128 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Magnumaniac, on 03 December 2012 - 10:13 AM, said:

The clue is in the name of the website you are reading this on... "MERCS"

If someone offered you a contract of employment of say, $200,000 - but you would have to cover all expenses yourself, which came to $250,000... you would take that offer? No, of course you wouldn't.

So in the game, you and I are deemed to be mercenaries who have accepted a contract of employment that provides 75% of all expenses paid for by the retainer of your services. Personally, I would not accept a contract that offered less than 100% of expenses IRL - so we are getting a bad deal here!

I think repair / re-arm costs should be zero across the board, and no c-bills should be awarded for win / loss. Only performance related rewards should exist. So you are AFK / suicide / do zero damage... you gain / lose nothing. Otherwise, you make what you are worth.

Then you would not get hired more often than not. OR you employer would concede to your ammo demands but would not pay for your transport. Which is quite costly as many missions would involve maybe 3 jumps to the target and then three jumps back.

None of us have the reputation of the Dragoons or the Light Horse. You will not get the no strings contracts you so think you will get starting up as a new unit.

[Tex Arcana]

Until this game gets out of Beta: I appreciate that they allow players that are grinding their way up an option in order to save a few creds.
I have tended to use the 75% reload after a loss; and conversely I fully rearm after a win.
It's worked fine so far.
PS. Wtf is a MEK? Is it an acronym for something? Eg. Malicious Environmental Kindersuprise?

[Mercules]

Elkarlo, on 03 December 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

Mercules PLEASE read my Post before you blame my statement.

I explained the Fact that ATM without the free 75% Repair nobody could field a Battlemech without playing every secound Time a Trial Mech. And this would kill MWO.

Simple Math: the Average _REPAIR_ Bill would instantly go up to 150k on a CHEAP Setup.

WITHOUT Ammo Costs.

And about 70% of Mechs are killed in a Match, this Means a WIN with Mechloss would be a win of 40k C-Bills.
In a Cheap Mech + AC Ammo or Missles which would be easily over 100k too... and then you have to play a Trial Mech.
When i have moderate Armor Damage i have to pay 10k Repair bill... this would be 40k without the 75% freebe.
So even in a WIN with moderate Damage with Premium etc etc you don't make enough Money to cover a loose.
Especially when your torso was hit and lets say a component damaged, then you have to pay around 120k extra on Repair.

So Factual Enough that nobody would be able to Field an own Battlemech without the 75%?

Because you underestimate something... poeple would leave MWO very fast with this repaircosts so high...
and the 70% damage ones will stay... so even the good players will be smacked by better players, and they can't farm on lower Players as they have left the Game.. so the good player will leave... then the better and in the end only the Hardcore Freaks will stay battling each other in Trial Mechs to earn money for 8vs8 matches...

at least the Netcode Problem would be solved.

Please explain how I have run a Trial mech once in open beta(accident), have all mechs with ammo demands, repair and rearm every time, and have 5 million in the bank despite outfitting 8 mechs. I bought most of them with MC but I did pay for 2 heavies with C-bills.

[Sevaradan]

mastered out the atlas, jenner, hunchback and cat all non premium as a non founder and bought all my mechs w c-bills while paying for repair/rearm every match, eliminating the free rearm is not cost prohibitive.

[Volume]

The programming of this game is just horrible, but this is actually working as intended.

The economy is broken, so they "broke" something else to make the repair/rearm costs hurt a bit less.

An interesting solution, if not inelegant.

[Coolant]

really.. a cheat? people will call anything a hack or cheat these days...

[Oppi]

Elkarlo, on 03 December 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

Mercules PLEASE read my Post before you blame my statement.

I explained the Fact that ATM without the free 75% Repair nobody could field a Battlemech without playing every secound Time a Trial Mech. And this would kill MWO.

Simple Math: the Average _REPAIR_ Bill would instantly go up to 150k on a CHEAP Setup.

My average repair bill for my destroyed Cataphract is around 40-60k. 70k at the most. Ammo included.

Myth busted !

I don't know what all of you are putting into your mechs, but it's obviously too much expensive stuff if you get r&r bills that high.

It's all a question of resource managment, only no computer is telling you "you're over the limit" but you'll notice it on your bank account.

And yes : Not repairing/rearming and getting 75% free is an exploit. This is meant for people who can't afford to rearm their mechs, so they can keep playing. It is not meant for you to gain more money or to cram more expensive artemis missiles into your mech without thinking about the cost.

Edited by Oppi, 03 December 2012 - 10:48 AM.

[Elkarlo]

Mercules, on 03 December 2012 - 10:29 AM, said:

Please explain how I have run a Trial mech once in open beta(accident), have all mechs with ammo demands, repair and rearm every time, and have 5 million in the bank despite outfitting 8 mechs. I bought most of them with MC but I did pay for 2 heavies with C-bills.

Because in CB we had no repair costs... most of the Time....or you are an uber premade player...
because they have very little repair costs... and we are talking about the PUG which would leave, and then the Premades will thin out etc... even in CBeta a lot of players left because of repair costs, and that were hardcore Fans which payed a lot.
( all my friends left CB because of Repair costs no fun, we had been a group of 12 players, and only i returned till now)

So push for no free repair costs and enjoy the better Ping, because the server will be empty very fast.

