74 replies to this topic

[Redmond Spiderhammer]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:45 PM, said:

I think you mean you encourage the worse half to spend some money or leave. If they weren't paying then they are a draw on resources with no benefit. If they were paying then they felt less of a crunch for money. Giving people no incentive to spend money means they won't spend money. Yes you can do that other ways, but saying, "Hey it is going to be a slow grind without premium." seems to be standard and that is what it was.

I think the focus right now has to be to get players and get them excited about the core gameplay. You dont build up a large enough playerbase by gating the game to only the hardcore. Hardcore Options are fine. Hardcore only is a dead game. If players have to pay to do anything without it seeming like a massive grind they wont stick around. Conversely if you keep a reasonable sized playerbase you can monetize convenience softly and vanity more strongly. If the monetization of the game is too overt and pervasive you will lose a chunk of your target audience

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:49 PM, said:

Not getting shot is not always an option. especially when you are up against a couple faster mechs. One of the biggest strength of the centurion was the fact that it could tank so much damage because of it's ability to zombie and also use it's arm as a shield. You were effectively punished for using those strengths.

Not really, because a Win resulted in a good deal more than a Loss. That added to the Cost/Benefit factor. Was it worth getting your mech blown to pieces? If I could hold off these two mechs while my teammate won by capping the base? Yes! Now, Win/Loss Eh... whatever I just shoot you in the face for C-bills.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

Not really, because a Win resulted in a good deal more than a Loss. That added to the Cost/Benefit factor. Was it worth getting your mech blown to pieces? If I could hold off these two mechs while my teammate won by capping the base? Yes! Now, Win/Loss Eh... whatever I just shoot you in the face for C-bills.

With low cost to repair mechs, yes it was worth getting your mech blown to pieces whether you won or lossed. And in that trial mech didn't pay for any repair or rearm, you could get 65k-75k for just running in and blowing up. Now you get maybe 40k. It is not near as profitable to do the suicide grinding at all.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:53 PM, said:

Actually there is far less suicide farming being reported. This has actually discouraged that because you make less now doing that than you did before.

Ehem...

* CTD (Crash to Desktop) fixes

Most "AFK Farmers" were people who's computers CTD'd but were not marked as Disconned. I know this from grouping with people and seeing the vast majority were exactly that. The reports of number of AFK farmers was greatly exaggerated. I ran into ~1~ person in 200+ matches that overheated on purpose.

[Aedensin]

Major Cockburn, on 19 December 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

I'd rather no game with some other company able to license the IP and try again than a fail kiddy game.

Some one is seriously sore, go get some cream and move on already.

Edited by Aedensin, 19 December 2012 - 02:00 PM.

[Major Cockburn]

Aedensin, on 19 December 2012 - 01:59 PM, said:

Some one is seriously sore, go get some cream and move on already.

Oh no I have a dissenting opinion...

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

It is not near as profitable...

You can stop that sentence right there. Nothing is as profitable... except for those that were actually paying to reload their artemis ammo... they are probably seeing an increase in profit.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

Ehem...

* CTD (Crash to Desktop) fixes

Most "AFK Farmers" were people who's computers CTD'd but were not marked as Disconned. I know this from grouping with people and seeing the vast majority were exactly that. The reports of number of AFK farmers was greatly exaggerated. I ran into ~1~ person in 200+ matches that overheated on purpose.

I said suicide farmers, not AFK farmers.

[Major Cockburn]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 02:00 PM, said:

You can stop that sentence right there. Nothing is as profitable... except for those that were actually paying to reload their artemis ammo... they are probably seeing an increase in profit.

Nope run a 6x artemis srm6 cat which I paid to R/R every match and I make less now.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 02:00 PM, said:

You can stop that sentence right there. Nothing is as profitable... except for those that were actually paying to reload their artemis ammo... they are probably seeing an increase in profit.

lessening the desire to suicide farm has to do with current incomes suicide versus actually playing. It's much less profitable now to suicide farm compared to actually play.

Major Cockburn, on 19 December 2012 - 02:00 PM, said:

Oh no I have a dissenting opinion...

A dessenting opinion with no reasoning behind it. And you are obiously interested in "arguing" since youa re still taking part in the subject.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 02:03 PM, said:

lessening the desire to suicide farm has to do with current incomes suicide versus actually playing. It's much less profitable now to suicide farm compared to actually play.

You realize that I can hop into a match in a light mech, race over and zap each enemy once with a laser, get shot to pieces, leave the game, join another and get about 4 of those matches in to 1 good solidly played match? What do I get out of that? 25k x4 and bonus money for any mechs you guys happen to kill. In a good match you are going to make 80-100k so equaling what I could make "suiciding"?

All they did was make it harder to determine who is dumb and who is doing it on purpose.

Now I play to have fun in game and never cared about "grinding C-bills" but at least with R&R people were a ~bit~ less likely to run over a hill alone.

