379 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

BDU Havoc, on 01 February 2013 - 06:47 AM, said:

I just had a thought.


How about any player that's still earning a cadet bonus (and drops solo) gets matched against other players in the same situation.

This would probably be addressed with the inclusion of ELO. It IS a good suggestion, but how tough/easy/quick would it be to implement?

[Sifright]

Joseph Mallan, on 01 February 2013 - 06:52 AM, said:

This would probably be addressed with the inclusion of ELO. It IS a good suggestion, but how tough/easy/quick would it be to implement?

Based on how slowly anything is implemented it would appear the absolutely everything is a vast gigantic titanic task that requires the entire studio grind out the work at such a pace that once that one feature is done nothing else can be worked on for the month.

[Mercules]

Mycrus, on 01 February 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

during peak hours Comstar is filled with 4-mans...

they are 'social' enough to find 3-players, but not 'social' enough to play 8s...

common PUGstompers... answer my post

i dare you

Maybe they aren't "social" enough to put up with people that have your chest thumping attitude? I have a feeling if I had to deal with you on TS that option for turning someone's volume down would set you on MUTE.

I don't play with 3 other people because I want to win. I play with 3 other people because they are my friends and this is how we "hang out" in a modern world where many of us are at least 3 hours if not a couple days drive away from each other now. So if you really want to hear about how my daughter's gymnastic meet went last weekend and how proud I am that she is actually competing in some of the matches as a Sophmore then I'll happily jump into your highly competitive 8 man group and chatter right over your "focus fire on Delta". Maybe my friend will have a chance to hold up your 8 man for 15 minutes while he takes his dog out or my other friend can tell you about the messed up computer he was fixing earlier that day or the new girl he just met.

[dervishx5]

Rotaugen, on 01 February 2013 - 06:52 AM, said:

We know the other 8 mans will probably be teams that know how to work together, and we don't want to run in with one or two randoms at that point.

Yes, this is true I'd say about 90% of the time. My team, [NAMEWITHHELD], can usually tell who they're fighting against based on memory, and adjust our strategy accordingly. 8 mans are pretty much the domain of the teams formed from past Mechwarrior leagues right now.

[Ghogiel]

Roughneck45, on 01 February 2013 - 06:46 AM, said:

How much hand-holding do new players really need?

how much hand holding do premades need?

[Roughneck45]

Ghogiel, on 01 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

how much hand holding do premades need?

They dont need any. They just group up. All multiplayer games have groups. Why should they be removed from this?

I think a proper ELO system will help. When I pug, its a crapshoot what my teammates will be like. Some are ok, some barley seem like they have a pulse, let alone be able to aim at anything.

They didnt get rolled because of a premade, they got rolled because they are awful pilots.(not saying all pugs are bad, but its a 50/50 shot usually. Skillgaps in this game are huge.)

Call me selfish, but im not a fan of dead weight on my team.

Edited by Roughneck45, 01 February 2013 - 07:03 AM.

[Sifright]

dervishx5, on 01 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

Yes, this is true I'd say about 90% of the time. My team, [NAMEWITHHELD], can usually tell who they're fighting against based on memory, and adjust our strategy accordingly. 8 mans are pretty much the domain of the teams formed from past Mechwarrior leagues right now.

The real problem is people don't like having a challenge even random 8 people thrown together if they being lead competently can kill other 8 man teams. It doesn't happen though because people actively dislike challenges.

edit: that is people like the illusion of a challenge.

Edited by Sifright, 01 February 2013 - 07:00 AM.

[Logen Ninefingers]

Frostbeast, on 31 January 2013 - 09:40 PM, said:

Premades are there to destroy those maggots called pugs. Join us or rot in hell! Your tears is like ambrosia to me.
Today YOU and tomorrow the WORLD!

Schitler, ...Adolf Schitler, is that you? Please go back to your room and take your pills....

[Ace Kaller]

First of all, you can't eliminate 4-mans as long as 8-man is pretty broken, as it is now. If you run anything less than optimiszed 8-man (meaning DDCs and 3Ls, with one or two other mechs tossed in) you will lose. There needs to be some way to balance out the 8-man teams.

As to sync dropping, it's not as deliberate as you think. I played wednesday night during peak hours (between 7-midnight), and ran into the following:

1 - We at House Liao were running 2-3 4-mans on TS all night. Three times, my 4-man dropped with another House Liao 4-man on our team (and we were in seperate TS channels not coordinating), we dropped once against one of our other 4-mans, at least twice we dropped on a team and the other 4 players announced themselves as a 4-man in Team Chat, and twice we dropped with Goons (judging from the group squawking on our side). At no time did we try to corordinater any of this, it just flat out happened. So next time you grief people for sync dropping, remember, odds are they arent trying to do it.