@ Oppi with 75% repair free repair cost, your Repairbill would be 280k... as you only pay 25% of the repairbill the 70k, 210k this is PGI paying this are the 75% FREE repair.



For Everyone which is complaining about the Free Repair:
A Repairbill you of 160k is average but you only PAY 40k of this Bill, as the other 120k are Free.
This MEANS 75% FREE Repair. 120k of a 160k Repairbill are FREE.

So you only PAY 1/4 of the Repaircosts ATM. Without the Free Repair your Repaircosts would be 4 times !

A Repairbill of 30K would be 120k without Free Repair
A Repairbill of 60k would be 240k without Free Repair
A Repairbill of 80k would be 320k without Free Repair
A Hightech Repairbill of 150k would be 600k without Free Repair.


Simple Math.

Edited by Elkarlo, 03 December 2012 - 10:56 AM.

[Kiyoshi Amaya]

Tex Arcana, on 03 December 2012 - 10:26 AM, said:

PS. Wtf is a MEK? Is it an acronym for something? Eg. Malicious Environmental Kindersuprise?

No, It means Man-Eating Kangaroo

[Foxwalker]

Magnumaniac, on 03 December 2012 - 10:13 AM, said:

The clue is in the name of the website you are reading this on... "MERCS"

If someone offered you a contract of employment of say, $200,000 - but you would have to cover all expenses yourself, which came to $250,000... you would take that offer? No, of course you wouldn't.

So in the game, you and I are deemed to be mercenaries who have accepted a contract of employment that provides 75% of all expenses paid for by the retainer of your services. Personally, I would not accept a contract that offered less than 100% of expenses IRL - so we are getting a bad deal here!

I think repair / re-arm costs should be zero across the board, and no c-bills should be awarded for win / loss. Only performance related rewards should exist. So you are AFK / suicide / do zero damage... you gain / lose nothing. Otherwise, you make what you are worth.

In real world and just to point out - the comparison is silly, most contactors do not know how to do the math and often loose money on contracts, and go out of business. In game economics are different, they want to make it a challeng but also to have fun. Thank your stars it is not like real life - not much fun in that.

[Agent of Change]

Actually i feel the real glitch here is that you can opt not to repair.

Thought about it a bit and I got no problem with the 75% if you can't choose not to repair.

PGI forcing auto R&R and then you'll have gone a long way to fixing the system, Don't want a high repair bill... stop running a mech you can't pay for with your skills, It's called a progression you improve and you'll no problem at all covering your bills.

Edit: this is not to say there aren't issues but the R&R system is not so broken it needs to be "bypassed" with zombying.

Edited by Agent of Change, 03 December 2012 - 11:18 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Quote

So you only PAY 1/4 of the Repaircosts ATM. Without the Free Repair your Repair costs would be 4 times !
A Repair bill of 30K would be 120k without Free Repair
A Repair bill of 60k would be 240k without Free Repair
A Repair bill of 80k would be 320k without Free Repair
A Hightech Repairbill of 150k would be 600k without Free Repair.
[Simple Math.

You are driving a War machine that costs average 5Mil (with ammo) You get totaled in combat and expect to repair 600,000 C-bills of damage for 150,000 C-bills?

Really?

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 03 December 2012 - 11:46 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

It is definitely "cheap". If you don't click the ammo resupply option, the game gives you 75% ammo for free. If you click the auto ammo resupply option, you pay 100% for 100% ammo and not 25% for your portion. Messed up, huh?

[Kaijin]

icey, on 03 December 2012 - 07:20 AM, said:

I hope they put rearm costs back in soon. Streaks and Artemis LRM are a little too good to be able to shoot 1000+ of them per round and not pay a dime

I don't get this. You can shoot thousands of energy weapon shots and not pay a dime.

[o0Marduk0o]

doublepost

Edited by o0Marduk0o, 03 December 2012 - 12:56 PM.

[Armorpiercer M82]

Sevaradan, on 03 December 2012 - 10:31 AM, said:

mastered out the atlas, jenner, hunchback and cat all non premium as a non founder and bought all my mechs w c-bills while paying for repair/rearm every match, eliminating the free rearm is not cost prohibitive.

and then you wake up...

[Pocket]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 December 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

You are driving a War machine that costs average 5Mil (with ammo) You get totaled in combat and expect to repair 600,000 C-bills of damage for 150,000 C-bills?

Really?

You've got a point. Why the heck are we all running around risking our lives for a 100,000 C-bill payday, when our machines cost six times that to repair?!

I say we strike!

[Corvus Antaka]

the 75% system is no good. much better to simply charge so that a mech with 1440 LRM ammo might cost about 50K to rearm, instead of currently where 400 rounds cost you 100K+ with artemis to fully arm.

[Sevaradan]

no the current prices are fine, they should jsut get rid of the stupid 75% free R/R

[Zanathan]

This has been the same since CB and hasn't changed.

I don't think they'll be changing it until they tweak the economy and items like repairing/rearming.