51 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Phalanx100bc, on 31 January 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

My favorite response to these people is....."Have fun dying alone...."

I prefer, "Good Luck with that!"

[Dimento Graven]

I team a lot, I pug a lot, somewhere near 50/50 I think.

First here's a question:

When I'm playing as a PUG, if I get between 4 and 8 of the enemy in front of me, do all the targets that are in my forward facing show up on my team's targeting? I know on my minimap they're there, but is that information being relayed to the rest of the team.

I'll leave the question at that, and wait for a response, because there's a point to be made later.

[Bfvmg]

Like a Sir, on 30 January 2013 - 04:42 PM, said:

Don't usually bother to give orders in 4 mans, but at the start of the match, before the counter runs out. We will decide which way we are going. Then I drop a line like this "4 of us taking 3 line to upper city, feel free to join" More often then not, the majority of the pugs will gladly follow us and shoot at the enemy...

Typically what we do, too.
Doesn't always work, but at least we try.

[Critical Fumble]

Dimento Graven, on 31 January 2013 - 07:54 AM, said:

I team a lot, I pug a lot, somewhere near 50/50 I think.

First here's a question:

When I'm playing as a PUG, if I get between 4 and 8 of the enemy in front of me, do all the targets that are in my forward facing show up on my team's targeting? I know on my minimap they're there, but is that information being relayed to the rest of the team.

I'll leave the question at that, and wait for a response, because there's a point to be made later.

Everything within the spotting buff versus ECM range in your direct LOS shows up on your minimap, the only relayed target is the one you "R" target.

[Bfvmg]

Dimento Graven, on 31 January 2013 - 07:54 AM, said:

I team a lot, I pug a lot, somewhere near 50/50 I think.

First here's a question:

When I'm playing as a PUG, if I get between 4 and 8 of the enemy in front of me, do all the targets that are in my forward facing show up on my team's targeting? I know on my minimap they're there, but is that information being relayed to the rest of the team.

I'll leave the question at that, and wait for a response, because there's a point to be made later.

I don't think so. You have to "Target" them (Hit the R key, or what every key you mapped it to)
When you target the enemy, it shows up on friendly scopes and they can also target and get a lock for LRM's Otherwise they cannot see it. And when you rapidly Target, re-target, re-target (etc) you cycle through all the targets so LRMs cannot lock on and fire.

I think though, that the enemy will show on the minimap...

[MaddMaxx]

Psikez, on 30 January 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

Don't take LRM80s with no defense weapons pubz

So according to yourself, no one should ever drive an Cat A1 unless on a Team of Elite Mech Pilots who can deal with it?

Does that sound about right?

Pleeeease...

[Joseph Mallan]

MaddMaxx, on 31 January 2013 - 08:13 AM, said:

So according to yourself, no one should ever drive an Cat A1 unless on a Team of Elite Mech Pilots who can deal with it?

Does that sound about right?

Pleeeease...

it was actually sound doctrine to follow. You don't want to put all your eggs in one basket,That holds true for PUGs and Premades. It's just a bad idea.

[Dimento Graven]

Bfvmg, on 31 January 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

I don't think so. You have to "Target" them (Hit the R key, or what every key you mapped it to)
When you target the enemy, it shows up on friendly scopes and they can also target and get a lock for LRM's Otherwise they cannot see it. And when you rapidly Target, re-target, re-target (etc) you cycle through all the targets so LRMs cannot lock on and fire.

I think though, that the enemy will show on the minimap...

Right ok, so here's the deal. For a while, while I was PUG'ing, I'd join a group and using my nifty Logitech G19 Keyboard macro feature have the following:

G10 - t I will run around the enemy, and will push through straight to their cap point. Trust me, this will be fun!
G11 - t I'll do a few laps around their CAP, then proceed to shoot as many people in the *** as possible.
G12 - t When you see the CAP message, push forward, there will soon be many 'mechs with backs turned to you.

Now, normally when I'm pre-made, this strategy works VERY well, it probably has an 80% success rate if not higher. I don't even have to say anything anymore, my pre-made team just waits for the CAP message, and sure enough, I'll have somewhere between 4 and 6 'mechs all trying to kill me, no enemies are even looking for the rest of my team, and my team does a focus fire routine quickly kiling 2 or 3 'mechs before the enemy even has figured out what's up.

When I pug, the people on the other side either argue about the strategy and not push at the appropriate time, or, ignore me and not push at all, or they actually try and follow the strategy but they push only ONE AT A TIME instead of line abreast, so that by the time 2 of the PUGs group are in the battle pushing, the enemy has figured out what's up and responds accordingly (although not ideal, those can be really fun fights though truth be told, as you can have 16 'mechs duking it out fairly quickly).

The issue I have with some PUGs is that they don't communicate their strategy, mostly it seems because they intend to Rambo the match.

Another problem with PUGs is a few of them don't know all the mechanics of this game. For instance, y'know those little triangles on your screen over the enemy 'mechs? Did you know that the SOLID triangles are the ones that some of your team mates have targeted? It's a great way to focus fire without having to be told which 'mech to fire at. Look for the solid triangle, one of your team mates is aiming at that one.

Of course, contra-wise, when I'm pugging and NOT trying to direct strategy, but letting someone else do it, SOME VERY FEW TIMES, about 30 seconds to a minute into the match an apparent pre-made will say, "stay together"... Well hell fella, by that time I'm already halfway across the map. That LONG wait before the match, couldn't you have started strategizing, AND OH BY THE WAY, typing only 2 words DOES NOT convey a winning strategy. I'd be MORE APT to follow, "Stay together, let's move to quadrant X, if we get there and no enemy, move on to Y, if we run into enemy, focus fire on Z type first, then try to focus fire on same 'mechs." That sentance certainly conveys more information and a gives the impression of a more thought out strategy than, "stay together"...

