62 replies to this topic

[Stormwolf]

Barbaric Soul, on 05 November 2011 - 05:50 AM, said:

I play with absolutely no honor. I will do every single dirty little trick I can to win. I will, in no particular order-

1) leg a mech
2) target a mechs weapons
3) use heat to target weapons to over-heat and shut down a enemy mech
4) shoot a mech that is shut down
5) shoot a mech that is knocked down
6) be part of a group of larger mechs ganging up on a single smaller mech
7) Strip and leg a mech and leave it, forcing that mechs teamates to play a "man down"
8) chain fire weapons to prevent my target from being able to get reticle on me and shoot me
9) do whatever it takes to win the fight

I play the role of a mercenary. There is no honor in being a mercenary. It's all about the money and winning.

1. It's nowhere stated that this is forbidden, a lot of Clan warriors do this in the novels
2. See 1
3. Clans also use flamers
4. I wouldn't shoot one before the pilot has a chance to get in
5. See 1
6. I'll never do this, it would demolish my honor.
7. Always go for the kill
8. That won't work in all games, lots of people chainfire
9. Fight to show that you're way more badass then anybody else.

I bet you're gonna love Clan Ghost Bear, those guys have a reputation for hating mercs and will probably drop any and honor rules.

Have fun!

[Stormwolf]

flessar, on 05 November 2011 - 05:55 AM, said:

Ill accept your challenge, and then procede to curb stomp you while your fellows watch, or ill dream im doing that as im throttling away from combat at full speed. but we can skip that detail

We will see...

[Reoh]

On my Honor, I'll strip your mechs and sell them for salvage on the black market.

[CGB IceNinja]

Hi stormwolf..would you be so kind as to expand on the different levels of honor 1-4. I haven`t played as a clanner in some time.. but remember when playing with CGB BTU in MW3 we followed the honor system, until our foe broke one of the rules, then things change really fast .

[CoffiNail]

stormwolf, on 05 November 2011 - 06:02 AM, said:

I bet you're gonna love Clan Ghost Bear, those guys have a reputation for hating mercs and will probably drop any and honor rules.

Have fun!

You beat me to that punch.

Honor level 2

[Jack Gallows]

Zellbrigen (Dueling)

Under the rules for ritual dueling, or zellbrigen, Clan players must declare a target for each of their dueling 'Mechs. A typical declaration might sound something like, "I am MechWarrior Seth of Clan Steel Viper. I pilot the sole Summoner in Alpha Star. I hereby invoke the ritual of zellbrigen and challenge the pilot of the Orion adorned with the unit designation eleven to a duel of warriors. In this solemn matter, let no one interfere!"

During a duel, no other Clan warrior may attack either of the dueling 'Mechs. If a third Inner Sphere unit interferes with a duel, the dueling Clan warrior may attack the interfering unit, provided that another Clan 'Mech has not already challenged the interloper to a duel. A duel ends when one combatant is destroyed, disabled or retreats from the battlefield.

At Honor Level 1, the Clan warrior upholds all the rules of dueling regardless of his opponent's actions.

At Honor Level 2, the Clan warrior follows the rules of dueling until the Inner Sphere side takes an action that violates the Clan honor code (a third party interfering, a unit involved in one duel firing on a 'Mech involved in another duel, and so on). If this happens, the duel immediately degenerates into a free-for-all. During the Weapon Attack Phase, if a player declares that his unit will fire on a target already involved in a duel, any Clan player whose declaration of zellbrigen follows the Inner Sphere player's declaration of a "dishonorable attack" may attack that Inner Sphere 'Mech without regard for honor rules.

At Honor Level 3, any infringement of Clan honor in the dueling rules renders the entire ritual of zellbrigen null and void, leaving the Clan 'Mechs free to attack any enemy unit without restraint for the remainder of the game.

At Honor Level 4, dueling rules do not apply.

Physical Attacks

Unlike the formal ritual of dueling, the Clans' dislike of physical attacks in 'Mech combat is an informal, if widespread, custom. No explanation has yet been given for this distaste, though some experts suspect that Nicholas Kerensky chose to encourage a long-range fighting style among the Clans.

At Honor Level 1, a Clan warrior never makes physical attacks in 'Mech combat.

At Honor Level 2, a Clan warrior may make a physical attack only if an enemy unit makes one first. During the Physical Attack Phase, if the Inner Sphere player declares a physical attack, any Clan unit whose declaration follows that violation of Clan honor may freely engage that 'Mech in physical combat.

At Honor Level 3, a single physical attack by an Inner Sphere 'Mech allows all Clan warriors to retaliate in kind against all enemy units for the remainder of the game.

