288 replies to this topic

[Wired]

Wait wait, so this is your new topic of hate? 8 mans which are 4 man teams which can drop together through syncing 100 percent of the time?


You're really stretching it there.

[Broceratops]

p4r4g0n, on 07 December 2012 - 12:26 PM, said:

Haven't come across http://www.runhotord...hp/forum/rules?

and i guarantee not many of these groups are doing this atlas ball strategy

[Kilgore]

It sounds universal to me. There are two problems that were both implemented at the same time and both together are very difficult to get past in terms of how much fun people are willing to sacrifice.

First, ECM has been such an impact that groups trying hard to win are running as many ECM mechs as they can fit in, and it's actually helping.

Second, 8-man group balancing doesn't exist to prevent certain undesirable scenarios such as excessive lights and assaults running ECM, or excessive heavies and assaults that bring too much firepower to the match.

Yeah, I agree. Those reasons, plus the group building overhead, make it less desirable to play games in 8-man groups.

I do think PGI has missed the mark on both ECM and the matchmaking. Personally I would bet that ECM will get some adjustments in the next couple of weeks, and matchmaking won't be touched until the Phase 3 is ready, which actually isn't too far off. I would have to re-read the command chair forum, but I do know it's in there.

[dal10]

I have been playing with a lot of 5 phracts 1 atlas 1 cicada 1 raven teams myself. tis fun.

[Kilgore]

dal10, on 07 December 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

I have been playing with a lot of 5 phracts 1 atlas 1 cicada 1 raven teams myself. tis fun.

Why not Jenners or Hunchbacks? (or Awesomes or Cats or Atlases that aren't the D-DC or Cicadas and Ravens that don't have ECM)

Edited by Kilgore, 07 December 2012 - 12:38 PM.

[dal10]

Bilbo, on 07 December 2012 - 12:15 PM, said:

I'll just let yo go ahead and keep believing that.
As for me, I am absolutely loving 8v8 even with it's flaws.

hey bilbo once I get some time off work (I rarely get home before 10 pm most days, am just sitting in class using my laptop atm.) I will challenge you to a deathmatch. lets see if I need my friends to kick your rear. I will even let you choose the mech class.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Vrekgar, on 06 December 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:

Perhaps things might be different when conquest mode comes out on the 18th, perhaps.

Conquest mode this soon? 0_o. This isn't good.

[dal10]

Kilgore, on 07 December 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

Why not Jenners or Hunchbacks? (or Awesomes or Cats or Atlases that aren't the D-DC or Cicadas and Ravens that don't have ECM)

because my only atlas is a d-dc. and half of house liao is running phracts at the moment. once we get vindicators in this games, we are going to run house liao specific mechs if possible.

[Johnny9s]

I drop in 4 man premades, but only while waiting for our next 8 man to form. Once we have 8 people we reform and only drop 8v8. If PGI would let us drop at uneven numbbers I would be doing that instead. I am more than happy to drop 5-6-7v8 as it presents a real challenge.

I think that a lot of the 4 man premades you are seeing are actually 8's waiting to fill.

[Screech]

Great thread, loved reading it all. Very telling seeing who decided to defend what on the debate.

For those that have decided to put on their "big boy" pants and play 8v8, first thank you. You are helping to test out the future of the game and shape what it might become. I would ask if you might take time to flesh out what you have seen in the matches in terms of mech drops and tactics. Would be a great read.

[Oinkage]

I was one of the people looking forward to 8 v 8. I'm really enjoying the 8v8 challenge. I won't give specifics, but I will say that we win more than we lose so far. We did have to adapt our tactics to deal with ECM and brawler heavy teams. We are learning what works and what doesn't in the current meta. We are having fun so far.

On a given night, I'll spend half of my time in the 8v8 group and the other half grinding out more mech variants and cBills in PUGs. While PUGing, sometimes I solo and other times other people will be with me. A friend of mine and myself have done this the last 3 nights. We spend an hour or so testing out different builds for ECM scouts and how well they work together while we are PUGing. We spend a good portion of the time in the mech lab tweaking down to points of armor. We don't want to waste that time in an 8 v 8. The PUGs are our sandbox to see if something passes the test of not completely sucking. Once we have something we think will work in 8 v 8, we bring it there and try it out. When doing 8 v 8s, our goal is to do as many productive 8v8 drops as possible. We don't want to waste everyone's time with waiting for us in the mech lab.

For us, 8 v 8 is serious business. The PUGs are just for testing and grinding. We will probably always PUG since it is the best format for trying new builds before subjecting our teammates to them. PGI does not offer a simulation mode, so the PUGs will be my guinea pigs. Sorry PUGs. You are the next best thing to target dummies.

[deforce]

Broceratops, on 07 December 2012 - 12:31 PM, said:

and i guarantee not many of these groups are doing this atlas ball strategy

yup, i personally like the 2-2-2-2 drop deck and adds the most flexibility for a variety of strats.

