Why Bother? Lights Dominate Completely!
#21
Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:12 AM
#22
Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:35 AM
Listing a Commando as the easy button is just priceless, as next to the spider (also listed), it's pretty easy to take apart in any heavy or assault I own.
Mr 144
#23
Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:49 AM
Mr 144, on 21 January 2013 - 12:35 AM, said:
Listing a Commando as the easy button is just priceless, as next to the spider (also listed), it's pretty easy to take apart in any heavy or assault I own.
Mr 144
"I'm good at X, so that means Y is not good."
You've missed the point completely. A skilled pilot in a ECM light will beat a skilled pilot in an assault. There's just no comparing the two. You can set up all sorts of scenarios of "Well he'd come this way and I'd leg him" but you're automatically assuming the light pilot is stupid enough to engage on your terms. On equal footing and taking "luck" out of the equation, the light always wins.
#24
Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:50 AM
I have no issues whatsoever in killing them, in heavy or assault (my 2 main classes).
They are the easiest mechs to kill, by far, unless they run away... hiding and trying to ninja cap the base. The only difficulty is when they teleport due to the lag, which not only wastes your ammo but also heats up your mech.
ECM lights are the most powerful ones, but not a problem for players who know how to counter them. I usually enjoy taking my LRM boat against heavy ECM team because they think they're invincible. Then I tag them and BAM, easy kill.
Of course it takes good knowledge of the map and you have to position yourself well, always with heat vision on, trying to predict enemy's movement by looking around.
I think the ECM is quite powerful because very few people know how to counter it. Mainly 2 things : you either set up your own ECM in counter mode, or you tag the guy you want to shoot.
I lost the count I had 2+ ECM lights in my team who didn't know how to do any of the 2 things mentioned above. Of course, it makes it much more difficult to win when they don't know what to do.
And btw, lights are DEFINITELY doing less damage than AS-7s or STKs. With assault class I usually do between 600 and 1.000 damage (with assault LRM boat even more sometimes).
Edited by SixPrime, 21 January 2013 - 12:52 AM.
#25
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:04 AM
SinnerX, on 21 January 2013 - 12:49 AM, said:
You've missed the point completely. A skilled pilot in a ECM light will beat a skilled pilot in an assault. There's just no comparing the two. You can set up all sorts of scenarios of "Well he'd come this way and I'd leg him" but you're automatically assuming the light pilot is stupid enough to engage on your terms. On equal footing and taking "luck" out of the equation, the light always wins.
And I completely disagree with that. On equall footing, an assault will beat a light....any light. Sure, you may run an assault build not set-up for it, but that's a build choice and not an inherent weekness to the chassis or weight class. I'm not talking skill here, just simple tactics...
Back to a wall.
Lead your Target
Chain fire Beam weapons.
Time ballistics (my preferred light-killer)
SRM at the feet (or even the ground)
create fire corridors using terrain.
patience...3xSSRM2s will not insta-kill you..you have time to position yourself for a proper defense. Take away the lights advantage and they are easily defeatable. This isn't skill...this is knowledge.
The heavies and assault lights chew up do not take the necessary precautions when forced too. When you let any enemy dictate the terms of engaement you have already lost. I see it all the time..heavies try to fight lights like they would another heavy by circle fighting in the wide open, then QQ when the light doesn't act like one.
Mr 144
#26
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:11 AM
Mr 144, on 21 January 2013 - 01:04 AM, said:
And I completely disagree with that. On equall footing, an assault will beat a light....any light. Sure, you may run an assault build not set-up for it, but that's a build choice and not an inherent weekness to the chassis or weight class. I'm not talking skill here, just simple tactics...
Back to a wall.
Lead your Target
Chain fire Beam weapons.
Time ballistics (my preferred light-killer)
SRM at the feet (or even the ground)
create fire corridors using terrain.
patience...3xSSRM2s will not insta-kill you..you have time to position yourself for a proper defense. Take away the lights advantage and they are easily defeatable. This isn't skill...this is knowledge.
The heavies and assault lights chew up do not take the necessary precautions when forced too. When you let any enemy dictate the terms of engaement you have already lost. I see it all the time..heavies try to fight lights like they would another heavy by circle fighting in the wide open, then QQ when the light doesn't act like one.
Mr 144
Adding to this and it's anecdotal but I have killed back to back three Jenners (remember them? they have more firepower than Ravens and are even more mobile) using nothing but 2x large lasers mounted on the arms of an Atlas.
Stay calm and land your shots - you have so much armor that you can weather them for a long time.
#27
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:14 AM
SixPrime, on 21 January 2013 - 12:50 AM, said:
I have no issues whatsoever in killing them, in heavy or assault (my 2 main classes).
They are the easiest mechs to kill, by far, unless they run away... hiding and trying to ninja cap the base. The only difficulty is when they teleport due to the lag, which not only wastes your ammo but also heats up your mech.