At Honor Level 4, the taboo against physical attacks no longer applies.

Retreat

Clan MechWarriors despise their Inner Sphere counterparts because they consider Inner Sphere armies dishonorable warriors fighting in inferior 'Mechs. Therefore, Clan warriors consider retreating from Inner Sphere opponents a disgrace almost beyond redemption. When allowed to choose whether or not to flee a losing battle, many Clan warriors prefer to fight to the death.

At Honor Level 1, a Clan warrior never retreats.

At Honor Level 2, Clan warriors may retreat from enemy 'Mechs that are using advanced technology, but never from 'Mechs, armor or infantry units using 3025 (Level 1) technology.

At Honor Level 3, Clan warriors may retreat from any vintage of enemy 'Mech, but will not retreat from armor or infantry units.

At Honor Level 4, Clan warriors may retreat at will.

(excerpted from First Strike!)

All credit goes to the original creator, used without permission.

Edited by Jack Gallows, 05 November 2011 - 06:48 AM.

[Stormwolf]

That's a copy paste from one of the sourcebooks, I hope Herb isn't watching...

[Jack Gallows]

stormwolf, on 05 November 2011 - 06:44 AM, said:

That's a copy paste from one of the sourcebooks, I hope Herb isn't watching...

Was working on digging up the originator, not my work in the slightest.

[CoffiNail]

I hardly doubt they will get upset over information that has been copied and pasted on many a website Plus First Strike iirc is FASA material

[Phades]

Jack Gallows, on 05 November 2011 - 06:37 AM, said:

Under the rules for ritual dueling, or zellbrigen, Clan players must declare a target for each of their dueling 'Mechs. A typical declaration might sound something like, "I am MechWarrior Seth of Clan Steel Viper. I pilot the sole Summoner in Alpha Star. I hereby invoke the ritual of zellbrigen and challenge the pilot of the Orion adorned with the unit designation eleven to a duel of warriors. In this solemn matter, let no one interfere!"

Orion is about to get his **** whooped barring pilot error. IMHO

Those descriptions should have been part of the first post. You can't expect everyone to just automatically know these things.

[Jack Gallows]

CoffiNail, on 05 November 2011 - 06:49 AM, said:

I hardly doubt they will get upset over information that has been copied and pasted on many a website Plus First Strike iirc is FASA material

It is, meaning the copyrights are probably null and void. I also don't see any of the companies that might still be involved getting upset that one of their fans takes a page of info and makes it available to people who don't have a book from 1996.

Phades, on 05 November 2011 - 06:50 AM, said:

Orion is about to get his **** whooped barring pilot error. IMHO

Those descriptions should have been part of the first post. You can't expect everyone to just automatically know these things.

They can always be edited into the first page. Also, Lol @ Steel Viper if the Orion gets a head shot. Part of combat is luck and skill, advanced tech gives the Viper the advantage but is it enough? That Inner Sphere warrior is piloting Papa Kerensky's mech

Edited by Jack Gallows, 05 November 2011 - 06:53 AM.

[Adridos]

Phades, on 05 November 2011 - 06:50 AM, said:

Orion is about to get his **** whooped barring pilot error. IMHO

Those descriptions should have been part of the first post. You can't expect everyone to just automatically know these things.

I already said that to the Stromwolf and he said it was intentional.

[Stormwolf]

Yes, I wanted to know who had already digged into the Clans to join for the background fluff and who just wanted better toys.

[Jack Gallows]

Not a bad reason, but I'd say there's going to be new players who don't know the fluff but would like to, that are interested in the Clans. Some might go "wtfbbq wantz teh mech!" but I'm betting with this community, you might get a lot that just like the way the Clans work over the IS.

[flessar]

Jack Gallows, on 05 November 2011 - 07:01 AM, said:

Not a bad reason, but I'd say there's going to be new players who don't know the fluff but would like to, that are interested in the Clans. Some might go "wtfbbq wantz teh mech!" but I'm betting with this community, you might get a lot that just like the way the Clans work over the IS.

You vastly underestimate the power of stupid. prepare for your star to be infiltrated by the wtfbbqmadzcatzomglolzcatonfireherpderp types. And as a result, prepare to team frag every one of them every match making my job of running away before you catch me in my trash can a whole lot easier

[Adridos]

flessar, on 05 November 2011 - 07:09 AM, said:

You vastly underestimate the power of stupid. prepare for your star to be infiltrated by the wtfbbqmadzcatzomglolzcatonfireherpderp types. And as a result, prepare to team frag every one of them every match making my job of running away before you catch me in my trash can a whole lot easier

You really love Urbie. But it was said in his thread, that with slight redesigns devellopers have made, its possibel it will be walkingg recycle bin.

