68 replies to this topic

[Redoxin]

Myandriss, on 10 February 2013 - 03:21 PM, said:

Several times now while running a match I've found myself killed with the message "Killed by Ammo Explosion"

The only problem is, the part of my mech being destroyed only houses 1 Medium Laser and 3 tons of Gauss Ammo. Now I AM running an XL engine in that particular build so I'm not sure if it's registering the XL destruction as an Ammo Explosion or not.

This is of course assuming I'm correct in that the paper doll for my mech during a match is right to left in orientation as it is in the Mech Lab.

As someone else wrote, if the Gauss in your arm explodes, the damage transfers to your side torso if your arm has less than 20 hitpoints that moment. Then it can destroy your XL and thereby your mech.

[Myandriss]

Okay, to those saying it's the Rifle, a little bit of clarification.

I'm running a Cataphract 2X. The Gauss Rifle is in my RIGHT Torso, the section of my body registering the death is my LEFT Torso.

All that's in my left torso is 3 tons of Gauss Ammo and a Medium laser. Meaning the Rifle had nothing to do with me dying nor the ammo explosion messsage.

That said, the comment about damage transfer made me recheck a few things, apparently I had some SRM ammo in my left arm for some reason. Very well could have been the cause. I've since fixed that. If the issue still arises though I'll post here.

Edited by Myandriss, 12 February 2013 - 12:04 AM.

[MAFH]

Redoxin, on 11 February 2013 - 05:43 PM, said:

Yeah obvously explosion of the Gauss rifle is called "ammo explosion" in the combat log. Or has anyone ever seen "gauss rifle explosion" appear? No reason to be confused here.
The gauss rifle explosion does 20 damage btw according to a dev post I read here.

Is it 20 Dmg in full, or 20 Dmg per Crit Slot? Should be last, if i recall correctly from TT. (I think in TT it was 15 per Critical Slot)

Edited by MAFH, 12 February 2013 - 02:59 AM.

[Konner Duko]

per base tt rules the location housing the gause rifle will take 20 points of internal damage. there will be a roll then to see if that damage causes any other components to break. this could be engine damage to any other component in the cit location be destroyed. in the case of gause ammo if that location took a crit the ammo in that slot was gone. but if the roll from the rifle going boom caused ammo ams, machinegun, srm, lrm ammo to go then the remainder in that tone of ammo would go off and thus continuining the chain reaction of you mech is not a giant walking fireworks show on the battlefield. remember the damage when it moves from arm to torso only effects internal structor. the outside armor does not get effected by the internal ammo explosion. that is really why ammo going off is so deadly. all case does is prevent the internal damage from moving from location of original explosion.

[Herr Vorragend]

Maybe it should be considered to lift up the gauss rifle's health a bit. It's a little bit too much of the si called glass-cannon. I would recommend that after testing it with different configurations on almost every available mechs

[caesar]

I was just running a K2 with only Guass Ammo, and was just killed by ammo explosion. Guass Ammo shouldn't be able to explode.

[Reavana]

Does the game have the explosion of the Guass Rifle itself labeled as an ammo explosion?

[Ari Dian]

As Reavana said. An explosion of the Gauss might be counted as an ammo explosion. It does at least for all triggering stuff for ammo explosions as well.

[Arcturious]

I have no idea why my engine explosion in a Commando got merged into a thread about guass rifles lol.

Still, this just happened to me a second time. So my issue is probably different:



You can very clearly see - damaged by SRM4, then torso was destroyed and I killed myself. Just like last time, the very last thing to hit me was an SRM4. Different map too, Forest Colony Snow.

Would love to get clarification if SRM's are supposed to blow up as they leave the tubes when you are in water. Not even fully submerged either. I was behind a stalker (20-30m away I guess?) who was armed with only LRM's and some lasers at the time, so the only SRM4's were mine (COM-2D with 3x SRM4's and an ML).

Edited by Arcturious, 14 February 2013 - 02:33 AM.

[Arcturious]

Aaaaannnndd again. Will submit bug report now. Twice could be co-incidence but third times the charm as they say.



I suppose by now I should know better than to use SRM's in a Commando lol.

[Arcturious]

Ok, so my response from the support team was as follows:

Quote

Missiles will explode when impacting water and SRMs are immediately active (whereas LRMs do not activate their warheads until 180m). All missiles can do splash damage, which is dependent on range to the explosion. So, if your SRM launcher is at water-level or underwater then they will explode before even leaving their tubes and your Mech will incur the full splash damage itself. This is as designed.

