35 replies to this topic

[HeavyG]

Everybody is prefering 3L, also, to me it has great armory, 3xMlas + 2xSSRM i like. BUT, it doesnt have jump jets, and i love jump jets and speed. Would spider be better? Also, i dont have enough CBs to buy extra expensive engine to make him go 140+. Spiders come with fast engines.

So basically for me:

Spider 5D: +Faster with stock engine, jump jets
- No ECM

3L: + ECM, SSRMS
- Slower, far more expensive

What you think?

Thanks

Edited by HeavyG, 01 February 2013 - 11:23 AM.

[apostateCourier]

HeavyG, on 01 February 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

Everybody is prefering 3L, also, to me it has great armory, 3xMlas + 2xSSRM i like. BUT, it doesnt have jump jets, and i love jump jets and speed. Would spider be better? Also, i dont have enough CBs to buy extra expensive engine to make him go 140+. Spiders come with fast engines.

So basically for me:

Spider 5D: +Faster with stock engine, jump jets
- No ECM

3L: + ECM, SSRMS
- Slower, far more expensive

What you think?

Thanks

The cost isn't really a barrier, all it means is that you need to spend more time playing a game you already enjoy. Yes, it's crazy expensive to fully kit out. XL295 engine, endo steel, double heat sinks (it comes with ferro fibrous), yeah. It's expensive alright.

You get what you pay for.

[MasterBLB]

Jets suck hard since the nerf.
Spider has no hardpoints for streaks and has weak armor,as well as the lowest hard point number among any mechs.
Raven 3L has ECM,2 streaks and 3 lasers with a pretty good engine and maxed (238 points) armor.
End the story.

[Stingz]

Raven, sell off the XL 210 or save it for a Commando. It costs more to kit out, but still performs better.

[apostateCourier]

Stingz, on 01 February 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:

Raven, sell off the XL 210 or save it for a Commando. It costs more to kit out, but still performs better.

Commandos are terrible and if you buy one you should feel terrible.

[Boulangerie]

What engine should I save up for for my newly purchased 3L? It's mostly stock now.

[Kaeseblock]

Boulangerie, on 01 February 2013 - 05:58 PM, said:

What engine should I save up for for my newly purchased 3L? It's mostly stock now.

XL295

@Topic: Raven-3L > Spider
The Raven has more firepower (SSRM+ML), ECM and the aditional speed of the Spider is hardly relevant ( the Raven runs 136.5 kph with the XL295 - without speed tweak!)
In a some few occasions I wish the Raven had jump jets, but the Raven is still strictly better

[Dragonslayer Ornstein]

Raven if you want to be tryhard, and Spider if you want style and a challenge.

[Stingz]

apostateCourier, on 01 February 2013 - 04:01 PM, said:

Commandos are terrible and if you buy one you should feel terrible.

COM-2D, can mount x3 Streak-2 and ECM.

[ICEFANG13]

Raven-3L is the best light mech in game right now. 3 Mediums, 2 SSRM, ECM and 295 engine, 5 tons left for HS/Ammo

[1453 R]

You'll get/generate significantly less rage in the Spider than you will the Raven, and while jump jets in this game are bad at...well, jumping - I've still wished I had them more often than I figured I would. Either of those choices are, realistically, going to require an XL engine though - the Spider needs the extra weight to mount any kind of effective offense whatsoever. I've seen only one really good Spider pilot so far; he was using an ER large laser in the torso and a couple of mediums on the arm on top of the requisite ECM, managed to harass, flank, and whittle away at a base cap for nearly three minutes solo after the rest of us got our taints blown off. Went and put a similar configuration together in the 'Mechlab, and...well, either you do not have the maximum jumpjet count, or your armor is thinner than you'd like.

It's a whole lot easier for a 3L to threaten larger 'Mechs. Possibly why it's so much more despised than the Spiders are. Though I, for one, and at least halfway convinced the damn Cicadas are just as bad if, thankfully, far more overlooked.

[apostateCourier]

Stingz, on 01 February 2013 - 06:35 PM, said:

COM-2D, can mount x3 Streak-2 and ECM.

that doesn't stop them from being made of paper. Also, they can't stick their ECM in the center torso, which does actually matter. You also failed to mention that they only have one energy hardpoint, which means that they're incredibly ammo dependent- always carry more than you think you'll need, which just means you're going to die EVEN FASTER when your ammo goes up.

Metal babbys are terrible.

Edit: having run it through the Mechromancer, it turns out that you either have to use single heat sinks AND take a full ton of armor off, use a smaller engine (speed is life so that's out), or ditch the medium laser to get more than one ton of SSRM ammunition. That's... that's really really bad.

Edited by apostateCourier, 02 February 2013 - 03:45 AM.