[Kargush]

stormwolf, on 05 November 2011 - 05:50 AM, said:

Likely, it's no surprise that many Clans told their warriors that they can refuse challenges since there'll be fowl play involved.
But I'd most definately adhere to level 1 or 2 rules when fighting against 3025 tech mechs.

I see what you did there.

[IS Wolf]

Amechwarrior, on 05 November 2011 - 05:54 AM, said:

In terms of Clan Honor, really only rule 6 breaks the Honor code. Everything else is fine, or even encouraged as thinking outside the box in combat but technically legal. Rule 7 only means something in PC games where the player could respawn.

Actually 4 and 5 are only legal conditionally.
If it is a mech that has not engaged in combat, and has not been challenged, then it is a violation of Zellbrigen.

Same with 5. An opponent must be allowed to regain his feet, either that or you offer him Hegira/the chance to surrender, if the latter two are refused, than and only then is one allowed to fire upon them, without being in breach of Zellbrigen.

Rule 9, could be seen in light of melee combat. Which is discouraged, and only DFA's are allowed in case of the destruction of all other weapons.

Anyway, rule 6. The ganging up? Perfectly fine, if the other party has violated Zellbrigen already.
Least that is how we Wolves do it.

You want to play nice, then we play nice. You want to fight dirty? Well, you just picked the wrong Clan to tick off.

As for which level of honour level I abide with. Mix of Level 2 and 3, bit dependent upon the reputation of my opponent. Good rep? Then level 2. If on the other hand, they are say Capellans? Level 3. Wobblies?T

They are like the Not Named Clan. Kill On Sight.

Edited by IS-Wolf, 05 November 2011 - 07:32 AM.

[Aethon]

It would depend on my opponents. Level 2 in Clan trials of any size, level 3 against the more honorable IS units (Archer's Avengers, Knights of the Inner Sphere, Kuritan units), and level 4 against all others. Level 1 is for idealists, IMHO.

When in Rome...

[taxman]

I thought long and hard before responding to this thread.

In light of the current timeline then one would have to adhere strictly to Zellbrigen

The Clans are a warrior-dominated culture, stressing honor in combat. Nearly all important political positions are occupied by warriors and often require trials of combat.

Clan warriors abide by a code of honor called Zellbrigen, which is comparable to chivalry or bushido.
Zellbrigen emphasizes fair combat between opponents and never "ganging up" on outnumbered or outgunned enemies. It is common for commanding officers of opposing Clans to send each other data on all their warriors before a battle. Targeting civilians, resources, or infrastructure is forbidden. Certain weapons, such as land mines or stealth-equipped Battlemechs, are also considered dishonorable. Zellbrigen was created in the early days of the Clans, when resources on newly-colonized planets were scarce. By structuring combat, the Clans aimed to minimize the death and destruction of warfare and avoiding the waste of lives and resources.

The Clans' adherence to Zellbrigen put them at a disadvantage when invading the Inner Sphere, whose warriors did not abide by such codes. Despite the Clans' superior military technology, the Inner Sphere's "dishonorable" tactics ultimately led to the invasion's failure. After the invasion, some Clans decided that Inner Sphere warriors should not be fought according to Zellbrigen.

http://en.wikipedia....ans_(BattleTech)

We have no choice in this as not to adhere to Zellbrigen would bring dishonor and shame to the pilot.

However I would add a note of caution here.

If we are able to play as Clan then I expect that the weaponry and Mechs would be of a much superior construction and able to deliver heavier damage than an IS counterpart.

I expect that on a normal drop a Batchall would be issued:-

Batchall

Ritual by whichClan] warriors issue combat challenges. Though the type and phrasing of the challenge varies, most begin with the challenger identifying himself, stating the prize of the contest, and requesting that the defender identify the forces at his disposal. All batchalls are closed and final when the phrase "bargained well and done" is spoken by both members of the bid. [/color]



I would expect that the Clan lead attack would Never outnumber the opposing force,

If they did so then the right of Zellbrigen would be offered to the opponents

Please do not confuse Honor with Headshot kills or Legging.



The ritual fighting of Zellbrigen State that you must not run away from the battle

You cannot hide from your opponent and you cannot move outside of your weapons range.



If any of the opponents interfered then the rest of the attacking unit would be free to engaged and no mercy would be shown.



As a Clansman you would not leave the battle field unless you were Victorious , dead or captive.


This would have to be the way the Clans play this game it is dictated by Canon and Lore.



~S~

Edited by taxman, 05 November 2011 - 08:05 AM.