60 replies to this topic

[blinkin]

bump

[Ivory Spider]

as it stands I really dislike lasers, I prefer weapons I can fire and either hit for full damage or miss for no damage. Having to track the opponent seems pointless if they are a heavy or assault since you'd prettymuch be guarabteed the hit anyways and against the lights it would be just a huge pain, especially if your an assault and they're just circle of deathing you (you'd never hit with this system then). Now that ECM's are in and they wreak such havoc on any targetting weapon (LRM's and SSRM's) I don't feel the SSRM's are so powerful anymore as they used to be. I for one much prefer the current SSRM rules as they are a nice reprieve from chasing people with my lasers.

[Ivory Spider]

oh and i forgot the AMS in game aswell. There are two defenses against missiles already implemented in game, I truly don't believe my poor aim should be one of them.

[Yiazmat]

I like it. Devs, pay attention.

[Rauchsauger]

Also this would remove light mech deterrent though SSRM on Assaults.
(3x SSRM on my DDC turned them lights away real good)

[blinkin]

Ivory Spider, on 10 February 2013 - 11:05 PM, said:

oh and i forgot the AMS in game aswell. There are two defenses against missiles already implemented in game, I truly don't believe my poor aim should be one of them.

do you really think AMS counts? you bring up some valid points, but i really don't think AMS is among them.

when AMS kills a missile you can see it pop in the air. i very rarely see streaks or srm stopped by AMS. i run a catapult c4 with 4xsrm6+artemis. i would have noticed by now if any of my missiles were being blocked.

as far as ECM is concerned: i listed how ECM would be reworked for this new system. it does not jam them entirely anymore. it would instead randomly disrupt guidance for very brief periods (maybe 0.1 seconds at most), but it would take effect about 3 times every 2 seconds.

this also means that light mechs using streak 6 (when they are implemented) will have to work harder to put all or most of that damage into an enemy. they would be forced to keep that enemy in their crosshairs consistently while the missiles were in flight.

instead of just run by acquire lock fire and leave. with streak 6 that is 15 damage into an enemy mech for very little work or risk. even streak 2 hits for 5 with very little effort or skill.

[CancR]

Doesn't fix what is truely wrong with streaks.

Damage needs to be 2 and not 2.5
Streaks need to spread far more then they do now
Streaks need to find a balance between getting a target lock, and still needing needing skill to use (IE: A little longer to lock on, losing the lock if the middle circle isn't over the mech.)

[Stringburka]

This is a blinkin' good idea. Love it.

[blinkin]

CancR, on 11 February 2013 - 09:37 AM, said:

Doesn't fix what is truely wrong with streaks.

Damage needs to be 2 and not 2.5
Streaks need to spread far more then they do now

• streaks will stream out of launchers one at a time (becomes more important when streak 4 and 6 are added)
  
• while in flight streaks will head directly towards the crosshair no matter what it is pointed at, even if it moves (this will take away the 100% accuracy)

Streaks need to find a balance between getting a target lock, and still needing needing skill to use (IE: A little longer to lock on, losing the lock if the middle circle isn't over the mech.)

• streaks will only launch if the crosshair is over an enemy mech component
  
• while in flight streaks will head directly towards the crosshair no matter what it is pointed at, even if it moves (this will take away the 100% accuracy)

OMG READ... SOMETHING.

the only gripe you list there that this does not directly address is the damage level. we get it you want pilots with streaks to spend 90% of their time trying to lock targets so that they never get to fire. i am trying to go for something that is fun to use and can be perfected with skill.

if you do not like my solutions then fine whatever, but don't pretend i just ignored those issues.

Edited by blinkin, 11 February 2013 - 11:42 AM.

[blinkin]

added links to other good streak ideas into the main post.

[blinkin]

bump

[blinkin]

bump

i just quit playing today because everybody's favorite ECM/streak raven beat me in several matches while i was trying to play a jenner.

the pilots were not good they just slowly ran in circles and let loose a steady stream of streaks. for all of their efforts it would not take much to convince me that most of these streak ravens are bots.

before i thought streaks were ok, (boring but ok), and in any non light vs. light encounter i think they are balanced. today has convinced me very thoroughly that something needs to be done about streaks on light mechs.

[blinkin]

bump

[Torquemada]

Like this idea, have actually post a similar idea myself today. Essentially making SSRM's use more skill is something that seems to be required, so whatever the solution, it should involve the use of good piloting to make use of SSRM's as with other weapons.

http://mwomercs.com/...tive-mechanism/

Edited by Torquemada, 27 February 2013 - 04:52 AM.

[blinkin]

Torquemada, on 27 February 2013 - 04:51 AM, said:

Like this idea, have actually post a similar idea myself today. Essentially making SSRM's use more skill is something that seems to be required, so whatever the solution, it should involve the use of good piloting to make use of SSRM's as with other weapons.

http://mwomercs.com/...tive-mechanism/

agreed

[Bobzilla]

blinkin, on 20 February 2013 - 01:16 PM, said:

bump

i just quit playing today because everybody's favorite ECM/streak raven beat me in several matches while i was trying to play a jenner.

the pilots were not good they just slowly ran in circles and let loose a steady stream of streaks. for all of their efforts it would not take much to convince me that most of these streak ravens are bots.

before i thought streaks were ok, (boring but ok), and in any non light vs. light encounter i think they are balanced. today has convinced me very thoroughly that something needs to be done about streaks on light mechs.