[1453 R]

To be fair, Trollmandos shouldn't ever be sticking around a single fight long enough for heat to make a difference, even with singles. That said, I need to head on over to Smurfy now and check a few things...I'm suddenly curious how viable it'd be (configuration-wise, at least) to replace a couple of the Streak launchers and that laser on the typical Trollmando with an SRM-6 and associated ammo. Yeah, your ability to punt other lights in the jewels goes significantly down, but your ability to hit and fade against larger 'Mechs goes up just as much, and you're also no longer absolutely zonked in the face of local ECM superiority.

Or, possibly, mix it up. Dump the laser and one Streak launcher for an SRM4, give you decent abilities against lights and distracted non-lights whilst still retaining a weapon that can hit ECM machines for damage they might actually pay attention to. Hrmm...possibilities here, possibilities...

EDIT: Maybe something like this? LOLOLOLMando

It's..strange, what with no left-arm armor whatsoever and having had to shave points off of things I'd really rather not shave points off of - i.e. legs - but it's still got the 210XL and manages to shoehorn four extra tubes over the standard Trollmando in there. Obviously ammunition will be an issue in longer matches, but while you've got missiles to shot, you'll be doing considerably more damage to Atlas buttplates.

Possibility?

Edited by 1453 R, 02 February 2013 - 04:49 AM.

[apostateCourier]

1453 R, on 02 February 2013 - 04:42 AM, said:

To be fair, Trollmandos shouldn't ever be sticking around a single fight long enough for heat to make a difference, even with singles. That said, I need to head on over to Smurfy now and check a few things...I'm suddenly curious how viable it'd be (configuration-wise, at least) to replace a couple of the Streak launchers and that laser on the typical Trollmando with an SRM-6 and associated ammo. Yeah, your ability to punt other lights in the jewels goes significantly down, but your ability to hit and fade against larger 'Mechs goes up just as much, and you're also no longer absolutely zonked in the face of local ECM superiority.

Or, possibly, mix it up. Dump the laser and one Streak launcher for an SRM4, give you decent abilities against lights and distracted non-lights whilst still retaining a weapon that can hit ECM machines for damage they might actually pay attention to. Hrmm...possibilities here, possibilities...

EDIT: Maybe something like this? LOLOLOLMando

It's..strange, what with no left-arm armor whatsoever and having had to shave points off of things I'd really rather not shave points off of - i.e. legs - but it's still got the 210XL and manages to shoehorn four extra tubes over the standard Trollmando in there. Obviously ammunition will be an issue in longer matches, but while you've got missiles to shot, you'll be doing considerably more damage to Atlas buttplates.

Possibility?

Holy Jebus, that thing isn't even qualified to be called "made of paper." You won't need more ammo, because you'll almost certainly be dead before you get off 25 volleys of streaks and 16 volleys of SRM6s. If someone gets a bead on you for a second, you're dead. That thing is horrendous.

Side note, as to the single heat sink thing- it's more the full ton of armor you have to strip off of an already fragile machine.

Edited by apostateCourier, 02 February 2013 - 05:00 AM.

[Regrets]

Are you a new player? If so, my vote is to go 3L. I run a ECMando and it is quite delicate. Definitely do not recommend Spider for a noob, you will get one shot quite often. This is my ECMando build.

@1453 R you are short a couple heatsinks. I have made the same mistake in here.

[1453 R]

Ugh. I feel dumber than an entire herd of oxen - I completely spaced endo steel, double heat sinks, and all the other upgrades. Gawd, disgraceful >_<

Okay...once more, without being a giant putz: SRS BSNS LOLMando

All right. That one has doubles, endo steel and ferro-fibrous, and maxed armor on top of everything else. As well as a small laser for trolling with, because I had half a ton left and literally nothing else to do with it.

...right, then! Let's forget that last post of mine existed, shall we? Pwease. I'ww be youw best fwiend? o_o

[Regrets]

nods

[apostateCourier]

Just one thing- why the insistence on piloting Commandos over the Raven?

[Xenroth]

Take the 3L it is the stronges lightmech/scout ingame for the moment. You beat every ECM Commando because you have more armor and you kill every other lightmech because you have the power of ECM+SSRMs

Edit: and by the way its not that slow at all with stock engine. Best is keep your money till you got the engine + the mech and have a lot of fun then!

Edited by Xenroth, 02 February 2013 - 05:40 AM.

[1453 R]

Courier: not insistence, just theorycrafting. I don't have any of these 'Mechs at the moment, and following the debate over in Tolkien's Craven thread, it seems that the Trollmando's big weakness is that it can't really do all that much against larger 'Mechs. It's a great scout hunter (or was prior to the Rise of the Cravens), but it's something of a nonfactor in larger fights. I know I don't tend to worry about Trollmandos in my Dragons unless it's down to just me and him.

And also, because the more folks I can convince to give Spiders and Commandos and such a shot, the less Cravens I'll be seeing out there giving the Raven chassis a bad name

Regrets: 'preciated. No, really, it is. >_>...