50 replies to this topic

[SpiralRazor]

http://www.scientifi...tificial-muscle




http://www.theblaze....-sip-of-coffee/





Just the beginning, but it had to start somewhere.


Given moores law and applying the concept to technology in general well...i can see 20 ton powered armors in about 40 years, if not less.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Exoskeletons are already in the works in the United States, DARPA has been working on them for quite a few years, along with gauss and rail weapons, various laser weapons, and probably trying to figure how to get a PPC style weapon to actually work without killing everyone around the weapon as well as the target(seriously, they create massive radiation bursts that will kill anyone in the area of the actual device, big issue to overcome).

Mechs..not so much a big area of research, since they are actually a really horrible platform for weapons and the bipedal humanoid form isn't the best for covering varied terrain, legged vehicles in general are horrible design choices due to the inherent weakness of the legs themselves.

[Torqueware]

Kristov Kerensky, on 17 December 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

Exoskeletons are already in the works in the United States, DARPA has been working on them for quite a few years, along with gauss and rail weapons, various laser weapons, and probably trying to figure how to get a PPC style weapon to actually work without killing everyone around the weapon as well as the target(seriously, they create massive radiation bursts that will kill anyone in the area of the actual device, big issue to overcome).

Mechs..not so much a big area of research, since they are actually a really horrible platform for weapons and the bipedal humanoid form isn't the best for covering varied terrain, legged vehicles in general are horrible design choices due to the inherent weakness of the legs themselves.

We don't need people to carry PPCs, silly. Just put them in orbit and have soldiers on the ground use laser painters.

Also I disagree about mechs being a horrible design choice - they are just more apt in another role than 'walking tank' in reality. We currently use legged robots to clean minefields (they work pretty well, or so I hear).

Why not a walking quadruped? When one leg is lifted, the mech would become a tripod - fairly stable, right? (albeit, walking would be slow)

Edited by Torqueware, 17 December 2012 - 01:02 PM.

[SpiralRazor]

Kristov Kerensky, on 17 December 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

Exoskeletons are already in the works in the United States, DARPA has been working on them for quite a few years, along with gauss and rail weapons, various laser weapons, and probably trying to figure how to get a PPC style weapon to actually work without killing everyone around the weapon as well as the target(seriously, they create massive radiation bursts that will kill anyone in the area of the actual device, big issue to overcome).

Mechs..not so much a big area of research, since they are actually a really horrible platform for weapons and the bipedal humanoid form isn't the best for covering varied terrain, legged vehicles in general are horrible design choices due to the inherent weakness of the legs themselves.

Hmm..I dont know...while i agree that huge lumbering mechs and titans do seem like a bad idea..

Heavy Gear style powered armors make a lot of sense. We are much more familiar with how to maneuver a human shaped body and if the "skate mode" propulsion can ever be figured out I can really see them being deployed as fast cavalry. They were always lightly armed and armored compared to real tanks etc, but the mobility combined with the versatility was why they were developed in the first place. Btw, Heavy gears had rocket assisted jumps of what...100 meters? Im not sure what the fastest skate speeds were, but im guessing it was well over 60mph.

[Torqueware]

SpiralRazor, on 17 December 2012 - 01:02 PM, said:

Hmm..I dont know...while i agree that huge lumbering mechs and titans do seem like a bad idea..

Heavy Gear style powered armors make a lot of sense. We are much more familiar with how to maneuver a human shaped body and if the "skate mode" propulsion can ever be figured out I can really see them being deployed as fast cavalry. They were always lightly armed and armored compared to real tanks etc, but the mobility combined with the versatility was why they were developed in the first place. Btw, Heavy gears had rocket assisted jumps of what...100 meters? Im not sure what the fastest skate speeds were, but im guessing it was well over 60mph.

Helicopters fulfill the role of maneuverable urban weapons platform already. So why not helicopter mechs? Better yet, a helicopter drone weapons platform.

The only advantage of legs is that you can displace your torso. So, unless the mechs become small enough to use cover they won't be worth pursuing, yet.

[CDLord HHGD]

True battlemechs at this stage would be impractical due to the inherent weakness of the legs (though I disagree with the above statement that bi-ped isn't the best for of conveyance minus fly/hover tech).

ANYWAYS, with automation I think a one-person take is feasible.

[Fais]

Once the wheel was invented its been hard to beat it, or some variant of it. Hard to beat flight the rest of the time.

[Moonsavage]

Power - always comes down to them absent fusion generators!!

[Torqueware]

To be clear, I don't think hover is the BEST choice. I think it's the CURRENT best choice.

If we can minimize the footprint of weapons systems / power source, strengthen robotic limbs, and make these changes feasible economically then minimal power armor would be an exciting possibility for shock troops.

I just believe that - at present day - our technology does not allow powered armors to be mobile enough to be practical.

Presently, the only way to power such a weapons platform is with a turbine and generator - hence my comment on why helicopters are more suited for a mobile urban weapons platform.

Tread vehicles (Tanks) don't count (in my book) because they are ALSO artillery, and have movement limitations.