2 - We always try to coordinate with our pugs as well. If we're running 3-line on River City, we call it out on team chat. When our recons spot the main enemy body, we call it out in team chat. These are basic things that EVERY team can do, pug or pre-made. Granted, the text chat is too wonky to coordinate properly to call out targets and such, and you will still lose to an overly well coordinated team, but it takes the edge off at least.

[Rotaugen]

dervishx5, on 01 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

Yes, this is true I'd say about 90% of the time. My team, [NAMEWITHHELD], can usually tell who they're fighting against based on memory, and adjust our strategy accordingly. 8 mans are pretty much the domain of the teams formed from past Mechwarrior leagues right now.

True, we've started recognizing names in 8 mans and realizing what sort of fight we are facing. It's actually a lot of fun when you chat to all after dying. It's just a small pool. We even join another group to form 8 mans, as we do that often enough to know each other and our styles. Our group is too small to consistantly get 8 on at the exact same time, so semi-merging with the other group seems to work. If they had limits for different TYPES of 8 man, it would help a lot in the fun factor. Maybe different parameters like 2 of each weight class, only 2 ECM, etc. But that would make the pool even smaller.

[dervishx5]

Sifright, on 01 February 2013 - 07:00 AM, said:

The real problem is people don't like having a challenge even random 8 people thrown together if they being lead competently can kill other 8 man teams. It doesn't happen though because people actively dislike challenges.

edit: that is people like the illusion of a challenge.

Oh they have fun, until they run across someone like us and lose horribly, then they seek reasons outside of their own strategy for why they lost. People want to win, and when they don't win, well then there must be something wrong with the game. They're not wrong, because obviously there are balance issues, but if people spent half the time they do on complaining and put that toward improving their tactics and strategy, they'd enjoy the game a lot more like we do, and have since the days of Mechwarrior 4.

[Mercules]

Ilwrath, on 01 February 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

Why do people bring up this silly argument again and again? There is no problem getting into a clan or guild or what you will call it in a game that supports it. Not teaming up is a choice we make.

Only teenagers have lots of close friends to game with. "Removed silly trolling"

Referee: Um sir, where is your sword?
Brawler: I'll use my fists.
Referee: But... this is a sword fight, all the other people are using swords, don't you want a sword?
Brawler: It's my choice to use my fists.
Referee: O-kaaaaay.

After the fight.
Brawler: We really need to put a stop to all these swords in this sword fighting.... pugilists are not having a good experience. You're average fighter isn't going to know where to get a sword or even want to.


Oh, and I am 43 and in Closed Beta we were making 8 man teams out of the guys that were at my friend's wedding. Teenagers are not the only ones that have gaming friends.

[Ghogiel]

Roughneck45, on 01 February 2013 - 06:58 AM, said:

They dont need any. They just group up. All multiplayer games have groups. Why should they be removed from this?

They shouldn't, and no one afaik has suggested to remove teams from the game. 4mans could go into the 8man queue OR 8mans could come back into the pug queque, as long as somebody is getting facerolled, it's all good.

[Joseph Mallan]

Sifright, on 01 February 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

Based on how slowly anything is implemented it would appear the absolutely everything is a vast gigantic titanic task that requires the entire studio grind out the work at such a pace that once that one feature is done nothing else can be worked on for the month.

Didn't I read that it took WoW 4 years to develop? Yeah I did read that. however I do understand you displeasure with how long it takes for things to get done.

[Sifright]

dervishx5, on 01 February 2013 - 07:04 AM, said:

Oh they have fun, until they run across someone like us and lose horribly, then they seek reasons outside of their own strategy for why they lost. People want to win, and when they don't win, well then there must be something wrong with the game. They're not wrong, because obviously there are balance issues, but if people spent half the time they do on complaining and put that toward improving their tactics and strategy, they'd enjoy the game a lot more like we do, and have since the days of Mechwarrior 4.

honestly the tactics and strategy for this game aren't particularly deep.

I think most of the players i've played with would benefit hugely just from spending time actually learning to aim properly.

I've been part of 8 man premades in the current system that just doesn't lose at all no matter what mechs are brough to to the field and it is mostly because the players are competent.

*waves at kong*

[sycocys]

Mercules, on 01 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

Maybe they aren't "social" enough to put up with people that have your chest thumping attitude? I have a feeling if I had to deal with you on TS that option for turning someone's volume down would set you on MUTE.

I don't play with 3 other people because I want to win. I play with 3 other people because they are my friends and this is how we "hang out" in a modern world where many of us are at least 3 hours if not a couple days drive away from each other now. So if you really want to hear about how my daughter's gymnastic meet went last weekend and how proud I am that she is actually competing in some of the matches as a Sophmore then I'll happily jump into your highly competitive 8 man group and chatter right over your "focus fire on Delta". Maybe my friend will have a chance to hold up your 8 man for 15 minutes while he takes his dog out or my other friend can tell you about the messed up computer he was fixing earlier that day or the new girl he just met.

