118 replies to this topic

[Sevaradan]

Taryys, on 30 November 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

I cannot believe that they specifically made the Trials to suck.
They are stock/canon and that is it. They just happen to suck due to the translation to a FPS.
It is also convenient that they happen to be used for trials.

if the trials were intended to perform comparably to real mechs whats the incentive for the average casual to grind for them?

[Taryys]

To modify them to taste?

I never said they were intended to perform comparably. They are classic stock configurations and that is it.
I specifically said they suck...

Sevaradan, on 03 December 2012 - 10:37 AM, said:

if the trials were intended to perform comparably to real mechs whats the incentive for the average casual to grind for them?

[Icebound]

In closed beta we whined about this before they even came out. PGI seems pretty intent on punishing new players until they pay for MC instead of luring them in with fun.

[Kyrie]

It is playable, but far outclassed by a build of same with DHS of course. :-)

Beo Vulf, on 03 December 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

Weird I jsut ran 4 matches in a trial Jenner to test yoour hypothisis, and had no problem averaged 1 over heat a match and I see peole in thier custom mechs over heat more than that. Heat rating on the trial jenner is 0.9 and it is still playable.

In the original post I quoted, you suggested picking a trial mech at 1.1 or higher, something with which I agreed. I was pointing out that in this batch it was not possible to do so.

Within the current batch, the jenner, hunchback, and even the cataphract are sort of "playable". However, when facing a custom build with even just a DHS upgrade, all other things being equal, the results would be... well, sad. :-)

[Jello2142]

Sevaradan, on 03 December 2012 - 10:37 AM, said:

if the trials were intended to perform comparably to real mechs whats the incentive for the average casual to grind for them?

Casuals gotta grind *fixed*

[Beo Vulf]

Kyrie, on 03 December 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

It is playable, but far outclassed by a build of same with DHS of course. :-)



In the original post I quoted, you suggested picking a trial mech at 1.1 or higher, something with which I agreed. I was pointing out that in this batch it was not possible to do so.

Within the current batch, the jenner, hunchback, and even the cataphract are sort of "playable". However, when facing a custom build with even just a DHS upgrade, all other things being equal, the results would be... well, sad. :-)

The current trial mechs do range from .89 to .91 but are still playable. A new player will most likely not like or suvive long in the trial jenner, but the other three are still viable just not optimal. I tried all 4 of the trial mechs in several matches each today Mon. 12/3/2012 and found i could still get at least 2 assists in any of them, with the best being the awesome at 1 kill 3 assists no over heats. So for someone to say they are not playable is not correct. With the high cost of repairs, and the low payouts of the current economy in game players will be going back and forth to trial mechs for the free cbill payouts with no repair or ammo costs.

[Kyrie]

Beo Vulf, on 03 December 2012 - 05:46 PM, said:

The current trial mechs do range from .89 to .91 but are still playable. A new player will most likely not like or suvive long in the trial jenner, but the other three are still viable just not optimal. I tried all 4 of the trial mechs in several matches each today Mon. 12/3/2012 and found i could still get at least 2 assists in any of them, with the best being the awesome at 1 kill 3 assists no over heats. So for someone to say they are not playable is not correct. With the high cost of repairs, and the low payouts of the current economy in game players will be going back and forth to trial mechs for the free cbill payouts with no repair or ammo costs.

I never suggested they were unplayable -- merely quite outside the comfort-zone of 1.1+ heat efficiency. The "new player experience" is, however, quite frustrating.

Even as a veteran player, having bought my way in from September into closed beta, I find the current trial selection particularly distasteful. I think new players encountering these ovens may have even harsher opinions...

[Beo Vulf]

Kyrie, on 03 December 2012 - 07:27 PM, said:

I never suggested they were unplayable -- merely quite outside the comfort-zone of 1.1+ heat efficiency. The "new player experience" is, however, quite frustrating.

Even as a veteran player, having bought my way in from September into closed beta, I find the current trial selection particularly distasteful. I think new players encountering these ovens may have even harsher opinions...

While the current trial mechs are not optimal builds, they can be used efficiently in a match. After reading your post I have been playing nothing but trial mechs.
Jenner is probaby the worst for overheating out of them all and it does not have the worst heat rating.
Hunchback disable two of the medium lasers and it still makes a good support mech averaging 3 assists per match.
Cataphract disabling a couple of medium lasers makes it playable and you can average 3-4 assists per game with 1+ kills a game.
Awesome disable the small laser, and 1 ppc 1-2 kills, and 3-6 assists per game.
I am not the best player neither am I the worst so I stand by my statement that they are useful, and playable if you know what you are doing, and how to do it. Heat management, and weapons management are skills that are learned and they take time to learn. So if someone wants to use a trial mech go ahead and do so, just remember they have heat problems as configured, and you will need to manage which weapons you use, and which you do not.