[Corpsecandle]

Torqueware, on 17 December 2012 - 01:05 PM, said:

Helicopters fulfill the role of maneuverable urban weapons platform already. So why not helicopter mechs? Better yet, a helicopter drone weapons platform.

The only advantage of legs is that you can displace your torso. So, unless the mechs become small enough to use cover they won't be worth pursuing, yet.

Superior carrying capacity, endurance, power efficiency...as long as gravity keeps working like it does, there's always going to be a need for ground based vehicles.

[SpiralRazor]

Gears and Striders are powered via very efficient ICE's, apparently from what i just read, based off a design from the university of colorado. They also have wheels for skate mode, or tracks for the heavier ones.

Im also confident that fusion will be cracked in the next 30 years or so as long as they keep looking and getting funding to find it.

[Torqueware]

Corpsecandle, on 17 December 2012 - 01:15 PM, said:

Superior carrying capacity, endurance, power efficiency...as long as gravity keeps working like it does, there's always going to be a need for ground based vehicles.

No, yes, and yes.

Need more weapon/ordinance on site? Just deploy more units!

But otherwise I agree with your statement.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Walkers do have some advantages over wheeled vehicles.

Mostly walkers can navigate un-even terrain better than a wheeled vehicle.

Overall though, I do not think the big machines you see in Battletech will ever be practical. Mostly walking vehicle will be used for transport of troops (or most likely equipment). There is really no need for these big walking tanks when aircraft can fill that role better.

Here is a good example of a walker doing a roll it was meant to...


P.S. I hope it is much quieter in the future. Nothing like letting the enemy know where you are

[Torqueware]

Would walking armor be quieter than a wheeled vehicle? That's an interesting thought.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Kristov Kerensky, on 17 December 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

Exoskeletons are already in the works in the United States, DARPA has been working on them for quite a few years, along with gauss and rail weapons, various laser weapons, and probably trying to figure how to get a PPC style weapon to actually work without killing everyone around the weapon as well as the target(seriously, they create massive radiation bursts that will kill anyone in the area of the actual device, big issue to overcome).

Mechs..not so much a big area of research, since they are actually a really horrible platform for weapons and the bipedal humanoid form isn't the best for covering varied terrain, legged vehicles in general are horrible design choices due to the inherent weakness of the legs themselves.

Don't forget the Tesla lightning gun mounted to the front of Armoured Vehicles.

Sort of dangerous though haha.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Exoskeletons have been looked at by the US Military, and I'm sure others around the globe, for some time now, this is NOT a new idea, after all humans have been wearing armor for quite a few thousand years now in one form or another. They've got working exoskeletons right now at DARPA, have had them for a while now, no big generators needed, no fission/fusion reactors needed, just simple hydraulics which can be powered with rather small power sources that are easy to repair/replace/recharge. They let people jump higher, run faster, carry more and keep going for longer then they would without them. They are also incredibly easy to make totally worthless without firing a single weapon, a bit of steel wire and 2 posts do the trick quick nicely...not a joke. One of the biggest problems with using the bipedal humanoid form as your weapons platform, it's real easy to knock down, balance is always going to be a serious issue(it is in BTech as well, NOT something we see in the MW games, I really wish we did, 90% of the people who drive Lights would kill themselves and never get back in one). DARPA has combat ready versions but you'll notice they aren't being used...why is that? Simple, they aren't useful no matter how great the Cool factor is.

There is a reason tanks look the way they do, and most modern tanks move faster then all but the smallest/fastest Mechs, and with far less tonnage required.

[Buck Cake]

Kristov Kerensky, on 17 December 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

(seriously, they create massive radiation bursts that will kill anyone in the area of the actual device, big issue to overcome).

Why overcome? Sounds like a perfectly viable weapon as it it.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Buck Cake, on 17 December 2012 - 01:49 PM, said:

Why overcome? Sounds like a perfectly viable weapon as it it.

Because that radiation isn't a one time thing and tends to make not just the weapon but the area around it totally unusable for quite a long long time?

[Torqueware]

Kristov Kerensky, on 17 December 2012 - 01:53 PM, said:

Because that radiation isn't a one time thing and tends to make not just the weapon but the area around it totally unusable for quite a long long time?

Actually no. Radiation is a one time thing.

When radioactive decay occurs the change only happens one way - entropy favors the decayed / more stable state.

When radioactive decay occurs alpha particles, beta particles (electrons, sometimes positrons), and gamma rays (electromagnetic rays with great amounts of energy) are expelled - or, radiates, if you prefer - into the surrounding environment. This is a per-particle occurrence, and it only occurs once. This decay is what causes radiation sickness, and the alpha particles decay sometimes further.

So long as radioactive particles do not escape the weapon, the radiation kill-zone is only 'temporary'.

[Tempered]

For some reason, I just can't stop laughing when I see Big Dog flailing on the ice. Yea, I'm a sick puppy.

How well they have managed the balance is really amazing, however. It looks so much like a real creature's movement.

As for being practical, I'm not really sold. How is this better than a tracked vehicle?