Edited by deforce, 07 December 2012 - 01:05 PM.

[Timelordwho]

random51, on 06 December 2012 - 09:36 PM, said:

I prefer 4-man simply for reduced downtime and more variety. This is a bit of an exaggeration but 8-man feels like 5-10 minutes between matches of who can drop with the most D-DCs while 4-man you can still run/see anything and you don't have to wait for 7 other people to get their thumb out and ready up.

Do your mechlab/pilotlab on your own time, don't waste the time of an 8-man while you tweak percentage points. I get my mech where I want it to be BEFORE I look for a group. Unfortunately I'm one of few people that considerate of other people's time.

The way I run premades, whether 4 or 8 is I announce at the beginning we will play 4-5 games, then take a ~5 min mechlab/bio break. That way people dont tinker between matches, because they know there is a predetermined time to tweak. It's also better for their tweaking because they go off of data from a few drops rather than one possible fluke match.

[Stargazer86]

Screech, on 07 December 2012 - 12:49 PM, said:

Great thread, loved reading it all. Very telling seeing who decided to defend what on the debate.

For those that have decided to put on their "big boy" pants and play 8v8, first thank you. You are helping to test out the future of the game and shape what it might become. I would ask if you might take time to flesh out what you have seen in the matches in terms of mech drops and tactics. Would be a great read.

Ah. Love the people that feel the need to insult others who don't agree with their playstyle. Might as well have just said:

"If you don't play 8v8, you must not be good enough. You're not a super pro-gamer like us. So your opinion is wrong and you should feel bad. Everyone who does play 8v8, yeah, aren't we awesome? This game was made just for us!"

Edited by Stargazer86, 07 December 2012 - 01:12 PM.

[Like a Sir]

Wired, on 07 December 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

Wait wait, so this is your new topic of hate? 8 mans which are 4 man teams which can drop together through syncing 100 percent of the time?


You're really stretching it there.

You forgot to mention, that those sync drops are everywhere.... every game they/we (I pug, when I wait for a spot in an 8 man) lose is clearly the fault of those low lifes, who refuse to put on the big boy pants and only live to farm poor pugs.

[Akulakhan]

I've been running eight mans with both my squad and my friends, but there's a major problem. It's a cheese fest. It's sit back, wait, count how many ECMs you have, etc. It's just not entertaining, and I question people who believe that 8 mans are for "pro" players.

I'll keep doing 8 mans when duty calls, but I have to run a mech I don't particularly like (D-DC), and with the UBER TACTICAL THINKING currently being "all out defense" or "ZERG RUSH W/ECM KEKEKEKE," it's all sort of lame. So I'll run four mans when, you know, I want to have fun.

Basically, anyone thinking that people running four mans or eight mans are better or worse is thinking in a very flawed way. The balance is currently borked, and while I have the skills to excel at both, four mans are just so much more fun, just for the freedom and the suprises. There's no suprises in 8 mans. It's just "count the ECMs and Atlai" and "sport Napoleonic/trench warfare tactics EXCLUSIVELY"

For 8 mans to have a true, competitive (e-sport) future, tonnage limits have to happen. Otherwise, mediums will be non-existent, and it will be lights/Atlas with ECm with the occasional Gausscat/phract thrown in. This is not pro mode.

Edited by Akulakhan, 07 December 2012 - 02:20 PM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Let's please keep this civil and not call names or deliberately belitte each other.

I, personally, drop solo or with 4-man or with 8-man teams. Often, when waiting for 4 additional players, I drop in a 4-man. Sometimes it's hard to justify sitting around in a TeamSpeak channel with 6 users and nobody else seems to be showing up.

I think that users should not be intentionally synching their dual 4-man drops to create 8-man premades in the PUG queue; I see that as a blatent attempt to bypasss the matchmaking system's design and unsportsman-like.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 07 December 2012 - 02:23 PM.

[DaZur]

Can't we all just get along?.... (As DaZur is dragged from his truck and beaten about the face and neck)

PGI's decisions make my head spin sometimes...

They appear seriously dedicated to maintaining a cohesive community and as such are extremely resistant to giving everyone what they really want in regard to drop-options (PUG / Free-for-all / PM)... But they fold like rice paper to 3rd-person and other newbie tools that would / will divide the community just as readily...

Choices is what pleases a diverse community that is to the rafters with people who are here for 103 different reasons

Edited by DaZur, 07 December 2012 - 02:25 PM.

[Kraven Kor]

Belorion, on 07 December 2012 - 10:06 AM, said:

Both the money and the xp come quick enough no matter what you do.

Not when you only have maybe 4 to 8 hours to play per week...

300 matches or so, I have only thus far made enough CBills to buy and Outfit about 6 mechs, and two of those I bought with MC.

[Vassago Rain]

EXcuses.