92 replies to this topic

[Kotrin]

Where are Unseens, destructable terrains, maps #5 and #6 and #7 straight to #20, missions, affiliation, mechwarrior avatar, storyline and so on?
Months after public beta, the games seems mostly idle.

As someone said elsewhere, MWO fails to impress, fails to deliver.

Incidentally, I've played both games mentioned by OP - I probably learned their existence because of these very forums.

Planetside 2 is... Neat, no doubt, and complex, F2P, impressive, enjoyable. You can play Tanks and Flyers! But I'm just not into FPS games, and was fed up of getting shot twice a minute when I tried it. It's hard to start in the game if you're not already accustomed to Counterstrike and the like. In PS2, teamplay is everything. And by team play, I mean 200 players each side, nothing to do with MWO teams here.

Hawken is a more serious competitor. Even if I dislike the style of local 'Mech, I was surprised to discover an indie game developped in 9 months and featuring four game modes, many maps, music, tutorial mission and even remote servers in UK or Asia to solve ping issues!
And the game is not only F2P, but darn cheap too. $5 for -any- 'Mech and that's about it. All items except vanity ones can be purchased by in-game currency. That's very different from MWO where you are sucked into $$$ spending for any Hero 'Mech and even Mech bays. But I'm sure PGI is closely looking at Hawken - that's probably the reason they changed their mind and (as Hawken) they finally credited trial 'Mech with actual XP.

And there is more competition to come....

I don't know what MWO will be in a year from now, but I'm sure of one thing:
time is running out.

[CypherHalo]

Well, I think we all have different opinions. Personally, I tried Planetside 2 and was not impressed. Too confusing, no tutorial, just a bunch of running around and dying. I quit and uninstalled. That game needs a tutorial and some way to introduce new players because the idea behind it is fun but, just not for me. I have way more then enough games to keep me occupied, I just didn't feel like sinking in tons of time to become competent at PS2.

Hawken, on the other hand has surprised me. I'm not a huge fan of the multiplayer in COD or Halo and so I thought that I would not like Hawken. It is however, a ton of fun IMO. You're not as fragile as you are in a game like COD and there is not a huge emphasis on killstreaks so overall I'm enjoying the game. I like leveling up my mechs, buying them parts, trying out the different weapons. The matches are fast-paced and enjoyable and I usually find that team play happens organically. Are there issues with the game? Yeah, skill is far more important in that game and the matchmaker is not always good about matching up players of similar skill level, so sometimes your team gets stomped b/c there are a bunch of Hawken masters on the other side.

MWO, I want to like, desperately. It is the only reason I haven't uninstalled the game. At this point, I'm waiting for respawns and/or dropship mutator to see if I can get back into the game. This game also desperately needs a tutorial. The beginning grind was harsh, but they finally fixed that with the cadet bonus. Anyway, I've been an MW fan since MW2 but this game is just too boring for me. I spawn, I fight, I die, I quit the match. I'm sorry but I wish this game had some way to get me back into the fight, simply too boring as it stands. Just about everything else I enjoy about the game. The control scheme is the best of all the MW games. The graphics and mech designs are fantastic (better then Hawken in the design dept for sure). I love the different effects, like how lasers are now a beam and can "stitch" across enemy armor. I like the slower pace of the game and the tactics involved with blowing off a person's arm, etc. Ultimately, I just find the game boring. The 1-life mechanic means that the first team to kill 2-3 opponents will probably win, so I find few matches are competitive and there's only so many times I can get stomped before I stop having fun. With Hawken, if I'm getting stomped I can always switch servers, say from US East to US West or switch game modes. Here, I could switch to Conquest and for months I couldn't even do that. For that matter, Conquest is just not a different enough game mode and it still leaves MWO with 2, very similar game modes, to Hawken's 4 distinct game modes. So, I haven't given up hope on this one but I'm just not too impressed.

Final note, since the OP is comparing this to other F2P titles. They need to learn from League of Legends, and to a lesser degree Hawken. Prices in this game are insane! No mech costs more then $5 in Hawken. $10 should be the max here, which is similar to the pricing of a champ in League of Legends. Also, neither Hawken or LoL have cash grabs like mech bays, which just upset me on principle. Plus, League of Legends is great because it has options for casual players (beginner bot matches) and options for the more "hardcore" crowd (ranked matches). MWO would be very well served by doing this immediately. Some kind of Solaris arena and respawn options for "casual" players and 1-life modes and Community Warfare for "hardcore" players. IMO, they should have focused on getting the casuals first (as they're harder to keep), but it's not my business to run.

