apologize for the rambling, been meaning to put this to paper for a while now....

[Deadoon]

Nonoka, on 29 November 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

Well, I feel stupid...

I read your post as I was running back and forth making lunch and I TOTALLY misread it.....

Anyway, more money (IMO) will not work. It will only encourage more of what we already have and it doesn't give anyone the incentive to try to get better.

It SHOULD be painful to lose a match with a fully tricked out Mech. I have a cheap build for the occasional pug match and the rest are for when I run with the guys.

Now, I know it's painful to start the match 2-3 down to to discos, suicides etc. I have an idea for that. Now, this is making a leap of faith that they get the crash to desktop fixed and remove the mech from the match.

If you disconnect from the match for ANY reason prior to death, you get 0, nothing, nada. Same applies for out of bounds. Now, when this happens a multiplier kicks in. At the start, everyone's multiplier is 1.0. At the start of the match, you have one that fails to connect, now everyone's c-bill bonus is 1.2 because we are undermanned. Win or lose, you will still make a bit more. AKF and out of bounders get nothing. The ALT-F4 to save my stat guys get nothing. Everyone who actually participates in the match gets rewarded AND compensated for being undermanned.

This way when you get crushed in a 5 vs 8, it helps a bit more in covering the repair cost.

I apologize for the rambling, been meaning to put this to paper for a while now....

The thing is, by making the multiplier on damage done, it encourages players to even if they cannot kill an opponent, to at least scar them and make it easier for an ally to take them out. By making an artificial separation between high intensity play builds and pug builds, you intrinsically undermine the firepower of your team when you are dropping alone, due to those high intensity builds are not as profitable if you do not win, but the cheaper builds don't have the firepower capability to match up to those high intensity builds, thus making the one who chooses to be less useful to be rewarded more for doing less and the person doing more is punished for helping his team out due to R&R costs. If you scale the earnings to damage dealt and killing shots that are precise and do little collateral, you make the battlefield slightly more profitable for those cheaper builds, while those high intensity build immediately become just as if not more profitable due to you actually doing a difference.

However one thing must be done, remove the free reload and replace it with reload discounts, and make it so you cannot launch without a fully repaired mech. Why? if you give people free ammo when the ammo is paying for itself in damage for your reloads, you are encouraging people to exploit the stem more than they currently are. By making you unable to launch incompletely repaired, you force maintenance costs on mechs and make sure that they are using proper load outs for their capabilities as a mechwarrior and not diminishing your teams capacity to fight.