Theres the problems right there, it isn't the SSRM its the ECM light that can use streaks. While i agree that this is a huge problem as no other lights can do anything about it (can't out run, or out damage), nerfing a weapon that works well in every other aplication is wrong to do. You rarely see SSRM cats anymore because they aren't affective as they can't carry ECM and can be ran from if you can't out damage it.

The best suggestion i've seen for this is to have ECM carriers, unable to use guided weapons on enemies in their own ECM radius. This way LRM's can still be used but you eliminate the ECM/SSRM trouble. Even this is not perfect as the DDC won't be able to use SSRMS which is useful for a slow assult.

[focuspark]

Bobzilla, on 27 February 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

Theres the problems right there, it isn't the SSRM its the ECM light that can use streaks. While i agree that this is a huge problem as no other lights can do anything about it (can't out run, or out damage), nerfing a weapon that works well in every other aplication is wrong to do. You rarely see SSRM cats anymore because they aren't affective as they can't carry ECM and can be ran from if you can't out damage it.

The best suggestion i've seen for this is to have ECM carriers, unable to use guided weapons on enemies in their own ECM radius. This way LRM's can still be used but you eliminate the ECM/SSRM trouble. Even this is not perfect as the DDC won't be able to use SSRMS which is useful for a slow assult.

SSRM are broken, ECM just multiplies the effect.

SSRM + 360 module + target retention allows for firing out of your ***. That's completely broken.

[Bobzilla]

focuspark, on 27 February 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

SSRM are broken, ECM just multiplies the effect.

SSRM + 360 module + target retention allows for firing out of your ***. That's completely broken.

How often does this happen to you? I've seen some weird angles but not shooting out of an ***, then again im not checkin that out much myself. And i agree they travel a bit crazy at times, but they do also fire and don't track sometimes. This seems like more of a tweek to me, not a complete change to the streak.

I would agree with the 'guided' suggestion but a light up close will be moving faster than most mechs that would want to take SSRMs to defend themselves against faster lights (esp if the launchers aren't in your arms). You can already time your shots with SRM's. A close light will cause the guided missle to only fly for such a small amount that it would have to be timmed as pretty much a straight shot anyways.

[focuspark]

Bobzilla, on 27 February 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

How often does this happen to you? I've seen some weird angles but not shooting out of an ***, then again im not checkin that out much myself. And i agree they travel a bit crazy at times, but they do also fire and don't track sometimes. This seems like more of a tweek to me, not a complete change to the streak.

I would agree with the 'guided' suggestion but a light up close will be moving faster than most mechs that would want to take SSRMs to defend themselves against faster lights (esp if the launchers aren't in your arms). You can already time your shots with SRM's. A close light will cause the guided missle to only fly for such a small amount that it would have to be timmed as pretty much a straight shot anyways.

You miss my point... I don't need to aim in my COM-2D. I just need to stay away from the enemy mech's front angle. He doesn't need to be in mine either - making this very easy. I just torso twist like a maniac while holding down <A> at full speed and it's gave over. I have a lock on, my shots always connect, theirs cannot, and if **** goes sideways I turn on ECM and run for it.

Then entire mechanic is broken. Not to mention the real problem IMO: I can lock on from 800m away and close in for the kill, I don't need to think - just hold down MOUSE_1 because my SSRM will only fire if in range. This is brainless, no skill mode - and once you put a decent pilot in control it just ruins the game.

There's balanced counter. Yes, I die in matches but I've moved by KDR too far too fast doing this. That means a lot of people are suffering my exploitation of the mechanics. AND YES, I'm exploiting them as a form of civil disobedience / protest.

[blinkin]

Bobzilla, on 27 February 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

Theres the problems right there, it isn't the SSRM its the ECM light that can use streaks. While i agree that this is a huge problem as no other lights can do anything about it (can't out run, or out damage), nerfing a weapon that works well in every other aplication is wrong to do. You rarely see SSRM cats anymore because they aren't affective as they can't carry ECM and can be ran from if you can't out damage it.

The best suggestion i've seen for this is to have ECM carriers, unable to use guided weapons on enemies in their own ECM radius. This way LRM's can still be used but you eliminate the ECM/SSRM trouble. Even this is not perfect as the DDC won't be able to use SSRMS which is useful for a slow assult.

these problems were there long before ECM made an appearance. before the raven, jenner JR7 - D ruled the field. the problem with streaks is that in light vs. light combat the mech with more streak launchers almost always wins.

if the only thing that beats streaks is other streaks then the system is broken. if this game had no light mechs with missile hardpoints then i would say streaks are balanced, but as long as light mechs are allowed to equip them then fights between light mech variants cannot be fair under the current system. ECM just shifts the advantage from all light mechs with streaks more towards only mechs with ECM and streaks. regardless of who has the streak advantage ATM my jenners that use only energy weapons get screwed.