Edited by CypherHalo, 14 January 2013 - 05:52 AM.

[Henree]

Tykelau, on 14 January 2013 - 05:46 AM, said:

The amount of agreement I have for this well thought out and carefully worded post is massive, even though I will not be leaving MWO myself. Yet.

I am not biased and deluded enough to;
A)have an emotional reaction to this posters opinion, demonstrating my bias and immaturity.

B)not see the many significant problems in MWO

It's surprising how much vitriol this forum has. Do you all not realize that behaving this way makes the game LESS likely to be successful?

we should behave like everything is rosey and peachey and everything will be fine?

[Mechteric]

Once matchmaking is more fair and you no longer have to lag shoot fast mechs then the gamplay will be more acceptable to many more people I think.

While I do enjoy the occasional planetside 2 session, its respawn mechanics just end up making the game a big zergfest. Hawken is basically Quake 3 so I can't stand more than about 30 minutes of that. What MWO has in its no-respawn gameplay is uncontested, its just gotta shake off some of the buggy bits which with any luck won't be too far away.

[LynxFury]

CapperDeluxe, on 14 January 2013 - 07:39 AM, said:

Once matchmaking is more fair and you no longer have to lag shoot fast mechs then the gamplay will be more acceptable to many more people I think.

That will help. But its narrow vision is also crippling compared to modern games. Seriously, I'd at least hoped that we'd have a few tanks, aerotech, with larger maps and some way to emulate a repair or respawn taking cues from battletech.

I'd love to pilot a hellcat and to get a DC order to take out the pair of bulldog tanks flanking our mech company; searching for a good approach vector, and than descending large lasers blasting as a riflemen chips away at my armor. Or missions to protect a convoy crossing the map, or someone driving a mobile field base to rearm and slather on a few tons of armor even as a hunter killer team searches to destoy me, or to secure a dropship for 30 seconds while teammates pill out with their replacement mech to rejoin the battle.

Someone above said it's a niche market...that's true, but I'd say that market is only niche because of its intent to limit itself to content models and maps from ten years ago. To draw new blood it should have been a bit bigger with more players and broader variety of vehicles. Only a small fraction of PS2 players are aware of that universe's set of books or its foundation in planetside 1 (I didn't)--but its breaking away from being a niche market with combined arms, larger maps, and more players that adds tons of fun and increased tactical variety which draws players who've never heard of planetside. MWO is self limiting by design.

Edited by LynxFury, 14 January 2013 - 10:44 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

LynxFury, on 14 January 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

That will help. But its narrow vision is also crippling compared to modern games. Seriously, I'd at least hoped that we'd have a few tanks, aerotech, with larger maps and some way to emulate a repair or respawn taking cues from battletech.

I'd love to pilot a hellcat and to get a DC order to take out the pair of bulldog tanks flanking our mech company; searching for a good approach vector, and than descending large lasers blasting as a riflemen chips away at my armor. Or missions to protect a convoy crossing the map, or someone driving a mobile field base to rearm and slather on a few tons of armor even as a hunter killer team searches to destoy me, or to secure a dropship for 30 seconds while teammates pill out with their replacement mech to rejoin the battle.

Someone above said it's a niche market...that's true, but I'd say that market is only niche because of its intent to limit itself to content models and maps from ten years ago. To draw new blood it should have been a bit bigger with more players and broader variety of vehicles. Only a small fraction of PS2 players are aware of that universe's set of books or its foundation in planetside 1 (I didn't)--but its breaking away from being a niche market with combined arms, larger maps, and more players that adds tons of fun and increased tactical variety which draws players who've never heard of planetside. MWO is self limiting by design.

Living legends already died because it didn't focus on the mech part of mechwarrior.

[LynxFury]

Vassago Rain, on 14 January 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

Living legends already died because it didn't focus on the mech part of mechwarrior.