While I don't really know personally any of the guys in my group, about 30 or so of us have gathered and this is exactly how much of the night is spent. 25% talk about aspects of the game and a lot a bs chatter about life and what we are up to. 4 man's allow us to keep the groups fluid and when someone needs to help their kids out with homework they can, or grab a phone call - whatever it might be, it's not an issue the rest of us/them can carry on playing.

Essentially we are a pug group with a little extra communication most of which has little to do with the match at hand. We win more often than not, but we also fair pretty well in straight pug drops when we do those.

[Sifright]

Joseph Mallan, on 01 February 2013 - 07:06 AM, said:

Didn't I read that it took WoW 4 years to develop? Yeah I did read that. however I do understand you displeasure with how long it takes for things to get done.

WoW also used a custom built game engine.

Most of the work in a modern game is the game engine its self.

if you don't have to build the engine from the ground up it takes vastly less time to have usable builds.

edit: Most of my sour grapes is because i'm just burning out on the current map list. we only have four maps at the moment and it's just getting boring to play them over and over and over again.

plus I really am kind of annoyed at how rubbish the communication tool in the game are. I literally never bother with them. the text in the matches also fades out after just a few seconds any way making typing pointless even if you do bother.

Edited by Sifright, 01 February 2013 - 07:11 AM.

[Mercules]

Sifright, on 01 February 2013 - 07:00 AM, said:

The real problem is people don't like having a challenge even random 8 people thrown together if they being lead competently can kill other 8 man teams. It doesn't happen though because people actively dislike challenges.

edit: that is people like the illusion of a challenge.

Wait... isn't it the argument that 4 organized people will stomp 8 random people every time? So now 8 random people are going to beat 8 organized people if lead competently? Hmmmmmmmm....

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Many players will never be good because they simply lack the skills to ... people with impaired vision, tunnel vision, limitations in intellect, coordination, perception due to age, illness, disability or predisposition, antisozioale mentally disturbed ... you ween those in the team do, you will lose more, some need to be first a few years older before they are even mature enough for such games .. with members who lose enemy fire nerves and turn the enemy run away back, ranges uDN damage generation simply uDN not understand, after 3 games still fire with a medium laser at targets at 1200 m, losing any overview of the action, or just blindly firing around here are definitely in the wrong game and should play either MW or TT tactics.

If you made after 30 games in a heavy Mech after 5 minutes of playing time is still less than 70 damage, you MWO should leave, because then this game is not for you, just

not everyone can MW, as well as in reality, not everyone has the potential to become soldiers or astronauts

translated from german

Viele Spieler werden nie gut werden ,da ihnen einfach dazu die Fähigkeiten fehlen ...Leute mit Sehstörungen,Tunnelblick , Einschränkungen in Intellekt ,Koordinationsfähigkeit, Auffassungsgabe aufgrund Alter,Krankheit,Veranlagung oder Behinderungen, antisozioale psychisch gestörte ...ween du solche im team hast ,wirst du immer verlieren ,manche müssen erstmal noch ein paar Jahre älter werden ,bevor sie überhaupt reif genug für solche Spiele sind..Mit Membern ,die im feindfeuer die Nerven verlieren und dem Feind im wegrennen den Rücken zudrehen, Reichweiten udn Schadenerzeugung einfach nicht verstehen ,udn nach 3 Spielen immer noch mit einem Medium Laser auf Ziele in 1200 m feuern , jeglichen Überblick über die Aktion verlieren oder nur noch blind umherfeuern sind hier definitiv im falschen spiel und sollten entweder MW tactics oder TT spielen.

Wenn du nach 30 Spielen in einem Heavy nach 5 Minuten Spielzeit immer noch weniger als 70 Damage gemacht hast ,solltest du MWO verlassen ,denn dann ist dieses kein Spiel für dich , genauso wenig

Nicht jeder kann ein MW werden , genauso wie in der Realität nicht jeder die Fähigkeit zum Soldaten oder Astronauten hat

[dervishx5]

Sifright, on 01 February 2013 - 07:07 AM, said:

honestly the tactics and strategy for this game aren't particularly deep.

I think most of the players i've played with would benefit hugely just from spending time actually learning to aim properly.

I've been part of 8 man premades in the current system that just doesn't lose at all no matter what mechs are brough to to the field and it is mostly because the players are competent.

Sure, but I'm talking from a premade 8 man vs. premade 8 man perspective, not pug vs. pre. Once you have 2 organized teams facing each other, the game gains a bit more finesse beyond being able to shoot well.