Setup Tag to always fire. Use that to see where the hitbox of the lights really are. Understand from that how broken lights are.
Add ECM to said lights so they are even harder to hit and immune to the only weapon that can take them down with ease.
No problems. Right.
Its garbage and makes the game unfun.
#28
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:20 AM
#29
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:22 AM
Ilwrath, on 21 January 2013 - 01:14 AM, said:
Setup Tag to always fire. Use that to see where the hitbox of the lights really are. Understand from that how broken lights are.
Add ECM to said lights so they are even harder to hit and immune to the only weapon that can take them down with ease.
No problems. Right.
Well, these are your issues, I don't have them
Pr8Dator, on 21 January 2013 - 01:20 AM, said:
Last time I got circled by 3 light mechs (2 were ECM) in my Gausscat, I killed the 3 of them. I was alone.
Edited by SixPrime, 21 January 2013 - 01:25 AM.
#30
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:27 AM
an ac20 hit anywhere on a commando blew it out of the water. LEG->torso->CT or arm->torso->CT. there just wasnt enough internal structure on the mech.
the fact that they can last multiple volleys is terrible.
I would reccommend to NOT allow armour to be doubled on light mechs. And furthermore, to scale the armour as follows:
20T armour multiplier: 1.00
25T: 1.05
30T: 1.10
35T: 1.15
40T: 1.25
45T: 1.35
50T: 1.45
55T: 1.55
60T: 1.75
65T: 1.85
70T: 1.95
75T: 2.00
80-100T: 2.00
that way mech armour scales. and light mechs have to now worry about not being able to take hits.
I think i will post this in suggestions.
#31
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:29 AM
Pr8Dator, on 21 January 2013 - 01:20 AM, said:
Two Ravens are enough to kill pretty much anything without streaks. I just had a game where a single raven ran straight toward me in open terrain on caustic, I put two dual gauss alphas right in its center torso (if not cockpit) before it got to me and neither did any damage. Nor did the next two alphas, it took five double gauss shots before a hit finally registered. Until the net code is fixed, lights are a major issue.
The four man Raven premades are also getting really really tiring.
#32
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:32 AM
Test Monkey 13, on 21 January 2013 - 01:27 AM, said:
an ac20 hit anywhere on a commando blew it out of the water. LEG->torso->CT or arm->torso->CT. there just wasnt enough internal structure on the mech.
the fact that they can last multiple volleys is terrible.
I would reccommend to NOT allow armour to be doubled on light mechs. And furthermore, to scale the armour as follows:
20T armour multiplier: 1.00
25T: 1.05
30T: 1.10
35T: 1.15
40T: 1.25
45T: 1.35
50T: 1.45
55T: 1.55
60T: 1.75
65T: 1.85
70T: 1.95
75T: 2.00
80-100T: 2.00
that way mech armour scales. and light mechs have to now worry about not being able to take hits.
I think i will post this in suggestions.
Seems like it would be a snazy idea to try.
#33
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:36 AM
Test Monkey 13, on 21 January 2013 - 01:27 AM, said:
an ac20 hit anywhere on a commando blew it out of the water. LEG->torso->CT or arm->torso->CT. there just wasnt enough internal structure on the mech.
the fact that they can last multiple volleys is terrible.
I would reccommend to NOT allow armour to be doubled on light mechs. And furthermore, to scale the armour as follows:
20T armour multiplier: 1.00
25T: 1.05
30T: 1.10
35T: 1.15
40T: 1.25
45T: 1.35
50T: 1.45
55T: 1.55
60T: 1.75
65T: 1.85
70T: 1.95
75T: 2.00
80-100T: 2.00
that way mech armour scales. and light mechs have to now worry about not being able to take hits.
I think i will post this in suggestions.
Interesting, but I think we should wait until the netcode is fixed, then see how lights fare.
#34
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:37 AM
bonuses so when they meet someone who actually fires back they lack the skills to
compensate.
#35
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:38 AM
Ilwrath, on 21 January 2013 - 01:14 AM, said:
Setup Tag to always fire. Use that to see where the hitbox of the lights really are. Understand from that how broken lights are.
Add ECM to said lights so they are even harder to hit and immune to the only weapon that can take them down with ease.
Could you give a hint at how to do this?
#36
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:40 AM
Heiggwinie Halberstadt, on 21 January 2013 - 01:38 AM, said:
Could you give a hint at how to do this?
There are a few options, first you can set the tag to a weapon group, then hold that weapon groups fire key down for the duration of the match (I do this with my right mouse button) or you could assign it to a keyboard key and use a coin or rock to hold the button down.
Alternatively there are Macro keyboards like the G15 keyboard that allow you to push one key to hold a particular button down until you push another key
#37
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:41 AM
Edited by Remarius, 21 January 2013 - 01:42 AM.
#38
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:44 AM
#39
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:45 AM
#40
Posted 21 January 2013 - 01:45 AM
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