I doubt that. Most likely, like most mods, complete lack of commercial marketing and awkward installation built on a dated engine, challenged it more than anything else.

And I think we should stay away from false dichotomies as well. For example, at its heart PS2 and BF3 are infantry games with a bit of other stuff to dramatically increase it's overall play. MWO, with a couple tanks, an aerotech fighter or two, or even a support vehicle and commander's seat, would still be focused on mechs, but be MUCH more interesting, dynamic and battletech flavored. Battletech lore has tidbits of combined arms all throughout, from the aerotech pilot that nearly kills Phelen Kell, to the infantry of the GDL, to famous arty strikes from MW2, and armor in every other MW game to date, the elemental combat with Lincoln Osis and on and on.

Most importantly, there's an expectation set by modern games to include at least a bit of combined arms feeling.

Edited by LynxFury, 14 January 2013 - 12:45 PM.

[CypherHalo]

LynxFury, on 14 January 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

That will help. But its narrow vision is also crippling compared to modern games. Seriously, I'd at least hoped that we'd have a few tanks, aerotech, with larger maps and some way to emulate a repair or respawn taking cues from battletech.

I'd love to pilot a hellcat and to get a DC order to take out the pair of bulldog tanks flanking our mech company; searching for a good approach vector, and than descending large lasers blasting as a riflemen chips away at my armor. Or missions to protect a convoy crossing the map, or someone driving a mobile field base to rearm and slather on a few tons of armor even as a hunter killer team searches to destoy me, or to secure a dropship for 30 seconds while teammates pill out with their replacement mech to rejoin the battle.

Someone above said it's a niche market...that's true, but I'd say that market is only niche because of its intent to limit itself to content models and maps from ten years ago. To draw new blood it should have been a bit bigger with more players and broader variety of vehicles. Only a small fraction of PS2 players are aware of that universe's set of books or its foundation in planetside 1 (I didn't)--but its breaking away from being a niche market with combined arms, larger maps, and more players that adds tons of fun and increased tactical variety which draws players who've never heard of planetside. MWO is self limiting by design.

Eh, I don't mind the lack of combined arms. Personally, I don't think this game makes the mech combat very fun, they need to work on that first, that's my two cents, feel free to disagree.

[Pok Gai]

LynxFury, on 14 January 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

I doubt that. Most likely, like most mods, complete lack of commercial marketing and awkward installation built on a dated engine, challenged it more than anything else.

And I think we should stay away from false dichotomies as well. For example, at its heart PS2 and BF3 are infantry games with a bit of other stuff to dramatically increase it's overall play. MWO, with a couple tanks, an aerotech fighter or two, or even a support vehicle and commander's seat, would still be focused on mechs, but be MUCH more interesting, dynamic and battletech flavored. Battletech lore has tidbits of combined arms all throughout, from the aerotech pilot that nearly kills Phelen Kell, to the infantry of the GDL, to famous arty strikes from MW2, and armor in every other MW game to date, the elemental combat with Lincoln Osis and on and on.

Most importantly, there's an expectation set by modern games to include at least a bit of combined arms feeling.

CypherHalo, on 14 January 2013 - 04:36 PM, said:

Eh, I don't mind the lack of combined arms. Personally, I don't think this game makes the mech combat very fun, they need to work on that first, that's my two cents, feel free to disagree.

Most importantly, there's an expectation set by modern games to include a bit of combined arms feeling.
^^
Indeed, the bar has been set higher, just mechs makes it a MW4 MP with updated graphics.. As it is now it does get stale relatively fast. But adding combined arms would be beyond the technical capabilities of PGI so too bad .

[Solis Obscuri]

Abrahms, I thought you left four months ago...

[Deathz Jester]

I had thought back in August that by now the game would be spectacular. Its failing to meet expectations.

[Solis Obscuri]

Iron Harlequin, on 14 January 2013 - 05:10 PM, said:

I had thought back in August that by now the game would be spectacular. Its failing to meet expectations.

...



*sigh*

[Pok Gai]

Iron Harlequin, on 14 January 2013 - 05:10 PM, said:

I had thought back in August that by now the game would be spectacular. Its failing to meet expectations.

Alot of the founders are disillusioned and disappointed, if they fail to hook new players, this game will flop this year and fade away the next imo.