[Kyrie]

Beo Vulf, on 06 December 2012 - 07:03 PM, said:

While the current trial mechs are not optimal builds, they can be used efficiently in a match. After reading your post I have been playing nothing but trial mechs.
Jenner is probaby the worst for overheating out of them all and it does not have the worst heat rating.
Hunchback disable two of the medium lasers and it still makes a good support mech averaging 3 assists per match.
Cataphract disabling a couple of medium lasers makes it playable and you can average 3-4 assists per game with 1+ kills a game.
Awesome disable the small laser, and 1 ppc 1-2 kills, and 3-6 assists per game.
I am not the best player neither am I the worst so I stand by my statement that they are useful, and playable if you know what you are doing, and how to do it. Heat management, and weapons management are skills that are learned and they take time to learn. So if someone wants to use a trial mech go ahead and do so, just remember they have heat problems as configured, and you will need to manage which weapons you use, and which you do not.

My entire point is that the new player experience forces people into trial mechs. The trial mechs are quite obviously sub-optimal, much more so when considering new players.

[Taryys]

Agreed.

My thread-which-shall-not-be-named (which is in my sig) has solutions for the trial grind.

Please check it out if you have not already!!

Kyrie, on 07 December 2012 - 12:17 PM, said:

My entire point is that the new player experience forces people into trial mechs. The trial mechs are quite obviously sub-optimal, much more so when considering new players.

Edited by Taryys, 07 December 2012 - 12:21 PM.

[JediMastaDJ]

Taryys, on 07 December 2012 - 12:21 PM, said:

Agreed.

My thread-which-shall-not-be-named (which is in my sig) has solutions for the trial grind.

Please check it out if you have not already!!

I guess you won't have long to find out if they read your post and used any of your suggestions.

Economics/New User Phase 0.5
Target Date: December 18th - 95%
Status: Final Stable/Stage Playtesting
Notes: Tuning Changes - Detailed post on December 18th

http://mwomercs.com/...ember-4th-2012/

[Taryys]

I am not expecting a squee worthy event, but I am hoping for some significant improvement.

Dec 18 is a going to be a good day I think.

JediMastaDJ, on 07 December 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

I guess you won't have long to find out if they read your post and used any of your suggestions.

...

[Penance]

The Cool, on 30 November 2012 - 12:11 PM, said:

Man, these trial mechs. They overheat like crazy, and I feel like I can't even fire very much before i get shut down.

I'm not able to do much damage, and I feel like in the trial mechs, I'm just a stand in for NPCs, that I'm nothing more than target practice.

I could purchase my own mech, but from what I hear, and from the stats I've seen, even if I win while taking very little damage, i won't make as much as if I just ran a trial mech and immediately killed myself.

Seriously, this game does not make me want to actually play it.

It'd be better if I had some incentive to actively play...

Y'all's thoughts?

overheat
die in trial mech
get free cbills
join a new match in trial mech
overheat
die
get free cbill
join new match in trial mech....lather rinse repeat

this is pretty much the point with trial mechs in the current state.

[JediMastaDJ]

Taryys, on 07 December 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

I am not expecting a squee worthy event, but I am hoping for some significant improvement.

Dec 18 is a going to be a good day I think.

Taryys, on 07 December 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

I am not expecting a squee worthy event, but I am hoping for some significant improvement.

Dec 18 is a going to be a good day I think.

You're right. Probably not squee worthy as it is only the "0.5" stage of the implementation of whatever new is to come.

The 18th will definitely be a good day. The Stalker comes out! Generally speaking, I'm not an Assault Mech player, but I think this mech will be loads of fun to play with and design builds around. 4 LRM 15s? No problem. 4 SRM 6s? No problem. It will be extremely versatile and I think we'll see fewer Atlas and Awesome missile boats now that this has arrived. I think it will really be helpful once they Phase 3 matchmaking comes in and we see a more balanced tonnage/BV/skill/ranking based matchmaking system.

[Taryys]

Yea I am thinking of playing one too.

[Idealsuspect]

communauty there is worth than trial mech ...

i come back from 1 month away
all my friend ( who arent founders, PUG maybbe like you call them ) have quit this game ... well i hope in future you will be able to pay for this game could survive

Edited by Idealsuspect, 07 December 2012 - 01:01 PM.

[Cannibal713]

Ya get what ya pay for.

[BlackBeltJones]

The Cool, on 30 November 2012 - 12:11 PM, said:

Y'all's thoughts?

Isn't saying Y'all here a violation of the code of conduct?

[Jim Nau]

I think customs ruin the game more than trial mechs.

They're the actual canon mechs and their variants. That's how battlemechs are supposed to be, not Gundam hero-mechs.

I'm almost done with this game already because it has become a contest of how many medium lasers or SRM's you can slap on a mech. Customization is always done so poorly in these games--looks at Chromehounds and MW4. Stick Hounds in the former, PPC/Gauss Alpha Strike Pogo Sticks in the later. People will always just mindlessly do "what's best" or look up some Youtube video on a mech to get some "sick frags". It's impossible to obtain perfect balance and truly make a game where one customizes a mech to suit their abilities, instead of what's the optimum.

TLDR: Give me stocks only mode, please.

Edited by Locke Morgan, 07 December 2012 - 09:49 PM.

[Beo Vulf]

Kyrie, on 07 December 2012 - 12:17 PM, said:

My entire point is that the new player experience forces people into trial mechs. The trial mechs are quite obviously sub-optimal, much more so when considering new players.

But they do teach new players some very important skills that will benefit them as they become better, and more skilled players. Skills that will benefit their clans, corps, or faction.
1. Heat management
2. Shot placement
3. Fire control