Edited by Dimento Graven, 31 January 2013 - 08:23 AM.

[Roadbuster]

Pugging can be fun and frustrating. This doesn't involve death or win/loss. It's just about the players and how they work together.

I usually keep an eye on our back and sides to call out flankers. I also scout as good as I can with all mechs from light to assault.
The thing is, often you can tell your team all you want and they will ignore you. That's frustrating.
I gave up on telling the team where to move or what to do, because all you get for trying to get some teamplay are insults or people just ignore you.
Most of the time these situations end very quick when we get steamrolled by the opposing team.

On a side note...
HOW CAN THE WHOLE TEAM DIE IN 10-20 SECONDS AND NOT KILL A SINGLE OPPONENT???
Really, I don't get it. Sometimes I check the team status and see 8vs8 then I engage and a short time later (really a short time) I check again and see 5 of our team died.


But let's see what kind of pilots we might encounter out there:

The Rambo:
Also a classic one.
You all know the pilots bragging around and insulting everyone in global chat, then rushing out and die within the first 1-2 minutes.

The Lemming:
A bit different from Rambos but also quite disheartening.
They are quiet and move out together, but not to advance in a controlled manner. Instead they rush towards a certain point nobody except them can see. They often don't even know why they go where they go. All of them seem to follow eachother.
When they arrive at their destination alive the rest of the team is already dead or they never reach their destination if they meet the opponents on their way there.

The AKF:
A very annoying type of pilot. Usually they start a match and then go away to open the door, to call someone, to get some food,... or they just fall asleep. Often they pilot a heavy or assault mech.
Sometimes you can alert them by firing an AC near them or move up close and aim for their cockpit with a TAG laser...and some AC20.
Often they will come back or wake up only when they take damage. Either from the own team or from the opponent.

The Lurker:
This type of pilot will stay in the back and wait for his opportunity. They don't move much because if they can't see an opponent nobody can see them either.
They often die from LRM fire because "Incomming Missiles!" clearly can't be aimed at them. They don't see an opposing mech in their zoom view after all.

The Phantom:
They are special because they use ECM. Nobody can see them, nobody can hit them. They can move towards the opposing force without caring about LRMs or they can sneak up and tear things appart.
How should they know the opponent got ECM too and can counter theirs?!

The Gunman:
Armed to the teeth this fellow will bring death and destruction upon his opponents. They run highly specialized builds like 2 ER PPC Jenners, short range brawlers with LRM20 and PPC or long range snipers with SRMs. You'll never know what hit you.
Because they usually don't deal damage or overheat every 2nd shot.
LRMs spammed at targets 100m away, SRM/SSRM fired at targets 1000m away, 90% heat after 1 shot,...

I'm sure there are far more.

[Nahuris]

I do a lot of pugging.
Yes, I am a member of the Browncoats and Independents, and yes, I do have TS.
I have also been playing since Closed Beta --- but have only done about 130 games since it went open, and they wiped the stats.
Part of it is schedule, I have little time right now. Part of it is the annoyance I get in chat.... why? I like the Commando. I am a dedicated light support player. That doesn't necessarily mean LRM's... it means team support. I will take a Commando with standard SRM's and lasers, and I will follow one of my assault buddies. He gets back protection, and I have a good time. I have seen the death flower, and when it happens, I try to pick one of the assaults, and at least someone gets some cover.

Right now, because I rarely have time to play more than one game here and there, I don't bother setting up my headset and TS.....
Most of us Pug players would love to work with the other players...but since the assumption is that since we are not on "your" chat channel, we are obviously worthless noobs, and there's no reason to communicate with us..... why should we bother?
I've been called a noob pugger on many occasions, while chatting with some of my buddies on TS.....
I love laughing at it....

You want to fix pugs?
Start with a better new player tutorial.
Express some confidence in your teammates - some will disappoint you, that's the nature of online gaming, but many will also surprise you.
As has been stated, give a bit of direction if you are on a team..... designate a person to "pug herd" .... works best for sniper mechs to do so, as they get more time to type.
Note that support goes both ways.... cover the pug, and he'll have a better chance at learning to play better..... right now, most of the team players are using pugs as cannon fodder..... and then you expect them to risk to cover you..... short sighted, and makes me want to ask "who is the true *****?"
Finally, learn a little etiquette ..... calling people stupid noobs does little towards getting their respect, and even less towards getting their help. You want people to work with you, not look at your post and go "what an *****...screw him".

Nahuris

ok, so the word [redacted] is banned ---- it got starred out both times........
anyways, that was the word used, when you see the ***** up above.

Edited by Egomane, 02 February 2013 - 09:47 AM.
Do not circumvent the word filter

[Kiiyor]

Psikez, on 30 January 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

I call it the pugflower aka the deathbloom, when every single player runs in a different direction

LIKE THE DEATH BLOSSOM!



Actually, nothing like the death blossom.

I can however attest to the effectiveness of the death blossom in MWO. I often use it when surrounded and heavily damaged in my Awesome 9M laserboat, and have found that it is an amazingly viable tactic.

[Joseph Mallan]

You have to get a friend to video you doing that. It should be a killer vid... night map for best results!