[Noth]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

You realize that I can hop into a match in a light mech, race over and zap each enemy once with a laser, get shot to pieces, leave the game, join another and get about 4 of those matches in to 1 good solidly played match? What do I get out of that? 25k x4 and bonus money for any mechs you guys happen to kill. In a good match you are going to make 80-100k so equaling what I could make "suiciding"?

All they did was make it harder to determine who is dumb and who is doing it on purpose.

Now I play to have fun in game and never cared about "grinding C-bills" but at least with R&R people were a ~bit~ less likely to run over a hill alone.

Funny since what you describe is a best case scenario, and not likely nor guaranteed in any way. I have yet to see a suicide farmer (the few that I see now) get over 50k on a win.

[AlanEsh]

This patch was a big step forward. They're still like 187 steps behind where I think they should be, but this was a good patch.

[Kaijin]

Mercules, on 19 December 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

I think it moved more towards "Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Run at enemy and shoot. Dead. New match. Gee... I'm making money gud naow." Before that behavior would net you a lot of high repair bills. Now it earns you 25k with "bonuses" for those you managed to shoot before you died.

The players who are doing that now are the players who were doing it before but raking in bigger rewards for doing so. Don't think you'll see that in team play.

[Mercules]

Noth, on 19 December 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

Funny since what you describe is a best case scenario, and not likely nor guaranteed in any way. I have yet to see a suicide farmer (the few that I see now) get over 50k on a win.

How many games are they doing while you finish your own? 4? even if they get the 25k for showing up they make 100k to whatever you got from that match.

[Lonewolf777]

GioAvanti, on 19 December 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

How exactly is it "easier"?

I actually think the game is a little harder now that you can use FF and ammo weapons more freely.

For the reason you just stated, using ammo freely. Battletech was was always about considering, is that Gauss rifle shot worth it because of the cost. And charging in guns blazing wasnt a good idea because the repair bill was gonna have to get paid.
I came to accept, grudgingly, that the days of wondering where I was going to find a leg actuator and how much was it gonna cost are over. There just isnt enough of the Old school Battletech guys like me out there that enjoy the logistics aspect of the old game to make a computer version profitable. But at least the buying ammo and the general repair bills were a nice compromise.
This isnt a FPS, its a strategy game. I can tell that still hasnt sunk in. Most of the time im playing with guys that just go charging over the hill with no thought of a plan. And the satisfaction I feel when they die in droves cause the other team knows what strategy is, its a guilty pleasure.

[Malacay]

And the fun of the game is getting sucked out again by premades that are out on pug farming... this game seriously needs to seperate the premades from the pugs... it is just no fun getting primaried and focus fired while the own team fires at whatever...

There is no joy in dropping solo for a few matches when you don't have the time to play or enough friends online to play with...

[GioAvanti]

Lonewolf777, on 19 December 2012 - 02:41 PM, said:

For the reason you just stated, using ammo freely. Battletech was was always about considering, is that Gauss rifle shot worth it because of the cost. And charging in guns blazing wasnt a good idea because the repair bill was gonna have to get paid.
I came to accept, grudgingly, that the days of wondering where I was going to find a leg actuator and how much was it gonna cost are over. There just isnt enough of the Old school Battletech guys like me out there that enjoy the logistics aspect of the old game to make a computer version profitable. But at least the buying ammo and the general repair bills were a nice compromise.
This isnt a FPS, its a strategy game. I can tell that still hasnt sunk in. Most of the time im playing with guys that just go charging over the hill with no thought of a plan. And the satisfaction I feel when they die in droves cause the other team knows what strategy is, its a guilty pleasure.

I'm a long time battletech player and frankly the old system wasn't good. You'd have a point if you could salvage pieces of mechs of the field, but you couldn't.... it was just abnormally punishing.

It's not hard; it's just tedious. Stop acting like making the game tedious is somehow a good thing.


PS- a lot of the guys on here pretend to know what strategy is... vets included. Believe it or not.... 90% of the merc units I've seen have either stylized themselves as elite merc units or have chosen elite units from canon to "be".

Funny how these elite units would be worried about ammo on a single 15 min fight......the ammo should be expensive thing is actually quite stupid in this regard because the unit isn't paying for it or canon wise had the money,

[Universe Man]

The main reason I was against the RnR changes is because I like the idea of the expensive mechs requiring more credits to use. This limited peoples willingness to use these mechs and in turn we'd see fewer of them, leveling the playing field.

You bring a pimped out mech to the field, you get a combat advantage for doing so...but, you chance earning fewer CBills at the end of the match.

That's how I feel. But, if PGI decides to make every mech as easy to use, then so be it. I'm not really against the changes...just don't think they made anything better. I'm ready to buy my first Assault mech, so the patch was perfect timing! Just need to decide which one

P.S. I don't think anyone should go negative in CBill earnings in a match, though.

Edited by Universe Man, 19 December 2012 - 04:00 PM.

[Major Cockburn]

So apparently your not permitted to say that you hope the game fails so some other company can make a mechwarrior game if pgi keeps [REDACTED] mwo up... [REDACTED]

Edited by Stickjock, 19 December 2012 - 04:21 PM.
bypassing language filter