13 replies to this topic

[Najek Yuma]

So I'm going to pick up an STK-5S to finish grinding my basic efficiencies on Stalkers. I've currently got a brawler 3F (5xML, 4xSRM6), and a mixed purpose 5M (4xLL, Tag, 5xSSRM2) that I really enjoy piloting. I've always played brawler or close-range support type builds, so I'd like to try something of an LRM boat.

Here's what I'm thinking: A 5xML, Tag, 4xALRM15 build with the stock XL255.

(I can't get Smurfy's mechlab to work on this PC, or I would have linked there.

Thoughts? I know from experience that the Stalkers' side torsos tend to go quickly, but I can't find a build I like using a standard engine. The XL allows some serious LRM firepower while still packing some backup weapons and an AMS. I'd have to drop down to 39kph to fit a standard engine, and that's a little slow even for an LRM boat. Hopefully I'll be able to stay in support and out of the main brawl and the XL won't be too much of a liability.

Heat efficiency is a little low for my taste, but I figure I'll probably rarely shoot the MLs or the LRMS together, so it shouldn't be too bad.

Is 6xLRM ammo enough? I believe LRM ammo is 180 per ton, so that would be enough for ~18 full salvos of LRMs. How many salvos does an LRM boat go through in a match.

[Devil Fox]

As an LRM boat you want to be... 10-12 tonnes is best. I run 2 LRM15's and 2 LRM10's with 5 tonnes of LRM ammo, but then I run significant backup of 2 LL and 4 ML for long range sniping with the LRM rain and brawling capacity to finish off foolish or damaged foes.

Best bet is drop a medium laser or 2 for more ammo, that or you shave off the AMS... already looks like you're stripped your legs so there really isn't much room for getting the ammo you need. Oh I noticed Artemis, could be something else to remove to increase ammo capacity, it depends if you feel you need the extra clustering as 60missiles will still strip people pretty fast regardless.

[Goose]

Too many lasers and HSs, I'm afraid. Needs ammo.

I'd at lest move the TAG into the torso; Maybe shift some armor rearward, for the ankle-biters.

But 15-racks and the 255XL are a good way to do things.

[Ascendent]

For an LRM boat you may want to consider a 3H. It has 20 missile tubes in each arm and 6 in each torso. 2xLRM20 and 2xLRM5 will give you a single volley of 50 missiles at once to penetrate enemy AMS (if you open the missile bay flaps to avoid fire delay). With a 5S (15 missile tubes in arms and 6 in side torsos) you will fire 42 missiles followed by 8. This has less impact on an AMS mech and will increase the lrm10 cool down time. You could achieve comparable impact on an AMS mech with 2xLRM20s on a 3H (40 missiles per volley) and take 2xSRM6s for backup (ignoring difference in missile spread). It is worth considering though that the 5S has dual AMS (if that is important to you). In addition LRM15 cycle time is shorter than LRM20, with a tighter spread. I wont comment on the 5S hardpoints as you already have a 3F with identical hardpoints and better torso twist. These are just some things you may want to consider depending on your play style. As for the build you posted, as others have said, I would increase ammo to at least 7 tons, keep tag in torso (incase you loose an arm), and you can't use a C.A.S.E. in the arm (its for side torso only to the best of my knowledge).

[Najek Yuma]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'll definitely be moving the Tag to the center torso and adding more ammo. I feel like I should keep a reasonable laser backup -- when I spectate LRM boats they always seem to either be out of ammo, getting circle-strafed by lights, or the last mech alive and forced to brawl.

Didn't realize I can't use a CASE in the arm. Would CASE prevent an ammo explosion in a side torso from getting to an XL engine? Or is it just better to run ammo in an arm, or ixnay the XL altogether?

I did look at the 3H, and while the extra missile tubes seem nice it's down 2 energy hardpoints (ie no torso energy whatsoever) and an AMS hardpoint from the 5S, with seemingly the only benefit being the greater number of arm tubes. I'll probably be keeping this mech after I grind the XP -- simply because selling back assaults seems like wasted money -- so the added flexibility of the 5S is nice if I want to reconfigure it.

Ran into a snag last night though. Saved up ~8.5 million CB, bought some MC to add a mechbay, and then realized that the 5S is 10+ million CB. Didn't realize how much the XL engine added onto the cost, and I couldn't check prices because I didn't have any open mechbays to "create a new mech." Stupid UI design. Oh well, back to the grind for a bit to save up some more c-bills.

[Regrets]

If you lose the torso you die, so no..

[Indoorsman]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4a243ee763c1858

or with a standard engine:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0a84ef7f2e88ff7

Edited by Indoorsman, 23 January 2013 - 11:26 AM.