So I've been playing the game for over 6 months now and only suspected that was the case, wasn't really sure how it worked. So here's the conclusive proof that DON'T FIRE SRM'S UNDERWATER. Or even if you suspect it might impact on water.

So no bug, working as intended and I'll just have to adapt to remembering not to fire SRM's on any light mechs while in or near water

Edited by Arcturious, 15 February 2013 - 01:44 PM.

[GhostFacedNinja]

Kiskatona, on 11 February 2013 - 05:28 PM, said:

A gauss/ammo explosion will be applied directly to the internal structure and if that is destroyed the section is destroyed regardless of how much armour remains. But you shouldn't be taking crits until either the front or back armour on that location is gone and receive hits to an unarmoured location. Though I am fairly sure I have taken critical damage whilst still having armour on all parts, so I'm not sure if MWO adheres strictly to that.

No if I have it right. Then a critical hit will cause 2x normal weapon damage to internal components, regardless of the remaining armour. This in turn can cause an ammo/GC explosion even with remaining armour, which in turn will take out any internals left (including more ammo which also explodes), and the armour. And any additional damage transfers inwards to the next section. Given that a few tons of ammo will do several hundred damage this is usually a death sentence.
Although I'm not sure what exactly happens if you have ammo in an arm and case in that side torso. Does the case stop explosion damage from the arm entering the side torso? Or stop it leaving into the CT? Or none of the above?

GCs can be quite a liability, as the very low hit points means a crit from many different weapons can kill/explode it. But on the plus side the damage of a GC exploding is very small compared to ammo. Smurfy has it down as 20, that seems roughly right from what I've seen.

Long story short, always store ammo in the Left or Right torso, with case. In a non-light mech, legs can be okish as they are rarely shot, But if they are, the damage drops straight into the CT, bypassing the sides. And it will happen often enough to be annoying in my general experience.

I think there's been a few more ammo explosions since the last patch, but mainly due to increased accuracy from improved netcode.

Edited by GhostFacedNinja, 15 February 2013 - 09:01 PM.

[MasterGoa]

Well, it happened to me today as well.

GuassPult, fire a twin show and it bloew up my mech,
was facing the other mechs back, there where no other in the vicinity.
It happened in City, in the underpass. Fire a shot, blew up and the cause of
death was engine explosion but was Destroyd By was Ammo Explosion lolll

[BulletProofPanda]

Gauss rifle exploded today in my cicada 3m, apparently was killed by ammo explosion as my torso was taken out by the gauss what situated there and had XL engine. Though I had case, this should not have happened.

[Krzysztof z Bagien]

CASE only prevents explosion form spreading to other sections, but damage to the section it's installed in is applied as ussual. It means that when ammo/Gauss rifle explodes in, for example, letf torso, CASE will prevent any damage to center torso and left arm (though if LT is destroyed LA will fall off anyway). So putting CASE to LT/RT if you have XL engine is pointless.

[BulletProofPanda]

As far as I know, case should protect everything else in the same area http://www.sarna.net/wiki/CASE

Also: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Gauss_Rifle

[GrimDeath]

David PeachHill, on 17 February 2013 - 07:00 AM, said:

As far as I know, case should protect everything else in the same area http://www.sarna.net/wiki/CASE

Also: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Gauss_Rifle

Wrong. An ammo explosion(In game terms, a critical hit on a Gauss Rifle is equivalent to a 20-point ammo explosion.), destroys everything in that location. If any damage remains, it transfers to the next location towards the center. CASE prevents the transfer.

This bit on the wiki,

Quote

Some 'Mechs employ CASE in the section containing the Gauss Rifle to protect internal components in the event the weapon explodes.

is wrong. You are aware that wiki articles are fan made and edited?

[Flapdrol]

Case does indeed not protect the part it's in. That makes it pretty useless, especially with XL engines.

[sycocys]

What's this a mechanic that makes ammo heavy xl builds a risky maneuver? Say it isn't so.

To the op, I believe your gauss is registered as an ammo explosion currently, and GrimDeath is correct as far as how it works in MWO. Case only protects internals in adjacent sections, it's part of a balancing mechanism if it's not TT compliant (which I don't know one way or the other about exact TT rules).

[Lord of All]

I thought Gauss Ammo was inert?