[Stingz]

Regrets, on 23 January 2013 - 08:59 AM, said:

If you lose the torso you die, so no..

Inner Sphere XL engines die from side-torso due to 3 engine crits jutting into it.(Takes 3 engine crits to kill)
(Clan XL engines only have 2 jutting out, need both torsos or CT.)

Unless the bay doors are open, the side-torsos usually blow out before the arms.

Edited by Stingz, 23 January 2013 - 06:42 PM.

[Kassatsu]

Najek Yuma, on 23 January 2013 - 07:32 AM, said:

Didn't realize I can't use a CASE in the arm. Would CASE prevent an ammo explosion in a side torso from getting to an XL engine? Or is it just better to run ammo in an arm, or ixnay the XL altogether?

Yes it would. CASE directs the explosion away from the mech, preventing any damage it would have otherwise caused. Does not actually protect the ammo from being hit or anything.

[Stingz]

Kassatsu, on 23 January 2013 - 06:23 PM, said:

Yes it would. CASE directs the explosion away from the mech, preventing any damage it would have otherwise caused. Does not actually protect the ammo from being hit or anything.

CASE means the explosion is limited to that area, it still wrecks anything in that area. "CASE does not actually stop the explosion, it merely contains and redirects the explosive force"- Sarna.Net

More useful on ammo-heavy Standard Engine mechs.

Edited by Stingz, 23 January 2013 - 06:46 PM.

[CECILOFS]

The OP's build is very similar to mine.

I take out all the heat sinks so you only have 20 DHS from the engine. That gives you 3 more tons. Drop the case (I put the ammo in my legs > CT > side torso) for another 0.5t and instead put on 2 more tons of LRM Ammo, the other AMS and a ton of AMS ammo.

The heat efficiency isn't great but I generally try to fire the LRMs in short bursts when I have guaranteed shots. I use the lasers to help out with focus fire if the enemy is close enough, or just to finish off anything that gets close. You can't shoot them often, but the alpha strike is decent.

IMO the dual AMS is worth it and the reason I bought this chassis. It makes you immune to LRM-5 and helps your team when they are near you. It allows you to win against almost any other LRM mech 1v1 if it comes down to it.

8 tons of ammo is plenty. I will usually fire a few volleys from extreme range if there is a good opportunity, but since ECM LRMs really shine at 200-500 meters when you can catch your target in the open and use Tag to get a lock if they have ECM. This also means you will be with your team, or close by behind them.

Fun mech but of course still vulnerable like all missile boats. I have had abysmal games with it but its really fun when you melt 4 of the opposing team and get 1000 damage

[Gnusber]

SO i have a build with 4 x 15 LRMs 2 x ER Large Laser and beagle probe....dunno you can also switch to 3 x 20 Lrms an 2 ER large Laser....enough Ammo .... enough Power...only Heat is a small Problem but i can handle it

STK-5S

Edited by Gnusber, 24 January 2013 - 06:12 AM.

[Kingdok]

huh - I approach LRM support in a different fashion from true 'boating' it appears. My 5S runs a 300XL engine, for starters. it tops out at 62.9 with speed tweak, so I have no problems getting into position to support my team quickly. I also avoid the 'help slow down I'm only 40 kph!' syndrome when my team moves. I find that I can maintain the 200-500 meter optimum killing range fairly well.
Tag on-board is a must for targeting those Spiders, Ravens, and D-DC Atlas nightmares. With the 12 engine double sinks supported by the 300 engine, heat efficiency is pretty good in vigorous engagements. 3xLRM15 with Artemis, Beagle Active Probe, and the Target Decay module form the primary weapon system, and I have 5 Medium Lasers for emergencies. It is surprising how effective the lasers are when the light mechs come to circle dance the fat, slow, helpless missle frigate... The 300 engine allows for much better maneuvering and close-quarters aiming than they expect from a Stalker.
Oh - and the double AMS is definitely a survival advantage against other missle mechs. I can usually hurt them a lot more than they can hurt me.

All in all - this is currently one of my most effective team mechs. If I just want to break heads, I'll roll in the 5M (SRM30 with 3 Large Lasers) or my Atlas.

[Najek Yuma]

So I've now elited the 5S, and this is the loadout I ended up with:
STK-5S

I found the XL engine far too squishy. It felt like I'd die the moment a light or medium got through the main battle lines, so I dropped back to a standard 255. I've found 8 tons of LRM ammo to be sufficient for the ALRM 50 build. I'm not quite sold on artemis yet. The tighter grouping is nice, but I'm not sure if it's worth the 4 tons and 4 crits. I could drop the artemis and move up to 4xLRM15 as a direct swap. I'd lose some heat and ammo effeciency, and I did spend 1.2 million c-bills on the artemis system, so I'll probably just keep it.